to want my 5 year old to look like a 5 year old?

[SlightlyJaded]

Ok I probably am BU
And I am definitely being a snob

But... Like most 5 year olds, my dd has appalling taste and would gladly dress head to toe in Barbie themed tops, age inappropriate 'fashion' skirts / leggings etc and the more logos and glitter the better...

Now, I am not suggesting that she be permanently kitted out in Boden, Little White Company and Baby Joules (not that I can, nor would, pay £45 for a cotton skirt) and I have relented on some things like vile Disney Princess PJ's, Tinkerbell vests and pants, Hello Kitty Jeans and the like BUT my problem is that it's really hard to talk her in to nice clothes, and she really likes to come shopping and be allowed to choose sometimes.

I know it's not the end of the world, but short of explaining the concept of chavvy to her thus rendering her a complete snob (not unlike her mother) I don't know the words to use to put her off.

I have tried to tell her that things are not suitable for her age and then been blind-sided by a 3 year old with pierced ears in a pink fake fur coat strolling past

And nowhere is safe! Supermarkets, Charity Shops - even M&S seem to be full of nylon rouched tops with fricking studs on them. Any suggestions, or should I just roll over and embrace an exclusively pink, lilac and silver nylon wardrobe...??

lucky - slutty to many people means lazy or grubby or slatternly. The sexual interpretation is quite a modern one. You call the shoes inappropriate, cupcakes called them slutty, I call them trash. The point is perhaps that the shoes are Not Good, the adjectives people use to agree on that is maybe beside the point?

My DD wears lelli kellis and I would laugh in the face of anyone who tried to decribe her as slutty.
The shoes are spangly but most are no more slutty than disney princess belle shoes.
She hasn't seem the adverts. She doesn't get the lipgloss thing inside.

She wears age appropriate clothes and dresses very well actually, usually Oilily, Catimini, Jottum, Escada - the scandinaviam or French clothes that tend to be traditionally cut and well made. She has some monsoon and a bit of Gap for everyday stuff but no logos and no mini skirts.

I tell her that she can't wear crap ( should she look at it) as it is usually cheap fabrics and I won't waste money on rubbish. She accepts that and tends to chose quite nice quality plain stuff now. But she has a penchant for sparkly shoes

I have to say that desribing a pair of flat, Mary Jane shoes, even if spangly, as slutty strikes me as bizarre. They may be loathed and decried as bad taste but slutty. can't agree with that at all

Sorry haven't time to read whole thread, will do so later, but I am militant about not allowing the sorts of clothes you describe. If any come in to the house as hand-me-downs or gifts they go straight out again to a charity shop, or end up in the dressing up box.
At the moment I get away with not taking dds shopping, but I know that will soon change. How about doing a bit of pre shopping research on the internet so you know what you're lookinjg for, then you can ask her to choose which she would like from a carefully vetted selection of lovely items.

I am terrible for saying that they don't have it in her size, but maybe buying a nice coat or shoes and saying that the nasty pink sparkly tart top sadly won't match her coat/shoes.
Are you anywhere near a Polarn O Pyret? It is impossible to buy tarty in there, and the stuff is really fun bright colours if she wants a fun fix.

Polarn O Pyret is in house of fraser.

Quite nice stuff. DD has a couple of bits from there

( but it can be a bit lentil weavy, like you have to go to the science museum and take home made tofu parcels in it...)

SteathamHillary....Slutty is a word which has powerful connotations in our society...were you not at a school or in a club where boys called certain girls sluts?

Where the very use of the word could relegate certain girls to untouchable status?

It's a disgusting word...I dont thing "titillate" has the same meaning or power.

The point is perhaps that the shoes are Not Good, the adjectives people use to agree on that is maybe beside the point?

I disagree, I think there is a huge difference between slutty (and I don't think that your other definitions particularly hold for a shoe - unless you feel they make the child look grubby?) and inappropriate. Slutty implies that the child looks ready and willing for sex when wearing these shoes - I don't think it is an adjective that should be applied to a child or children's things and I don't think it is possible for a 5 year old to be look like a slut, a whore, a slag or any other word of that type, whatever they are wearing.

Sorry, that first line was a quote!

That lelli kelli boot is completely vile. Just dreadful.

No, I do not think that they make a child look grubby or slutty. It wasn't my adjective. I was just saying that people interpret words in different ways and that slutty is not sexual to everyone.
I call them trashy - as I said - because to me they are rubbishy. Cheap looking and naff.

Actually I think that the point that the shoes are 'not good' may be up for debate.
I don't see anything wrong with them except an excess of sparkles.
DD is wearing them on my profile page and I don't think she looks awful or chavvy, let alone slutty.

But I agree wholeheartedly with your second paragraph.

ah.
x-posted lucky

Pag - you've said that your dd has the flat MJs. The Not Goods are really the heeled ones and the horror boots. In fact I was so dazzled by those, I didn't even see any flat ones . I don't think your DD looks awful, of course not. But I think as a brand they are horrid because the brand to me is so dominated by the heels/horrid grown up styles.

Fair enough

We get DDs in Trotters which only has the lame ones.

it doesn't usually annoy me - this anti- lelli kelli thing. But the unpleasant 'slutty' comments did grate.

TBH I was in M&S today and the big heeled shoes for DDs age were awful. But you don't tend to get vitriol about M&S high heels.
I think there is a level of venom related to the fact the Lelli kellis are expensive.
But that is another thread

Anyway .
I will leave as have to go wash DDs slutty gear for tomorrow

pagwatch - I think the sparkly trainers are gorgeous personally :) but then I thought my wedding dress secretly made me look like a disney princess and I have bought my 11 month old DD quite a bit of disney princess/fairy stuff already so I'm probably to be condemned as tasteless and trashy across the board.

God I have a 3 yo - and she's only just 3 - who's already like this.

Me and DH are quite horrified by it all, as we have tried to avoid the the whole Disney Princess, pink and girly girl thing.

TBH I think there is a middle ground than can be reached. I refuse to buy clothes that are skimpy, inappropriate, or impractical.

But you can get normal t-shirts with characters on (eg. hello kitty, snow-white, minnie mouse) which, although you might consider "chavvy", are appropriate for a small girl in that they are basically a sensible t-shirt with a children's character on. Same with leggings which are incredibly practical for kids, with or with glitter :)

So I let my DD wear these things because although they're not to my taste, they're her clothes so as long as they're practical she gets some say. I think that's fair.

The only thing I'm v stict on is shoes as I think it's important for kids to run around / climb without being hampered by impractical shoes. But I don't see the harm in a ridiculous pair of dressing up shoes for playing in /parties.

I would never describe a person, let alone a child as 'slutty', but would use it as shorthand for 'aiming to titillate' about high heeled shoes etc.

me and dd are very honest with each other.... she is quick to tell me something i like is 'disgusting mummy' and i tell her the same, we have some stuff i don't particularly like but really not much

kids shoes with high heels imo are slutty looking but the child could not be slutty iyswim sparkly lelli kellys are vile but thats just my opinion, they are not age inappropriate

I can see why the slutty comment upset but I think cupcakes explaine what she meant - I am 100% sure that nobody meant it in a sexual way. Or I wouldn't be defending them

Whilst I will draw the line at older styles on a young girl (think studded jacket or high heels) I do let one or two things on your list through.

My DD has a disney princess t-shirt with sparkles on it and TBH any kid over the age of 6 wouldn't want to wear it so it is age appropriate just a bit horrid. The pleasure it gives her is huge though. I can't see the harm in letting her have a little of what she likes. FWIW I wasn't allowed anything like that as a child, and my Mum with age and wisdom said to me recently that she regrets worrying so much about us looking right as it doesn't make a bit of difference in the long run.

just read pagwatch's post at M&S heels too. My DD was given a dressing up set aged 2-4 with heeled plastic shoes (4 pairs) as high as my own kitten heels. We took them back before she broke an ankle and she swapped them for dinosaurs . Heels at 2 is madness.

Sort of cross post with resistanceisfutile, if I had waited a mo I could have just agreed with you :)

Flat LK shoes with jeans and a white t-shirt are cute :)

I don't really like Disney/HSM/ITNG type clothing - but I'm not 5! I tend to buy nightwear or the odd t-shirt (for them, not me!). I wont buy anything that I think is inappropriate, but they do have some 'appropriate' clothing with a few more sparkles than I'd choose myself. Sometimes these items are 'in the wash' and sometimes for quite a while or worn for play groups etc....

' BUT my problem is that it's really hard to talk her in to nice clothes,'

umm she's 5 !!You don't have to 'talk' her into things at this age.You are the parent.You are supposed to be in charge, not her!

Sorry - had to watch the end of 'Shutter Island' and get it back to Blockbuster for 10!!

So thank you for the many suggestions, 'ooh I think these are dressing up', 'oh shame, they don't have this in your size' and the reverse psychology tactics are all excellent suggestions which I shall embark on with vigour :)

And to those who suggest that she shouldn't have an opinion at 5, I agree up to a point and many of her clothes are bought and presented as fait acompli, but at five little girls love to have the opportunity to choose sometimes so I do like to make her feel like she's grown up enough to made choices sometimes (but perhaps I don't, because I actually want her to make the same choice as me )

And just to throw my tuppence worth into the Lelli Kelli debate (seeing as I mentioned it in the first place), those boots are vile vile vile - as are anything with a heel for small children - but actually I blame the advertising campaigns and free 'make up' etc for my personal perception of the shoes which, had they been marketed in a different way, would not seem so devil-sent (well the trainers and mary-jane's anyway).

I still think it's a terrible shame that, broadly speaking, you pay more for clothes that are sans logo and glitter, and that there are very few shops you can walk into (unless you bloody loaded) and know that your DD isn't going to happen upon some lilac and silver nylon number with 'Cute' written in sequins...

oh and she does have plastic high heel disney princess dressing up shoes, but she is only allowed to teeter within the four walls of our house. Actually my DS 3, has taken a shine to these and can often be found in full Spiderman costume and snow white heels. And yet somehow on him, they look less alarming