25 weeks of ebf due to older dc's allergies: don't want to mess up now

[whenwillisleepagain]

Everyone, I'd welcome your advice. My 4 yr old DS has nut and egg allergy and due for fish challenge paed allergy clinic soon, as that's a bit dubious too. My DD is 25 wks today and has been ebf. In the last 2 or 3 days she seems so hungry. I want to do BLW and was waiting till 26 weeks. In the meantime do you think it's ok for her to have a bit of formula? i think I may have unfairly got myself to a position where I see formula as a bad thing... and things fraught today, I need to be somewhere for a few hrs later, DH and MIL are looking after DCs. MIL is v critical of us for depriving DD of food because i ebf... and I think due to my anxiety levels, surprise, I've not been able to express much this AM. DD is awake and drinking from breast a lot during night, but I realise that's not necessarily due to hunger.

thank you, I am not being super-rational today! but i have read that as soon as you introduce formula, your milk supplies never recover - does that matter at 25 weeks anyway?

One bottle a day won't do any harm to your supply, it will adjust quickly. If you replace just the one feed.

However I wouldn't take how much you express as an indicator of low milk supply personally. Babies go through stages of feeding more, especially if teething and needing comfort or coming down with a cold or if having a growth spurt. Try and rest and put your feet up this morning, drink plenty and not worry too much!

I find kellymom very helpful. Please ignore your MIL, your baby is gaining weight well isn't she?

thanks T&c, yes baby's fine - this is just a long-running issue with MIL. usually I don't rise to the bait, but she got DH wound up last week, and he is always so supportive of me bf that I was outraged. And yes, i do really know that about expressing not being a good indicator of what the baby's getting... just needed reminding in the midst of my MIL red fog!

Kellymom is out of date with its weaning advice, its still going on about gut closure between 4 and 6 months, the gut and renal system are now considered to be mature enough by 17 weeks.

Weaning advice has changed since 2008 and being extra hungry is now considered a sign for introducing solids.

AAP weaning advice

BDA position statement

AAP allergy advice

bruffin thank you, the BDA document in particular is so interesting, will read it in full later, but it's great to have the latest thoughts

That's interesting Bruffin, why don't you contact kellymom and ask them to update their page? As lots of mumsnetters refer to it. Although I admit I haven't been on the breastfeeding board for a while and been in relationships more. I admit that I started baby rice at 5 months with my hungry boy, just two spoonfuls a day. However BLW is a completely different thing and I know nothing about it as I used Annabel Karmel meal planner book a lot

Ignore your MIL though, ignore ignore ignore ignore x

bruffin - give it a rest. Every time this issue comes up, you're there, stating that weaning advice has changed.

Guess what.

It hasn't.

In most places of the world, it's still considered to be a good public health guide to support exclusive bf for 6 mths. If solids are given before that date, then it should be no earlier than 17 weeks - any earlier than this and there is clear evidence of a risk to the baby's health. The BDA statement backs this up. If people want to give solids before their baby needs them (and it's very unusual for a baby to need solids before about six months) then if they can hold off until 17 weeks they are doing their baby a favour.

There never has been firm guidance in the UK on allergies, mostly because the research is not that strong to show any difference between solids before 6 mths (but after 4) and solids after 6 mths.

Meantime, if a happy and healthy bf baby of below 6 mths shows signs of being hungry, a risk-free option is simply to breastfeed more often. OP - I can't see any benefit in giving formula to your baby (and teaching her bottle feeding skills which she may not have). If you really, really think she needs more calories, then you could choose something less potentially allergenic to give her - given that cows milk protein is a potential allergen and you have allergies in the family already.

I dont think anyone can claim something will definitely happen between now and a week, but personally I would not introduce anything dodgy to a potentially allergic baby for a bit yet.

Without getting into the when to wean debate (!)

• if you're worried about your daughter being allergic to the formula feed pop a drop on her skin and see if she reacts. if she doesn't pop some on her lips the next day and if all good go for it.
• as long as you're regular with feeding, your milk supplies will be fine - you could even express before you give some formula so you've got on in the freezer - that way you manage to keep your milk supply steady.
• When YOU decide it's time to wean - try to avoid allergenic foods and if you want to try them, just do a touch test first. If you get any sign of redness where it was - wash it off asap and get yourself down to the GPs for a referral.

Good luck you!

topiarygirl - testing for allergy is something that needs professional advice, I think, esp in a family with an allergic sib (very allergic, from what the OP says).

The OP can read the links for herself Tiktok, she doesn't need you to interpret them for her.

more links for OP

ESPGHAN position paper which includes allergies

http://www.sheffield.nhs.uk/professionals/resources/infantfeeding/section4.pdf Sheffield NHS advice to professionals

EFSA opinion

s/infantfeeding/section4.pdf Sheffield NHS advice to professionals

NHS Sheffield infant feeding guidelines

sorry previous links didn't work

None of those links indicate anything different - they reiterate the recommendation of 6 mths excl bf with the advice that if parents decide to give solids sooner than this, they view 17 weeks as the very earliest.
Why do you keep saying things have changed???

Clearly she will need my interpretation, if she's relying on yours :(

Hi everyone - I just came on to see if anyone else had posted since late morning - clearly yes! tiktok I always value your advice, so thought I'd just update: formula wasn't needed, as DH gave the EBM and I came home before more feeds needed. I do feel like I'm feeding her every couple of hours or even hourly, 24/7, but actually I'd decided that I was fine with this, as I was worried about allergies, given what my DS has experienced.

I talked to my GP about allergy and weaning a while ago - she said I think, essentially what you've suggested tiktok, that not enough is proven about the links in that 4 month - 6 month period, but that because she knows me well, she could see that I might be happier in myself if I did ebf for a full 26 weeks, so I can never doubt that I did what seemed best. Although my DS is fine with dairy, I was also cautious about introducing formula. With just one week to go, the only thing that made me doubt myself was in fact not wantind to leave DH and indeed DD in the lurch with not much ebm and a very miserable baby. I'll read the other info but think I'll stick with my plan for another week of ebf. Thank you all.

Thanks for update, OP, glad things seem sorted :)

Tiktok - you are in a bad mood (I assume!) There's few as allergic as mine - what I've suggested is safe and what i was recommended to do.

Just a quick thought from me (I am no expert at all but this is my story lol)

My ds had cronic reflux as a baby. We saw a pead regulaly due to his weight and acid levels etc. I was told to Allergy wean him as the reflux could have effected his digestive development. When I got the Allergy wean him thing broken down it went like this.

no cows milk protein until 7 months
no wheat until 9 months
no gluten until 10 months
no egg until 12 months
no nuts until 3 years

DS is now a healthy 20 month old.. I know my problems were not down to allegies but thought the advice may help...

I EBF until 7 months and BLW from there with veg & fruit sticks and then moved on from there. He never had formula i BF until 14 months but that was mainly due to him refusing a bottle, and he still fed every two hours in the night right up until then aswell....... grrrrrrr

I don't think it's sensible to assume that the advice given to you will be suitable for someone else, topiarygirl - that's all. Not in a bad mood in any way, I promise you!

If she is 25 weeks you can start BLW now as long as she holds her head well, sits pretty upright and has the hand to mouth co-ordination. I wouldn't bother with formula.
Supply will naturally reduce with weaning because if it didn't we would have lots of very overweight babies after the weaning started, that is the nature of weaning.
The thing is that feeding works on supply and demand so yes she feeds more but so long as she is gaining weight steadily she is fine. Only one week and then you are there anyway

Just because a sibling has allergies doesn't mean this will necessarily be the case, as tiktok says allergy challenges per say in diagnosed dc should be under strict supervision by a pead. The baby however, should be started on food such as cooked carrot, sweet potato, potato then other veg, non citrus fruit first (more likely to react to these) and always one food at a time so you know an allergy is due to a particular food. Its rare to have anaphylaxis from fruit, lips tingling and rashes are common but usually aren't life threatening.