to want to shout at Primark shoppers?

[baiyu]

I mean really, just how many shoppers without a conscience are there? There really is no justification for shopping somewhere that treats its garment workers so badly and has continued to do despite years of campaigning.

Primark are thriving in the economic downturn making workers lives worse and worse as they struggle to keep up with orders. Being poor is no excuse, I can?t afford to buy new clothes but I?d rather my few quid went to Oxfam than ABF and their cruel trading practices. So tell me, why do people shop there? The quality is terrible too, how is it a bargain if an item of clothing lasts ten minutes?

I?m not just reading the Daily Mail by the way, researching things like this is my job, the working conditions have NOT improved and it?s just making me angry! AIBU to think more people should care?

YANBU.

'But all this 'I have no money, poor me' just doesn't ring true I'm afraid. My grandparents made do and mend - clothes were recycled, darned, hand made. Once really raggedy, they were used as floor cloths or dusters.'

Good for them. Glad I don't have to live in those days of no hot water in most homes, no loos indoors and other disgusting lack of hygeine like that.

Times have moved on.

Before Primark, well, I lived in a place with no Primark and shopped in Peacocks, Tesco and ASDA.

Now we live in a rural area. No shops beyond a little Morrison's and some pubs.

No boot sales, either.

And most Ebayers use carriers who charge more for our living in the Highlands. It's called a Highland surcharge.

The nearest clothes shop is a Tesco or Primark.

Cost of living has risen, VAT's rising and many are unemployed.

So believe it or not, quite a few people shop in places like Primark because they are poor.

But I do shop at Ebay, charity shops and car boot sales.

I don't drive.

We grown our own fruit and veg and use very little meat.

And har de har har at stopping the long haul flights. I last went on one 20yrs ago.

I put the DCs in hand me downs and darn clothes. Once they are raggedy I used them as dusters.

I have a few bits and pieces from Primark. So sue me.

Actually jason, I don't want to buy thin, cheap crap - I love luxury fabrics and durability reminiscent of 70s clothes. Sometimes I'll run my fingers over the aforementioned 300 euro cord skirt (sale price)... and then sadly slope off to H&M. Nice if you can afford ethical.

'Ebay can be very cheap and lots of sellers offer returns. Freecycle and gumtree etc also offer clothes.'

They do? Around here, they offer old machinery and electronics and maybe toys, or sell lifestock and machinery, but not clothes.

Ebay cheap? My arse.

This is the problem with people who live in a developed country, privileged people with high ideals, who decide to 'solve' the issues of another country for them.

Do you have any idea what the children you would force out of those 'awful child labour jobs' would do? Do you think they would suddenly not need money, and suddenly not have a family to support? No. Instead they would be forced in to the sex industry. Selling their bodies, and possibly their lives. And they would do it, because they have mouths to feed.

Go to those children who are sewing on sequins for Primark. Ask them if you want people to stop buying the clothes they make. You know what the answer would be. Children are lying about their age to get those jobs. They know that they will get an income and save their families from death.

It isn't pleasant, and it shouldn't be. But it is. And when you lift Africa or China or whereever out of the hole they are in, there will be another worse off country just ready to take its place. When China gets too expensive, they will outsource again.

Stopping purchases from Primark will only hurt the people you want to protect.

people shop primark cause they want to,suits their budget and no amount of feetie stamping and hand wringing will stop that.how dare you opine and tell the people "Being poor is no excuse".oh hark at you.in a free market economy people chose where and what to spend their cash on

and the charity shops were i live are more pricey than new at primark

Riven my dusting/floor cloths are my old knickers, thankfully clean and big enough My mum did the same thing and I can remember promising to myself I would never use pants as cloths, funny how things change when you have more important beings to look after.

I put old fabric, knickers and whatnot into a cloth recycling at the girls' school. They sell them to a rag merchant to raise money for the school.

To clean I use microfibre cloths and liquidised soap nuts or Dr Bronner's liquid soap.

I wouldn't but my bloody dcs keep putting jam on the tv screen and computer screen and how can I keep up with the celebs on e-online if I can't see them

Riven... I fear my dusters have seen less action than my knickers!

I don't shop at Primark (never been into one !) -but where did I buy my clothes in the past?

Market - there's one clothing stall at our local market, nothing for people under 5ft 8 (I'm 5ft)

Matalan - been around donkey's years

Charity shops - in the days before they became more expensive than the cheap clothes shops

We now have a proper "vintage" (not a rebranded charity shop - it's a purely for it's own profit business) in town that's very good (if they're got stuff in that fits me....)

Last time I bought clothes for myself.........2yrs ago.

"Realistically, you could shop at car boot sales, on Ebay or at charity shops. You could eat meat less or become vegetarian. You could holiday in the UK or Europe and not take long haul flights.

But all this 'I have no money, poor me' just doesn't ring true I'm afraid. My grandparents made do and mend - clothes were recycled, darned, hand made. Once really raggedy, they were used as floor cloths or dusters. Now people buy disposable cleaning wipes and claim poverty.'"

Can't get to the local boot sales, ebay you have to pay for postage plus items often go for more than what they would cost new in the shops. Charity shop - more expensive now than buying new in many cases.

DS3 is currently wearing a top (Asda) that is onto it's 5th child.......so yes we recycle clothes.

I buy washable clothes for cleaning.

No long haul flights..........I'm a lucky one this year I'm going on holiday in the UK.........spending 2 weeks on the 14th floor of a skanky block of flats in a god damn awful part of Edinburgh - because I have a relative that lives there and can put me up for free.

Naughty me though - rather than spending 10hrs (officially - in reality more like 12/13hrs) on a coach with 3 young children, we're geting the train...........with all our luggage. Hardly glamorous..........

I shop in cheap shops for my children because otherwise they would have no clothes to wear. I am incredibly passionaite about fair trade, ask any of the people that know me and they'll tell you I'm always going on about it.

I buy fair trade tea, coffee, sugar........when the budget allows I "splash out" on fair trade bananas as well..........fair trade clothes - well my children would be walking round naked instead of in 2/3/4/5th "generation" clothes that are above their ankles, and have holes in the knees.......

YABU unreasonable to focus on Primark shoppers, our way of life is entirely built on exploiting workers in countries too far away to need to think about.

IMO Bond Street shoppers would be a better focus for your shouting - the mark up on designer items is several hundred percent, and when all is said and done, they are throwing the money away for the sake of a status symbol. Meanwhile hundreds of thousands of children are starving. Humans are ridiculous.

Just get a life baiyu.

Loads of charity shops sell clothes that are from Primark, Tesco, Asda etc but for more £ than if you bought them new! How does that fit in?

I'm just trying to tread as lightly on the planet and its people as I can, I appreciate that lots and lots of people are trying to do the same and we all make our own ethical choices (and put our families first, of course we do).

I think we need to take a good look at the disposable clothing culture in this country, not immediately stop sourcing from 3rd world countries- just give them a bit of respect and not expect t-shirts for a quid.
All those who've mentioned luxury chains with dodgy supply chains too- you're dead right, they shouldn't get away with that either.

I think that we are in danger of imposing our Western ideals onto people in the developing world, where it is the norm for children to work like it was in the past. My grandma was 7 when she started working with her mother in Turkey weaving rugs to sell. However the conditions under which the children work should be closely monitored and welfare of children safeguarded by companies.

It will do more harm than good to boycott these companies, the children will end up loosing their jobs and livelihood and not be able to support their families.

Fair enough if that's all you can afford.

I sometimes get depressed when I see the shoppers around here (I live very near a Primark) coming out absolutely laden with bags, and then retreating to the nearest expensive coffee shop and showing off the volumes of clothing they got. Dozens of skirts, trousers, tops, shoes, jackets, whatever else, way way more than they could possibly need, and that is just one trip. And the amount that comes to would easily buy them 2 or 3 outfits in a more expensive shop. I do worry that the amount of consumption is sending out the wrong message to teenagers, that it's OK, or even needed, to have hundreds and hundreds of tops. This is NOT an issue of them not being able to afford anything else, but a lifestyle choice that has arisen because of all the cheap shops. Totally different than people who are shopping there because that's what they can afford, and who are buying normal quantities of 'stuff'.

But then I remember all the things that I do, like eat meat, long-haul flights, and various other things that some of those people might not do, and so I try not to judge. We all make our choices as to what and how much we can do, and we all have different priorities. I don't think anyone can be ethically perfect. If people are doing their best to take notice, if they start to become aware of the issues, then that's all I can ask. There are a lot of things that I could choose to do different, but don't - there are some things that are easy for me to give up, and some things that are harder, and I am sure it's the same for everyone.

RSB aren't you just a ray of bloody sunshine?

And you're wrong about Primark - its been in the UK since 1973, and as Pennys in Ireland since 1969.

baiyu - having strong ethical beliefs............and being in a position to follow through properly with them are 2 different things.

Pigletmania makes a good point about the Western ideals in the developing world.

"Childhood" is a very loose term, and also a very modern one when looked at across the course of history.

And "childhood" being seen as as different from adulthood only came about through a wide variety of changes both socially, economically and technology.

CloudsAway many of the more expensive coffee shops actually use fair trade coffee................

Ooh, I do love the holier than thou, sanctimonious crap that some of the OP's spout on MN!

I shop in Primark because I want to, because I can, because my DD ruins her clothes at pre-school and because... it's my choice where I shop!

Good for you baiyu, it must be great to live such a selfless life.

Enjoy your high horse!