Support group for those affected by someone else's drinking - thread 3

[pointythings]

Link to previous thread here: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcoholsupport/5177307-continuing-support-group-for-those-affected-by-someone-elses-drinking?page=40&reply=147449407

Continuing our series of threads for people who have an alcoholic in their lives. This is a safe space to vent, look for advice and support and maybe find some strength.

And we are now stuck with 1000 posts of a thread with a spelling error in the title - I'll chase up HQ to see if they can help.

@pointythings I haven’t actually heard anything other than poor me so far. He does have major trauma in his life - it made the papers at the time - but that’s not enough big an excuse to wreck his children’s lives. I’ve felt completely bleak this week and I’ve also felt the guilty little surges of elation at the prospect of not having to wrap my brain around his mental state any more.

It is always worth reminding that the response to trauma is not automatically the choice to dive into a bottle. My DC have had a massive amount of trauma due to their dad's behaviour and they have chosen to work through it using therapy and probably a fair dose of willpower too. I've worked through mine by taking on the running of the family support group for people who have addicts in their lives.

Don't feel guilty about the moments you are imagining how great your life will be without him in it. It is those thoughts that give you the strength to separate from your addict and get that great life.

It’s always poor them and how bad /unsupportive we are or our fault they drink

blah blah

I’ve taken my wedding ring off for now. I’ve put a different ring on so nobody really notices the difference, but it’s giving me a sense of freedom and a bit of headspace.

In fairness he’s been in various degrees of therapy since I’ve known him, he’s never shirked that. The alcohol has crept up alongside it. He’s never acknowledged that he has an alcohol problem so it’s never been discussed with a therapist. I haven’t given up hope that he will address it but I’m realistic too.

Oh, I remember the night I took off my wedding ring and yes to that sense of freedom.

I took mine off. He was why have you done that ?

I said as not together

i missed a ring on finger as been one on there for most of 20yrs so put one that I love on there

ex noticed and he said it was a ring from my first dh (outing of people know me)

I said it wasn’t ans it wasn’t

what is funny is that he took his ring off months before I did - 3w after I kicked him out so he can’t actually say anything 😂

I actually do have a ring on my wedding finger. It was given to me by my foster son, whom I took in in 2019. It's a very plain stainless steel band with three letters stamped into it which are an abbreviation for the affectionate nickname all three of my DC, foster included, came up with for me. It stands for who I am now, as a free woman without an alcoholic ball and chain.

Ironically I’m wearing my eternity ring, but I chose it and love it. It does feel like a bereavement too, though. I was finding it hard to breathe at times yesterday with the grief. If it was just me it would be simple but I’m so devastated for the children. I’ve not heard one single thing from his mouth that puts them first.

Grieving for the loss of what you thought you had is part of the healing process and it's something you have to work through. You may end up needing bereavement support after you have come out on the other end of the process of fully separating from him - as long as you are mindful and acknowledge your feelings, you will know whether that is necessary or not. It's a hard, hard thing to let go of the person you once loved, but necessary.

@Addictforanex it isn't morbid to consider the probability of his early death, as you're right that without a transplant he may well not have long to live. It's sensible to be prepared for any practical/financial implications and to consider how you're going to support your kids.

I got sucked back into things with my Mum a couple of weeks ago. It looked like she was making an effort and so I spoke to her and gently encouraged her. I wasn’t optimistic that she would change but I was hoping she wouldn’t get worse.

Then she spiralled and plummeted to some new lows which include begging for money from some vulnerable people - I won’t go into the details here.

As usual she is denying all of her behaviour and my feelings are all very much back at the surface.

The problem with having an alcoholic in your life is the inability to fully let go. My DH wonders why I don’t just go full NC but it’s impossible for me to completely erase her from my life. She will always be there and I will always have complex feelings about it all.

I’m just really fed up.

Massive hugs @Adultchildalcoholic, I’ve also been doing this sucked back in thing over the past week/ 10 days and I feel absolutely devastated today.

Ex started making positive murmurings about going back into rehab and doing a really long stint this time. I went with him to an assessment appointment as he doesn’t really retain information well/ the nuances of advice anymore - brain damaged I guess.

Too long to go into, but it of course didn’t last, and he is back to - I need to focus on myself and do it myself in the community (because that’s worked out so well for the past 7 months since his last relapse). A lot of other stuff, some very destructive behaviour and a good old few ‘it’s your fault’ in the mix, but that’s the gist.

it’s like I can cope with the addiction, but I can’t cope with the denial of what needs to be done treatment wise? I’m not asking for sobriety, I accept most addicts are never able to get there, but the paralysis and inaction destroys me: I don’t understand why he didn’t love me enough to at least try again to do the hard work, why he doesn’t love his daughters enough to try again at rehab - but long term one this time.

what you said about being unable to fully let go when you have a loved one in addiction in your life nailed it for me - thank you. Ex will always be there. I don’t really know why because he isn’t a permanent member of my family at all unlike you and your Mum who will always be your Mum (though my Dad is an addict in recovery so there is probably something there in that). But I can’t fully let go. I want to, but I can’t.

I think having a loved one in addiction in your life is like a long and slow and endless bereavement. Maybe that sounds dramatic, but god the grief is hitting me today. I’m looking forward to the angry and resentful coming back.

massive hugs to all of us that are treading this path and thankful to everyone’s support on this thread xx

Big hugs right back at you @Nogoodusername

The lies, the paralysis, the inaction, and the dogged determination they know what’s best. It’s exhausting.

I would love to be in my mother’s brain for a day just to try and understand a little of what she is thinking.

I don’t think describing it as a bereavement is dramatic at all. I think it’s a healthy perspective, and extremely difficult to deal with.

like a long and slow and endless bereavement

@Nogoodusername Not dramatic at all – I agree wholeheartedly. I couldn't even really understand it until after my mother died but I realised I'd been grieving for decades while she was alive, with no closure. It's so hard, and we all know how it feels here.

For me, it really helps to know this, and have other people say it. Love to all.

The lack of closure is a massive issue for most of us I think. When the long, long wait for an apology or regret or remorse ends with their death, we're left wondering what the hell went wrong and why.

Yeah, I think the fairness and justice side of my brain ‘needs’ an apology, or at the very least a retraction of all the blame and insults thrown my way?

Since I last typed, I got a barrage of blame from Ex, and totally lost my temper back. Foolish, pointless, and even threw the ‘poor you, poor you, pour you another’ back at him. Classy. Go again tomorrow - operation accept I will never get an apology, accept he will never change, and accept I am powerless to change anything.

I think that might be why my late husband is still in my dreams so often. Because he never once took responsibility and he never once said sorry.

@Nogoodusername
I get the apologies. Over and over and over again. But they mean nothing to me, I’ve come to realise they’re just empty words and an attempt at manipulating me into feeling enough empathy to continue to enabling him.
I get blamed, insulted, threatened, falsely accused, guilt tripped, suicide threats.. then he sobers up and apologises, just to then do the exact same things he’s already apologised for a week or two later.. then there’s another apology, and so on etc.. it’s exhausting, I think i would rather not have the apology at this point.

That’s a good point @MamaBear81, I did used to get those ‘sorrys’. Not for the drinking or the lies or the deceit, not really either for the blaming me. More a kind of ‘sorry I didn’t mean to upset you but I am finding life very hard because [insert excuse ranging from mental health/ ex wife/ don’t see my girls/ the moon (I genuinely have had this one)/ poor health/ someone looked at me funny at AA]

@pointythings I dream about Ex all the time too. It’s like my brain processing the pent up or repressed rage and sadness

@Nogoodusername

My ‘sorrys’ are just him refusing to take accountability… “it wasn’t me, it was the drink, you know I’d never speak to you like that sober” blah blah blah…, and my response used to be “you drank the drink”.
Now I just don’t respond and completely ignore his apologies.

Very wise @MamaBear81. For a while I argued back against the “sorry I”, then I started using the phrase you would use with a toddler about ‘sorry means changing your ways’ and that made him FURIOUS, then I started ignoring them.

Now I need to learn not to come running when he emails about a treatment attempt that he would like support with. He won’t follow through if it involves the hard work and truly surrendering the drink. I need to step off the crazy train better than this.

@Nogoodusername
i used to be the same. There would be a drunken incident, then the apology, then the promise of getting help etc and I felt obliged to support him if he was willing to put the work in and was serious about it.
He was taking two different meds (disulfrum & acomprosat) but still drank on those. Never bothered going to the counselling sessions he was offered etc, has never been to an AA meeting. He thinks that by taking these meds (which clearly make absolutely no difference to him), he’s getting help.
In reality i think he just takes them to give people a false impression that he’s trying, so that they stick around and ‘support’ (aka enable) him.
His parents are just as wise to it as I am now.
They won’t let him stay at their house either anymore. His DD (17) doesn’t believe he actually wants to change either.

@MamaBear81 Ex has been on naltrexone and acamprosate to no effect. He goes through periods of absolutely zero support engagement, and periods of engaging in local support (key worker and meetings as well as the odd AA) and going to therapy. But even that I think it’s a bit of an act (look how much support I am engaged with) because he never reduces his alcohol intake at all, and when he did the home detox recently he managed under two weeks sober afterwards. But if you challenge him, suggest that he probably needs to go back to rehab and for a substantial period of time as the above isn’t working, he gets furious and NO ONE COULD BE MORE GETTING MORE HELP THAN ME.

Essentially, I don’t think he wants to give up the alcohol. He wants us to give him what he wants while still being ‘allowed’ to drink (his ex wife - child contact, me - a relationship, his family and friends - a relationship without conditions). Basically he wants unconditional support and none of us to have our own boundaries because we should put poor him and his difficult life battling addiction first.

@Nogoodusername

He sounds so much like mine, just with more engagement. Mine has only ever been to our local community drug & alcohol team and that’s it. Got prescribed the meds, and it’s as if he thinks that’s enough despite the fact his drinking has remained the same.
I don’t think he wants to stop drinking either - I just think he wants people to believe he does, so that he has someone to rely on when he loses his jobs, blows the money he does have on benders and leaves himself penniless.. then he would come crawling back to me with his false apologies, relying on me to put a roof over his head, pay all the bills, feed him, pay his train fares to attend job interviews (but every job interview he went to, he would come back drunk.
Always found a way to drink despite the fact I had to pay for him to get there in the first place) .. very little financial support from him for our 2yo DD.
The pressure I was under to keep us all afloat was ridiculous, and it made me so angry that within two weeks he would be drinking again. He made me feel used. If i refused, he would run to his parents and expect them to keep him. And when they started refusing, it’s his friends (two brothers who are also alcoholics)
Thats what his idea of support is - giving him money or providing him with a roof, food etc when he leaves himself with nothing.
And for quite a while, I did it - until I realised that what I was doing wasn’t supporting, it was enabling. Allowing him to suffer no consequences as a result of his drinking, and therefore giving him no real reason to change. And he still hasn’t now, because although myself and his parents won’t do it anymore, the friends he’s currently living with do.