to think benefits are pretty LOW actually. How much do you get?

[ItsGraceActually]

I'm on ESA (used to be 'sick benefit'). I get £90 a week, plus my rent (£400/month) and council tax (£100/month).

With my £90 a week, I pay for heating - it's an all-electric house on a pre-pay meter; water rates; phone, internet, mobile, etc; TV licence; everything else.

I can't afford to run a car or, indeed, use public transport. I smoke, which I pay for with 'permitted work' (about £20/week) from home. I NEVER go out, except for one coffee a fortnight. I don't know how I'm going to afford heating in the winter.

I am extremely grateful for the welfare system, don't get me wrong! I feel fine about claiming: I paid in for 30 years, in the belief that anyone who needs it can get it.
Just now and again, there's one thread too many in here about people on a "welfare lifestyle" , living it up on benefits. Chance'd be a fine thing ...

Sonnet- iw oudln;t worry; as someone who worked right up until being a student, then straight into being a carer, the choice aspect and sense of control you get through self financing is something that couldn;t be compensated for. I'd love to be able to make chocies about being a sahm or wohm, renter or owner, poor or working longer to eb better off (I know not everyone can do that but some can) and I can't do that.

Be honest, if you could change things but only by having 2 of your kids become disabled it woudln't be worth it would it?

LRD some good points. Disability is often under diagnosed (I can name 3 people rihght here tright now wioth obvious ASD who have never been picked up, and my dad has severe mobility issues he self medicates with overdoeses of paracetamol for so he can continue to work at 68).

When DH was really very severely depressed (and I don't mean a bitt down as per stereotypes, I mean police out searching on suicide watch when he didn't return- post dx's of boys, long resolved now) he woudln;t get proper help orr take the work break the GP wanted.

And the thing about employment is clear- plus, there's a very real group of people who aren't clinically disabled but not far off who struggle to hold down jobs or ones that get them off benefits entirely. As an example, look at the Learning Disability criteria- 65 in some areas. Is anyone going to suggest that someone with an IQ of 70 is going to have normal access to employment? yet without a diagnosis they;d struggle to get registered as disabled.

The grey area is really quite significant. People with Aspergers often fall into it; with support they could hold good jobs but without it they struggle. A sensible thing would be to make the support avaialble (and systems such as TEACCH* when set up can be fairly cost free afetr implementation) but these are the schemes that get cut first.

I know we need cuts but it seems logical to me to start by maximising the ones that enable to work but that is often so mcuh cheaper than paying benefits to people who don't want to be unemployed anyway! And probably saves a fortune in MH issues further down the line.

*TEACCH invovloes modifying an environment to enable people with an ASD to fuction more effectively. Complex at times but often really sensible small changes- clipbopard lists of procedures eg to use a till, or even take a call- or boxes with equipment for various jobs ready- can make employment so much more accessible.

Sonnet, have you checked your Tax Credit eligibilty?

'Second one was my error - statement wasnt clear. You would expect the number of people claiming disability to be the same per 1000 people, say, across all regions in the country. This isnt the case. In areas of high unemployment, there are more people claiming disability. The logical conclusion being - they arent unemployed because they are disabled. They are disabled because they are unemployed.

Not sure about that

Now, I live near merthyr where the legendary IB rise happned post pit closure so can see where you are coming from (don;t know people there so no formal opinions really)

But at same time areas with very low housing costs, high density council housing etc are going to flag up infinitely more poor people than otehr areas, and a substantially higher % of poor people are disabled becuase being disabled makes you poor.

And tbh whilst the Governemnt may be right that there is a % of over claiming, relailty is they full well admit the bottom line is their main concern atm, not avoiding causing deserving people to lose out.

And yes, that one you are referring to is IB: previous Government wasn't p[lanning on changes to DLA. very different sets of benefits and needs.

ccp, why would you expect levels of disability to be the same across the country?

There are obvious reasons why they wouldn't be. Poor people are less healthy than rich ones, it is (sadly), that simple. People who have done physically taxing work (which is usually paid worse than 'white-collar' work), are more likely to become injured or unable to work. You would expect disability levels to rise in poor areas.

In 2008, as a single woman, I got:

£390 housing benefit (my rent was £510 per month)
£59.60 per week JSA
free prescriptions and eyetests

I didn't get my bills covered, nor the cost of travel to interview (they don;t pay within the M25). Luckily my flat was furnished (I was a lodger) but I panicked about covering the rent when I got a job and my benefits stopped pretty much that minute.

You might also see rises in specific disorders absed on teh nature of the lcoal industry- say emphysema and asthma in mining towns, or farming diseases ort mental health disorders in rural areas (farmers have huge MH risks).

if you ahd representative populations across areas all doing the smae varieties of mixed worj then no, YANBU. But we don't.

True, Sancti. My grandpa died of asbestos poisoning only a few years ago, and the doctor said that in Doncaster (where he then lived) and in Abergavenny (where he'd worked much of his life), they were still seeing working-age men dying of that illness in 2003.

Ah I am not far from Abergavenny, nice palce.

i've been exposed to ASbestos, but in a Government building so nothing we could do wrt to securing compensation if we developed asbestosis (ceiling came down in an office wher they didn;t know they had it).

Clear sofar though thank God.

DH worked in a aplce where it was all night shifts, heart attacks and depression were the order of the day adn GP said that was to be expected as weork related disease.

Hmm, Sancti, even if the government hadn't immunised itself from claims(!) there wouldn't likely be much support. I grew up in the Black Country, where - back then - many men were miners or asbestos workers. They used to mulch the asbestos manually, in large open tubs. I assume they're all dead from their lung diseases, now, but nobody ever won compensation ... and probably wouldn't qualify for DLA under present rules, even though most of them couldn't walk as far as the shops.

Oh I know, but if had developed meso it would have been nice for the boys to get something to make up for them not having a Mum, you know?

Asbestosis has hit our family in other ways too- Dad's employers were sold to a company absed abroad who could legally access the entire pension fund to use in their claims actions. result Dad pensionless after working fifty years.

That is very sad. Mind you, thank goodness there's increasing awareness of some of the dangers our dads and granddads had no way of knowing about, so hopefully it will be that much better again when the next generation of children go to work.

"Second one was my error - statement wasnt clear. You would expect the number of people claiming disability to be the same per 1000 people, say, across all regions in the country. This isnt the case. In areas of high unemployment, there are more people claiming disability. The logical conclusion being - they arent unemployed because they are disabled. They are disabled because they are unemployed."

How about living costs have to be lower in areas of high unemployment, which means it is easier/cheaper for people with disabilities to live there? Or any of the reasons you have been given above?

i do think my money written down like that seems alot. but in actual fact it doesnt go very far. my rent is high as i had to flee my council accomidation due to dv and so am renting privately.
the actual money i have to live off is enough to manage but thats about it. once i pay elec, gas, water, tv licence plus food, bus fairs to get my dc to school there is not alot remaining for clothes etc.

I have to admit, I'm quite comfortable on what we get. For a disabled adult and disabled child, we get the following every week:

Income Support: 106
DLA (adult): 90
DLA (child): 90
CTC: 128
Carer's: 53
Council Tax Benefit: 26 (i.e. full amount)
Housing Benefit: 85 (i.e. full amount)
Child Benefit: 20

No maintenance as my husband died before DS was born. But it adds up to over £31k - plus our council flat is in central London, and most people would have to pay a far higher rent to live where we are (in zone 1). So we do get an equivalent lifestyle of someone on a fairly high salary . We also get passported benefits - school meals, laptop grant, prescriptions, dental care, hospital travel etc . I get a Freedom travel pass due to disability and DS gets free travel anyway as buses are free for children in London. We also get free carer's entry for cinema and other attractions, free playschemes and theatre trips for the disabled in our area.

I wouldn't be able to work with my health issues anyway and due to caring for DS. That is a lifelong issue for both of us (DS has an indefinite DLA award and mine is for 5 years). I am sure most rational people would prefer to go out and work rather than have to deal with ill health and the stress of being a FT carer.

after reading this thread its sad to say and possibly horrible but i do at times wonder if my partner should just give up work, he is self employed and earned less then £8k last year (the recession hit quite hard for a bit) , we get wtc, ctc and child benefit but we get no help towards rent (550 pcm) and council tax (110pcm) we live hand to mouth, save like fucking troopers in the vain hope that we can afford to send our ds to nursery full time so that i can do my degree, otherwise he'll be going to work with his dad just like his big sis had too. although thankfully more work has started coming in so fingers crossed this year will be good.

firefly, with that much disability to take care of, yours looks like one of the cases where the system really is working properly! Good for you, and thanks for posting about the other help you get as well.

Yours is the only post (so far) where you do receive enough to fund a normal, fulfilling life. Hope you & DS are well enough to make the most of it :)

Did you apply for HB, strawberry? I would have thought you'd have at least got partial relief?
Crossing my fingers for you, too ...

Sounds like you need to speak to citizens advice strawberry tot as 8k is not a lot and everyone gets child benefit.

Your local council are the ones who will assess you for help on housing and council tax. Look up your local council web site and the housing dept no. will be on there.

It's just a case of evaluating your circumstances.

Best of luck

I'm worried about starting work in october when little one is at school and how it will affect my income but personally I want to work because I am able to and it gets you out of the house and away from the housework.

But I'm not going to bust my balls like I did for the last 4 years and work silly hours bcause I'm a lone parent and my dd is my most important job.

I just want to put into the system (which I already have, so no guilt there) but also take out what I need whilst I get back on my feet.

Everyone's circumstances are different

And I agree there are a load of pisstakers who need addressing and that is where the problems with the benefits system lies. Not the honest ones who use it as a safety net or because they are simply unable to work.

i'm sorry i should apologise for my earlier post as i shouldn't complain about my life. my life is what it is because of the choices that i made, both my partner and i are now trying our hardest to ensure that our babies get everything they need, indeed this is quite a bumpy ride but one that once completed will be an awesome one and hopefully one that will make both our children proud.

From my (limited) experience, I think part of the problem is that there are so many different benefits, affected by different circumstances, and huge amounts of form filling in that it makes it hard for many people to know what they are entitled to, and make appropriate claims. Some people here seem to be getting very little, and others much more (no judgments on what is an appropriate level).

My own experience was applying for dla for ds1 who had severe eczema. His dermatologist said that he would be eligible as I had to go to his school to cream him twice a day as well as out of school hours, we had very disrupted nights and his evening bathing and bandaging routine took an hour and a half, which made evenings very difficult with 2 other children to care for too.

I filled in the long and complicated forms, was assessed and given the lowest level of help, really to subsidise having help in the evenings. Then dh said that we shouldn't accept it because if things really were that bad then we could afford to pay for additional help ourselves and not use the state. So we never took up the benefit. dh was right and I felt rather ashamed that I had contemplated taking it. There are people out there who need the money far more than we do. (and luckily ds's skin is so much better now that I don't have to go to school each day and cream him in the stationery cupboard any more so I've been able to go back to work)

StrawberryTot - you should look into it to see if you're eligble for HB and council tax benefit - you probably won't be entitled to the full amount but on that salary you should get some help towards them

I would have thought so, too strawberrytot. If you get WTC then you're on a low income - I used to get help towards rent & council tax when I was receiving working tax credit.

Nobody's suggesting you & DP aren't doing your best! But, you know, I paid into the system like everyone else who can pay. We do it so nobody has to keep a family on £8k. Have a quick check on entitledto.com.

I so agree with you Gracie,I get £90 a week widows allowance which ends in December as only paid for one year.If I dont have a job by then I have to claim JSA,wow can you imagine how I'l live on £65.The woman at job centre said my best bet was to have a baby or get myself made disabled(no chance on both counts).Ihave to pay £53 per month council tax on top of tele licence,phone,gas,elect,food etc and its a taxable allowance.Just discoverd that you can get tax credits if over 50 and working 16 hours but you have to be on an unemployment benefit to claim it so I am not eligible.I will have to wait till WA ends,goon JSA then find a job.I don't know why folk think we are so well off.

"The woman at job centre said my best bet was to have a baby or get myself made disabled" [shock}

Crikey, so now we're a country where people should have their legs broken so they can afford to live???!! Hope it hasn't come to that yet ...

Do your own research on services for over-50s, lilyliz. I went on the New Deal programme, which everyone at the Job Centre - not even the manager - thought I wasn't eligible for! In my case, I still only got JSA but there were little add-ons which helped. Best of all, I got free re-training and the use of a study centre during the day (saved on heating). You need to really look around; it's possible you could go back to college which would be a fantastic boost after what must have been an awful year for you.

You should be getting help with your rent and council tax as far as I know. You'll certainly qualify for them when you're on JSA. I'm not knocking Job Centre staff - they have to learn a whole new set of rules every few months, plus (depending on location) handle emergencies with angry, homeless, junkie mothers & stuff. I was in London at that time, so didn't blame my lot for not knowing the best deal for a 50-year-old, redundant homeowner! It's definitely worth finding out as much as you can. Good luck :)

Strawberry

With an income like that (DH has similar) you should find that the university degree comes with 75% funding atatched for childcare.

You may well know this but thought it worth mentioning anyway.

It's applied for alongside student finance, and tbh DH also being a student (I am a carer so largely out fo the fray) means we have the money to cope whilst also feeling that we are trying our hardest and getting a bit of self respect.