To this that the abortion age should be lowered

[Hai1988]

Hi all i just wanted to know what peoples thoughts were on this?

At the moment the cut off time to have an abortion is 24 weeks, but on here there has just been a story about twins born at 23 weeks!!

I think the cut off time should go right down to 12 weeks.

What do you lot think??

I think for abnormalities 24 weeks has to stay, its very sad situation for everyone

I have had an abortion myself, so please dont think I am pro life, or judging people that have them

But late abortions sit very uncomfortably with me, and they can be avoided. If people though "shit I might maybe be pregnant , and given that I cant have a late abortion I better get checked out asap". whats wrong with creating that culture?

most women KNOW they are pregnant, dont they???? I bet most of us did

again we are so focussed on the rights of the mother. what about the 23 weeks old healthy foetus? what about the doctors? what about the nurses? I dont want to go any further here.....are their rights less to that of the mother?

I perosnally think that we could make a cultural shift about late abortions for healthy foetuses, and I stand by that

But Hai, you did post in AIBU, and it says right there at the top:

"Please bear in mind that this topic encourages posters to give their opinions - i.e. they might disagree with you. That said, in line with our Talk policy elsewhere, we don't allow personal attacks no matter how unreasonable you think someone is. Do report any you see" - please do report any personal attacks made against you, I didn't notice any but my eyesight is shit.

You asked the question, people answered it. You can either read what people have said (and a lot of people have posted some serious and emotional stories from their own lives in order to make you think about what you're saying) and see how you feel about it, or you can say waaah not everybody agrees I'm leaving.

To call a spade a spade, a foetus is nothing more than a parasite (going by the strictest definition of the latter word) until it can survive outside the womb. A woman should never be forced to carry a parasite she truly does not want. Therefore, I'm more than happy for the limit to be reduced on the following condition:

If, for example, the limit is reduced to 12 weeks, once a woman is told that she cannot have an abortion, she should then be allowed to have labour induced immediately, and the baby can then be taken and cared for by the State/adoptive parents. After all, by setting such a limit, it must be believed that a foetus is immediately viable and should therefore be treated as such.

Of course, the fact that a lot of the foetuses/babies wouldn't survive, coupled with an increased strain on the NHS of having to care for those that survive with a variety of mild to severe medical conditions in NICUs for extended periods of time, the barriers facing the adoption and care of mildly to severely disabled children, the subsequent astronomical increase in taxes to care for these children throughout their childhood and well into their adult life with the medical difficulties such children would inevitably face, in addition to a rise in back-street abortions, the aftermaths of which would most likely be dealt with by the NHS etc etc, might be what people need to see that reducing the limit based on nothing more than a misguided sense of righteousness is perhaps not the best idea

I get where you are coming from I have had a termination it was a horrid experience that I would never repeat again unless my child would die with no hope of survival. I think it should be lowered to 12 weeks without a medical or psychological reason e.g underage mothers rape/domestic violence victims. But I am guessing that is pretty much what happens anyway.

Sorry if this hurts anyone's feelings but it is how I feel, but as I said I am ok with second trimester abortion in extenuating circumstances where adoption is either not viable due to medical reasons or continuation of the pg could cause psychological trauma.

Asana
I would not have dared to say it myself but I'm SO glad you did

Slushy that is what i was trying to say, but just couldnt get it across

slushy, you have the right to choose what you want to do with your body and your child. I don't really care either way and it's none of my business.

But I just don't get this need the pro-lifers have to tell other women whose circumstances they know NOTHING about what they can and can't do with their bodies and their pregnancies. How is it your business?

the thing is, women have always and will always seek abortions when they do not feel able to have a baby. The difference is whether you force it underground, making it more dangerous for women and girls, allowing some people to make profits out of carving women up etc etc. I say let's not.

I mean, abortion is mostly illegal (AFAIK) in northern ireland. So women there beg and borrow the money to travel to england, which means poor women are by default left out.

Exactly how many 23 weeks old healthy foetuses are being aborted...?

I don't know if you mean "underage mothers rape/domestic violence victims" are psychological reasons or not.
Who decides?

so one the one hand some people think its fair enough to abort a healthy 18 week foetus

but the FLAMING in parallel piled onto PG mothers than smoke and drink...

I am confused!

lets hope they are in opposing camps

"I should of said that abortions for no reason should be lowered."

Hai. I had a second trimester termination in November because my much-wanted and much-loved baby girl was found to have an abnormality that was incompatible with life.

Many people assume that, having been through what I've been through, I would be scathing of women who have terminations for 'social' (and I hate that phrase) reasons, rather than medical ones.

The truth is I feel nothing but empathy. No woman - and I mean NO woman - ever takes the decision to have a termination lightly, whatever their reason for doing so. And for you to assume that they do is rude and ignorant in the extreme.

Similarly, as many others have pointed out, for you to blithely say "it's something i could never do" without ever having been faced with that decision is incredibly naive.

"Exactly how many 23 weeks old healthy foetuses are being aborted...? "

At the expense of sounding callous, it's unlikely to be enough to warrant spending parliamentary time debating what would likely to be a very small reduction in the current limit.

Isnt it Southern Ireland?

Im sorry i dont know haw many times i can say it

I would like to know why 12 weeks?

WHy is it palatable for you at 12 but not 23? Is it viability? DO you have an extensive science background that means you know a lot about survival rates at each week of gestation?

Because 12 seems like an arbitrary choice. Like you just picked it out of thin air.

I support the abortion link with viability. This is a strong scientific link. If the viability age is reduced to 23/20/15 weeks then I would support the reduction of the abortion limit. But I do not think we should remove the link between abortions and viability, otherwise there is nothing to tether it at any gestation and bfore you know it, the right wing would have us down at 6 weeks.

Are you sorry for your opinion or sorry you started this thread?

both! I should just keep my mouth shut

porcamiseria, do I understand you correctly? If so: I think the important distinction between a) aborting a normal 18wk feotus and b) smoking and drinking your way through your pregnancy is whether the baby is WANTED or not.

An unwanted baby (for whatever reason) should not be forced on a woman. However, a woman who is choosing to continue with her pregnancy and who presumeably therefore wants the child, generally feels a responsibility for the health of that child while she is carrying it.

What ShadeofViolet said.

I personally don't want an apology. What I do hope is that you've read the contrasting views and experiences from women on this thread and learnt that things can never be that black and white.

Is it really OK though to force someone to continue a pregnancy? Does a fetus have equal rights? Do we go down the path of prosectuting pregnant women who smoke etc etc. Many late term abortions are for abnormalities and these can go on right up until birth. I believe if the limit does come down these will still be allowed.

Hai, posting on mn can be a baptism of fire sometimes

Has the response to your post made you change your mind at all or reconsider your standpoint?

hai

stop bloody apologising!!!

you have an opinions, and many disagree. c'est la vie

we are allowed to debate issues in AIBU I thought..... aren't we???

"slushy, you have the right to choose what you want to do with your body and your child. I don't really care either way and it's none of my business.

But I just don't get this need the pro-lifers have to tell other women whose circumstances they know NOTHING about what they can and can't do with their bodies and their pregnancies. How is it your business?"

I am not a pro lifer and I have not tried to canvass or push for abortion limits to be lowered but I am entitled to my opinion. My termination was the result of rape and I thought I was 8weeks but I wasn't things went wrong I nearly lost my life. I spent a month in hospital after it went wrong and the termination I had was more traumatic to me than my rape it may be that I was forced to have a termination I did not want and was therefor effectively raped twice IMO.