Upset by tonights Dispatches - cousin marriages

[MumNWLondon]

AIBU to think that in the light of the known health risks of cousin marriages there are has not been a nation wide campaign alerting people of the risks.

Just watched Dispatches and cousin marriages.

Salient points:

• massive increased risks of children with genetic conditions with cousin marriages - 700 affected babies born each year
• something like British pakistanis have 1/3 of children with genetic diseases yet they are only 1.5% of population
• can't do genetic testing as only 40% of things can even be tested for. with cousin marriage new gene mutations result in genetic conditions
• each child can cost NHS £250k per year
• very little awareness for fear of being "racist" (although same issues would affect non muslims too)

Of course lots of people on program saying well my parents are cousins and i am healthy. of course they are, it just increases risks a lot, doesn't mean they'll def have disabled children.

There have been various programmes on this in the past. I took an interest when researching my family history as a distant ancestor (Nan's cousin to be precise) married her own cousin.

I found this in the course of my browsing, which argues that the risks are over-exaggerated.

This isnt new though is it, you ask anyone who murses in a city with a high asian population and they will tell you about the number of 'syndrome' babies they see on a regular basis .It isnt rascist to say that marrying your own kith and kin is a bad idea ,its a fact.

or even nurses

Valhalla ,i think the odd isolated incident is less likely to result in problems ,its when it has been happening for generations so the gene pool is so concentrated .

It'd be interesting to know how big the problem is in Pakistan and how their health service copes.

hmmm, i used to read stats like this, and would aggree. then i grew a bit older in years and saw lots more couples. what i saw, was that those who were with someone from within their own family, first or second cousins, seemed to be happier together.

i'm not being very eloquent right now, ( not usually known for my eloquence either :) ] but sometimes, happiness is worth the risk that consanguinous marriages may pose. so unless the main point is going to be that the nhs shouldnt pay for peoples choices, then, the rest is all moot.

It doesn't surprise me that there is increased risk, was surprised at the statistics - eg in some areas more than 50% of british pakistanis marrying cousins.

I still think there should be awareness campaign so those considering it could understand the risks.

I read recently that in the ultra orthodox jewish community, before an arranged marriage is set up both the man and women have genetic testing done and if either are carriers of same mutation the "match" does not go ahead. Not sure this would work in the case of cousin marriages as probably new genetic mutations constantly arising.

times

link

ladysybil, what about the children who have life-limiting disabilities and die young? do you really think their suffering is made 'worth it' by their parents happiness in their marriages?

i don't see why people can't be happy marrying outside of their family.

i think this does need to be dealt with sensitively, in conjunction with the communities most affected. something desperately needs to be done, but i can see how hard this will be when the religious leaders in these communities refuse to acknowledge the problem.

To be fair to the UK aisan population, it really isnt that long ago that this stopped being fairly common pratice within the indigenious population of this country,especially round these parts

NFNN, bumpsoon?

I'm really surprised that there is a taboo about discussing this issue and taking major steps to prevent 1st cousin marriage. I'm 45 and I remember being very aware as a small child that it was dangerous to marry your 1st cousin because their would be health problems with the children. If I knew that all those years ago, how come it's still going on and has not been outlawed in this country? I just can't understand it.

Marrying your first or second cousins generation after generation. It's it really rocket science to realise that's not a good idea?

It's illegal in some US states to marry your first cousin.

No need for a law when people largely choose not to do it, Just13. Like you I grew up with the notion that marring that close could be 'a problem' (never specified). Moot point for me, all cousins female!

Here too, bumpsoon. Even now, in close-knit communities like mine. I am an anomaly because my family moved here from up north (london). But a lot of my school friends are mutually related through blood or marriage. I ended up going out with my best mate's cousin for a bit, then later he married my other mate's sister, who is also my best friend's, and my other mate's cousin...

If you get my drift...lol

counsyl

$349 for a test (a lot) - but just with saliva can screen for many conditions.

I wonder what the cost / benefit analysis would be for the NHS to offer this free to all?

yes, for many people, the risk of marrying an outsider is far greater a risk.

the trouble is, that in the communities that would most benefit, ie, the ones with generations upon generations of such marriages, it is considered almost a legal and moral obligation to marry your first cousin. marrying outside the family is only to be considered as a last resort. i dont personally agree with it at all, but, i can see how it can become something that is so essential to maintaining ones identity.

ive also grown up knowing that the kids of such marriages could end up with quite significant health problems. but, honestly speaking, the advantages of having your own family around you, now, imo, outweigh the possible risks. i would still not encourage it, but would think that banning it is wrong wrong wrong.

Wasn't this something that used to be covered as part of O-level biology so is something that everybody (that did biology at any rate) should at least know in simplest form? (and yes, that o-level dates me for a start!) Dangers of marrying cousins and increased risks of genetic problems...

In those days however I seem to remember the classic example cited was the Spanish Royal Family from hundreds of years ago and the genetic speech impediment of one of the royals being the reason why there is lots of lisping in spanish from spain but not in latin american spanish - over simplifying and did bio 20+ years ago so I'm sure somebody with more up to date knowledge will correct!

It upset me because my cousin has just married her cousin and I'm fed up with it being demonised. It is not the same as the situation in the Pakistani community where it happens over and over in the same family. It is also not illegal in the UK or Ireland where my cousin is. They are intelligent people who considered this very carefully and went ahead only when they were satisfied that the risks were minimal. They're not freaks or weirdos as has been said in other threads recently.

I was going to say - it's not marrying your cousin per se, it's being the next generation to marry cousins, after years and years of it happening.

I saw a programme once about one-off brother-sister-marriages, and apparently the risk of a child having genetic problems is only 2% higher. (NB that's a TV statistic, so it's probably cack, but you get the idea.) So cousins marrying as an unusual but legal event: it's not a big deal, is it? It's just after generations that you get problems.

yes, would not be surprising if continued cousin marriages significantly increase risk, although they didn't say this, but they did show not pakistani couple - they were first cousins once removed with no history of previous first cousin marriages and their baby had genetic disease.

my dad was GP in area with lots of pakistani patients and i remember him telling me more than 20 years ago that first cousin marriages v common and he was seeing lots of rare genetic diseases.

further my family are carriers of a genetic disease that was discovered during screening process - hence my upset that something can't be done - whether through education or screening.

I didn't see it being demonised?
I saw the latter approach taken by the Pakistani doctors along with religious leaders to try to educate and protect those at highest risk as thethe way forward.
The programme was not a let's save the NHS millions, it was let's try to prevent children with these dreadful conditions from being born.
I'm curious to as to what happens within Pakistan?
Does anyone know anything?

"very little awareness for fear of being "racist" (although same issues would affect non muslims too)"

Muslim isn't a race.

As another poster has said, this is a taboo in many in many cultures and has been for years. In breeding is not a good idea, even if you are not focusing on life threatening disorders, there is an acknowledgment that it doesn't do the blood line any favours. Low level learning disabilities are rife etc. Look at the Royal family! Full of inbreeding etc and not exactly lookers or the brightest buttons. I would be very upset and worried if my children married their cousins.

Sorry, Piffle, I didn't mean in this thread or this programme as far as I know (I haven't seen the programme yet) but in the past when this topic has come up. It seems to bring out the sort of people who would, in the past go and look at the bearded lady!

My only thoughts would be for the parents and children affected so dreadfully by disorders that are due to generations of cousin marriages. It's an absolute tragedy and education and in schools, health surgeries and among religious leaders who condone such marriages is vital.