To find it upsetting/strange when a close friend shows no interest in my children?

[Cortina]

I have a very close friend who is single and would very much like to find a partner and have children herself.

I have a son who is 6 and my close friend has shown no interest in him at all since he was born. Never bought a Birthday present or even acknowledged his existence really, it's bizarre. I try not to mention him too much when we see each other, as I know children are a sensitive point, but her attitude is beginning to bug me now.

It was his Birthday recently and I mentioned it briefly in an email She ignored the reference. I've been single when close friends have married and had children and I always put personal feelings aside and was happy for them and have taken an interest in their children.

She wants to meet someone, she's 40 but won't do anything to make this happen/increase her chances of this happening. I feel so frustrated with her sometimes. She's a wonderful person in every other respect.

I don't think I'd mind so much if she wasn't like a sister to me, our families are intertwined and have been all our lives. If she was just a friend I wouldn't mind so much at all I think.

It's that my child isn't even acknowledged by her, has never been, it's as if he doesn't exist and never has. I find that unsettling and I am increasingly struggling with my feelings. She's never mentioned him, not once, since he was born in hospital to now. I rarely mention him at all as the few times I have she's changed the subject. I am getting to the point now where I think why shouldn't I mention him even in passing?

I've been in her shoes and I was honestly pleased for my friends who had children. I would at least by able to tell me, if I was her, 'look to be honest I am struggling with you having a son. I am not interested you see and it's hard as I don't see myself every having children' or whatever the issue is. It's beginning to damage our friendship.

YANBU. I think she is unhappy and jealous of your happiness with your DP and your DS. I think she is envious of you and it hurts her to acknowledge your DS. Your family contrasts with her loneliness and she tries to block your family out so as not to be reminded. She is not as generous and good-willed a person as you believed. I am not sure that talking with her will solve it, because it is ingrained within her.

other people's children are dull

Cortina, I think it hurts more as it's someone you were very close to, I certainly was to the person who has ignored my children for six years. You kind of have a naive image that they will be an auntie-like figure, and involved in their lives because you were so close before. Then, when it becomes obvious they don't want that (and perhaps you were a bit in fantasy land about that anyway), you tell yourself that of course your children aren't that interesting to them, and it would be nice if they popped in to see them once every couple of years. After six years without mentioning them, not seeing them and the person avoiding the subject on the phone, you have to admit defeat, they have a real problem with your children/you having children. It's sad for them really.

I don't think this is a 'single' person's thing. I have two great single friends who show what to me is an appropriate amount of interest, indeed one is very loving and kind with the girls, the other is happy to chat about any part of my life (children/work/relationships/moving house, whatever).

I'm not sure the person will react well if you raise it, as their behaviour may be a mystery to them, they may not realise they are doing it. I do have a friend who had a phase of not wanting to be around children, as TTC and found it very distressing, but that was a phase, and she was upfront and very honest, so I knew not to ramble on endlessly about this. But this blanking for many years is quite different and I would suspect that your friend either has a massive issue with herself being single and not having children, or just suffering from irrational jealousy and doesn't really know why (or a combination).

Think the answer to your question is in your very first sentence Cortina.

Her biological clock is ticking away.....and its affecting how she is treating you. Its very sad for both of you

I think i would be slightly upset. Surely a how is your DC? every now and again wouldn't hurt.

I completely agree with onetoomany and catherined

To those who say how dare you expect your friend to have an interest in your children, grow up! Having children is a life changing experience, it becomes a massive part of your life and is not something that can be "ignored". Agreed, it doesn't have to be the star of the show but it is there isn't it?

I understand exactly where you are coming from cortina it is odd and very upsetting. Not even acknowledging your children is very bloody rude - we're not saying conversations have to revolve around the children but how can the subject not crop up from time to time when it is a massive part of your life? I'm a SAHM with a friend who doesn't have children and she very much would like to, I don't "bang on" (her words) to her about dc because I know it's upsetting but when I do "slip up" I immediately feel guilty. I'm not married and she is, maybe I would like to be and yet I don't not acknowledge her husband. I don't have a job, she has one, maybe I'd like one - do I roll my eyes or ignore her when she talks about what a stressful day she's had? No! of course I don't. Why is that any different from mentioning your day in passing in relation to your children "I've had a shocker today, dc kept me up all night and played up all day ...pass the wine, I need a drink!"

On the other side of things it sounds like your friend is using avoidance as a coping mechanism, try your best to help her in this respect but of course there is a limit. You and your feelings count too.

activate other people's jobs are dull but you feign a degree of interest don't you?

No I express interest if people are interesting and don't pretend it when not

but some people make their jobs, and children, interesting by sharing interesting things about them

I make a point of not centering relationships around stories of my children or jobs

I have two friends like this.

My ds is seven and I have known both friends for about 15 years. They act like he doesn't exist, i usually see then without him anyway as they both live in London, so I'll pop down on my own for a weekend every few months. On the few occasions they have been up to stay when he was a toddler, it was all rolled eyes and huffing from them, even though I am vey relaxed and wasn't implementing any sort of toddler friendly routine on them (and dh was here to spend time with ds), but actually, as he's got older ma dis into the same music as them and things they both seem to be mellowing towards him.

It honestly doesn't bother me one bit. I have plenty of other friends who adore ds. These two don't have kids (I was 22 when I had ds, so they were finishing up uni etc so our lives were very different, I had a house andwas married etc).

YANBU - friends are interested in each others lives... end of. How can you maintain a friendship with anyone if the most improtant thing in your life is never mentioned. I don't expect my closest (single, childless) friend to send cards, buy pressies, etc. However, I do expect her to listen/respond when I talk about my child. I don't hammer on about her too much, as I understand it's hard for her, but I refuse to edit DD out of my life and would be hurt if she acted this way!

I have MIL, SIL and sister, who show no interest in my DC, so I'm not the least bit hurt or upset if close friends show no interest either. And, to be honest, other peoples children are dull.

Do you think it hurts her to talk about your DS - maybe she badly wants a child or perhaps she think he has changed your relationship. Or maybe, as my sister said, she doesn't want to 'open the floodgates to tedious conversations about children'.

It is rude not to feign a bit of interest though.

Hard to say - it depends on exactly how she is behaving.

Is she actively avoiding the subject? If you mention your child, does she try to change the subject? Does she make efforts to avoiding meeting your child? If so, then YANBU, as that's rather rude on her part and possibly suggests she has some ishoos about you having a child/her not/etc. (Or it might mean she doesn't like your DS and so is trying to avoid the subject for that reason...)

Or is it just that she doesn't actively bring up the topic of your child? i.e. she chooses to talk about other things instead, but if you bring up the subject, she will appear interested? If so then YABU.

LostArt - have they edited DC out of their lives? Do they ever visit or mention of their own accord? If so I think that's terribly sad.

My sense is it hurts her to bring it up but her stony silence seems hatefully indifferent now for some reason. We have another close friend, and I asked about this lady's son (she'd visited the family and son had been ill). My friend said 'I have no idea about him' in this completely icy and horrible tone.

Minipie - she is avoiding the subject, and any reference at all. It's like my son does not and has never existed. When I mention my son, which I do VERY rarely, it's as if she pretends she hasn't heard.

We used to be a trio in the old days. Me, her and this other girl.

What is odd is that she pours love and affection into one of her sister's children - I forgot to mention this. She worships them and has been involved in their lives since day one.

Does sound quite weird Cortina especially if she doesn't act this way with her sisters child (but does, apparently, with another friend's child).

Have you tried asking her why she acts this way?

Cortina, this is sounding more and more like my own situation, the friend I mentioned has also been involved in the lives of other children, including her next door neighbours! How insulting is that?! So it's not an anti-children thing, but it's very specific: their relationships with you does not include you having children, full stop.

And, having friends or relations who are not that into kids and tut a bit isn't really the same. It's only when they actively don't visit, actively don't phone, actively change the subject if you mention them that you realise there's an issue. It's very hurtful and I for one haven't found a way back from it yet, even though this friend has recently had a baby, as unfortunately I still feel resentful at being shut out for six years after being relatively close.

I think her sister's child is like her own child, it is part of her family. The fact that she lavishes attention on her sister's child shows that she does like children, but only "her" children, as she sees her sister's child as hers in a way. I think she resents other people's children because she is bitter that she doesn't have any and she doesn't want to share in the happiness of others.

I have, I hasten to add, bought a pressie, visited the new baby, and cooed appropriately. I've also tried to open the doors to a future friendship by phoning/showing interest/trying to bond over what we do have in common now, but I know at present, my heart is not really in it and she probably does too.

Claig - just because she doesn't have or acknowledge children does not mean she is jealous, bitter, envious or resentful .

I was the last of my friends to have a child by a looooong shot. Was neither jealous, resentful or any of the above - I neither wanted or didn't want a child. If it happened, it happened, if it didn't (or hadn't), I had many other parts of my life that were equally fullfilling. Maybe your friend falls into this category? Neither cares nor doesn't care?

Or maybe she doesn't see you as being as close as you do?

The not buying presents thing isn't strange. I don't buy presents for friends' children unless we are invited to a party.

Not mentioning your child at all in six years and ignoring email references to your child is odd, though.

No, you don't have to like 'other people's children' but there is no excuse for bad manners or being rude to a supposed friend.

YANBU. She sounds self absorbed and discourteous.

I understand that ifancyashandy, but the friend's behaviour is so unusual that it is not normal. There is something deeper behind her behaviour. I think it is to do with jealousy, but of course I could be wrong.

Claig, I think you could have hit the nail on my head, my Mum has said similar (I've not told her my feelings on the matter).

Am pretty sure she would feel that we were very close. She's told me this only recently after a series of events (don't want to go into too much detail in case I out myself).

I've held off christening DS (although we'd like to have done) because of this friend. I don't feel I can ask her - because of her lack of interest etc -but fear she'll be terribly hurt if I don't. I actually know she would be. She sees herself as my closest friend and would wonder why I asked anyone 'less close' to be Godmother.

Part of me would like to ask her but I don't think she actually deserves me to. I appreciate that probably won't make logical sense to many given what I've said :).

She is Godmother to our other friend's child (the one with the sick DC).

For what it's worth, I struggle to talk to other people about their kids. Not because I'm being rude, I just kind of forget. And if you don't have kids then there is very little you actually think to talk about. I know it's not the same thing, but bear with me, before meeting DP I kind of thought of other people's kids more like pets (not meant in a derisive way), they were something I knew nothing about - and would be as likely to ask after their pets as their kids. In the same way as I would not know how to continue a conversation about, for example, their pet bird. As I don't know the first thing about birds, I wouldn't know what to say about their child.

And if she is hoping for kids she probably wont be too keen on talking about something which is possibly playing on her mind a lot. I guess she feels upset as you are her peer, while her sister is family - and not thought of in the same way. I think Claig has the right idea, but bitter isn't the word I'd use. Have you asked her about this? I know it'd be difficult to broach.

Maybe ask if you talking about your son upsets her as you've noticed she is keen to avoid the subject? That way you don't sound accusatory and maybe she'll open up to you. When you say she isn't making anything happen wrt meeting someone, maybe she's scared? Or feeling insecure?

That may be partly it Kaloki, or I think it might have been it at first.

As for men and meeting someone, not sure. Better I don't go into that here.

Ah ok, sounds like there are some issues there then. Maybe asking her to be Godmother might actually help, might make her feel more of a connection with your son?