to think that if two people have a child...

[hairytriangle]

One does not 'help' the other with childcare, and one never babysits their own child?

Just that when relationships break down, people become very defensive and possessive and use their children as pawns.

I think babysitting can be used though, eg if DH goes out without me - why is your DW not here too - "she's at home babysitting". Or a friend calls - can you come round, "sorry no DH out and I am stuck in babysitting".

re: childcare, well we have unequal relationship in that as:

a)I am on maternity leave and he is working fulltime
b) I am breastfeeding my baby
c) when i go back to work i work part time less hours than him

But despite all that at the weekends he does as much as me (apart from breastfeeding). My job is very 9-5 so if I need to stay late I need to call and ask him to be back on time to relieve nanny.

BarmyArmy, sadly it's true :( I've seen friends who divorce & then suddenly the mum (who for years was accusing her husband of not 'helping' enough) remembers that she's the prime caretaker & has much more of a right to see the children & 1 weekend a month is surely enough for him. Breaks the dad's heart, I tell you...

As much as we can blame men for all this 'helping' and 'babysitting' business, the ones who are most often to blame are the women who secretly enjoy these division of labour.

(even this division of labour)

Not being able to bear the thought of being away from your DC is not the same as expecting them to change an equal amount of nappies when you're a family unit! Bit off OP anyways!

Speaking as one who struggled to get her now ex to help out round the house (and no I hated the division of labour and tried everything i could think of to change it), I actually see DCs less now than I did before we separated. He has them alternate weekends and one night a week which means i see this much less of them.

He's still a lazy arse though. Even the DCs question what he does with all his time. It does mean that generally they are better at helping me as they see how much effort I am making.

Minxie, I agree totally. However, when parents separate surely it's equally sad (in most cases, don't want to generalise) for both parents & both can't bear the thought of being away from their DC? Bit off OP, though, true.

'BarmyArmy Sat 14-Aug-10 23:12:58
Just that when relationships break down, people become very defensive and possessive and use their children as pawns.'

Sounds like you've got your own issues here, tbh. So you're suggesting that I should do all the housework, just in case we split up and I want custody? As long as women 'know their place' they get the children? Old fashioned view, to say the least.

I think you're insulting both sexes with this one.

This winds me up, when friends tell me to ask DP if he will babysit?! I say no he wont babysit he will look after his kids like he always does and i do.

I got the thing about night feeds and getting up in the morning people would say 'oh isnt your dp good, mine wont get up in the night'

No he isnt good he is taking thier Father, why shouldnt he get up with them!!!

Agree, titsalina. To be fair, DH and I both ask each other before we go out. Neither of us automatically assume the other is free to have the kids!

abbierhodes - is a 50/50 split of contact/access post-separation an old-fashioned view? I don't think so.

In today's family courts with their pro-women bias, this should actually be considered a radical view.

A presumption of 50/50 responsibilities (unless there are darn good reasons to do otherwise) would encourage/force/cajole men into playing a greater role whilst the relationship is still working, one would hope.

After thinking about this thread for a while I think I am relaxed about terminology and phrases is because I have never encounted any arkwardness from DH.
I have never had to put up with the shite that Tequila has. (I was aghast at what you told us Tequila)
I've only had kindness in the 20 years we have been together (even through our shit and rough times) with neither of us being the primary carer. We see our selves as parents and one picks up where the other one leaves IYSWIM.

DH frets about making sure homework is done, shoes are polished, they have enough pocket money, they have good manners and so on.

I can understand then why people get pissed of when their partner makes out they have done a huge favour by looking after the kids or making tea.

Actually barmy, yes I do!