To think that every time people want to talk about those on benefits

[chibi]

they should have to mention that most benefit claimants are actually working, and that due to crap wages or expensive housing or both most people recording benefits like hb ctc or whatever actually need them and no amount of pulling up by bootstraps or getting on ones bike is going to change that

I just feel that all of the fighting over who deserves the axe/who's most feckless/etc is distracting from the key point that surely there is something wrong here when a big chunk of your working population need wages topping up by the government in order to live

"Highly-paid private doctors having to do x number of free hours, top-end barristers having to take on x number of pro-bono cases a year etc."

Most private doctors do some NHS work anyway.

The issue with forcing people to do it is that if they dont want to, what sort of job are they going to do? Also, most criminal lawyers are not that well paid- it's the commercial lawyers that make the big bucks and they dont do the sort of work curretly covered by legal aid. The Jersey system I imagine only applies to criminal cases.

Also, you cant really force people to work for free. There's no legal framework to allow for it.

There is something wrong, when a hardworking family working 40 hours a week does not earn enough to cover their basic needs - a home to live in and food to eat.

The government is paying out huge amounts in housing benefit and it is crazy. It's time to crack down hard on fat cat landlords who are sitting pretty getting richer and richer receiving ridiculous £££'s for rents paid for from housing benefit. They have been allowed to buy up huge chunks of housing over the last 10-15 years causing over inflation to the housing market, charge massive rent and take advantage of low interest rates. We are told that market forces determine rent/sale prices but with more and more people needing housing benefit to pay these costs it is time for the government to cap the level of rents that can be charged in the UK. What are the landlords going to do about it? They will have to accept it or sell off their large portfolios.

Yes, thousands of properties will flood the market and send prices freefalling but this is what we need. A basic 3 bed semi round here is £1500 per month rent which is way above the average family's budget. We were fortunate enough to buy our house 14 years ago when prices were still at a realistic level. There is no way we could afford to buy the same house today even though our wages have increased. To quote our estate agent 'Only GP's or solicitors will be in the market to buy it'. It is by no means a luxury house - more bog standard 3 bed.

If the government wants an end to a benefit culture they MUST address the housing market in the UK. Why it was ever allowed to spiral like this astounds me. Our banks were throwing money at people not long ago and why is it that I and many other sensible people with no fancy business degrees could forsee that it would not be sustainable. Continous governments have got us into this mess. Thatcher sold or should I say gave most of the council housing stock away then Labour allowed the greedy money making from property to go on (How many labour ministers and mp's became very rich playing the housing game?) for years. Let's see what this government does next.

Excellent OP, chibi.

Needs to be said, possibly over and over again.

The lack of affordable public housing is the elephant in the room I think. In Hong Kong for example, the disparity in income between the richest and the poorest is way worse than the UK and the minimum wage (just introduced) is

Just to add that you can of course argue that public housing is just another means of subsidy by the state but I think in terms of personal motivation and how people see themselves, it's a preferable way of spending money.

As a tax payer, I'd rather pay tax to build affordable housing (at least there's then a house to show for it that can be used over a century or more) than just keep writing benefit cheques.

another ruse is to pretend their partner does not live with them and the woman is a single parent on her own in the house with children.

i do know of a woman who does this and claims more than she is entitled to.

also council properties are sub let which again is never addressed.

I know the situation with benefits is not black and white but there is dishonesty in some cases.