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Men should not be able to adopt

194 replies

clarinsgirl · 20/06/2026 16:09

Obviously related to recent tragic events but something I’ve been thinking about for a while. In England and Wales 99% of all those convicted of child sexual offences are men (ONS). 91% of all defendants in child abuse cases are men (ONS). So start point for adoption is men alone cannot adopt.

Of course I realise it’s not that simple but really interested to hear what others think.

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ThePieceHall · 15/07/2026 10:40

Jellycatspyjamas · 15/07/2026 09:30

Fuck me, who thought that was a good idea - there’s so much wrong with this it’s unreal.

Agreed. I have sent this on to Sarah Anderson at FosterWiki as she is a warrior for the rights of foster carers in England and now has a voice at government level.

ThePieceHall · 15/07/2026 11:02

Arran2024 · 15/07/2026 09:53

I keep saying, they have this "Anyone Can Adopt" strategy, and this agency is just taking that idea and running with it and applying it to fostering too. It is why they target imo vulnerable people with a completely unrealistic message - that adoption and fostering are no big deal, easily accessible and anyone can do it.

I adopted 26 years ago and have seen a load of gov initiatives to increase adoption rates in that time. Martin Nairey was made Adoption Tsar with a view to especially increasing numbers of people willing to take on big family groups - he soon changed his tune when he spoke to adopters and actually came out and said thst people should just take one child! Michael Gove, who was adopted himself, wanted what he had experienced for children in care and was responsible for the adoption support fund but also for stream lining things ie hurrying people through the process.

But meanwhile adopters have kept trying to explain the truth to people but they prefer the happy ever after stories from the adoption industry.

I think the only thing I can ever forgive a Tory for is Michael Gove introducing the ASF and raising the rights of adoptive children in education and society.

Arran2024 · 15/07/2026 14:31

ThePieceHall · 15/07/2026 11:02

I think the only thing I can ever forgive a Tory for is Michael Gove introducing the ASF and raising the rights of adoptive children in education and society.

Yes, of course he was a relinquished baby in the 60s, so nothing like today's adoption. I do think he genuinely wanted to help - for everyone else it's more about reducing the costs of keeping children in care.

ThePieceHall · 15/07/2026 16:27

Arran2024 · 15/07/2026 14:31

Yes, of course he was a relinquished baby in the 60s, so nothing like today's adoption. I do think he genuinely wanted to help - for everyone else it's more about reducing the costs of keeping children in care.

Agreed. He apparently had a happy adoption. I do find it interesting that he has come out so late in life, after a marriage and children. I know that we are comparing apples with pears in terms of his 1960s relinquishment adoption and our highly complex children today but I am grateful to him and Sir Edward Timpson for the work they did to highlight the needs of care-experienced children.

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 21:39

ThePieceHall · 15/07/2026 16:27

Agreed. He apparently had a happy adoption. I do find it interesting that he has come out so late in life, after a marriage and children. I know that we are comparing apples with pears in terms of his 1960s relinquishment adoption and our highly complex children today but I am grateful to him and Sir Edward Timpson for the work they did to highlight the needs of care-experienced children.

You're not comparing apples to pears in the slightest. You're comparing adoptee's. That's important. Not withstanding adoptee's have the same issues, regardless of what decade they came from. The only real difference really is that folks these days (some of us) understand that adoption is traumatic.

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 21:48

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 21:39

You're not comparing apples to pears in the slightest. You're comparing adoptee's. That's important. Not withstanding adoptee's have the same issues, regardless of what decade they came from. The only real difference really is that folks these days (some of us) understand that adoption is traumatic.

What's actually so interesting about someone coming out as gay in later life?

I do find it interesting that he has come out so late in life, after a marriage and children.

Are you trying to make a correlation where there are none? Also, a quick search on Google doesn't agree that he's come out. Michael and his partner would disagree with you too. Unless Michael's coming out is something different. Care to elaborate?

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:08

Arran2024 · 12/07/2026 00:42

The bio child grows up with family history/cultural stories and practices and genetic mirroring etc,. The adoptee does not get that connection. The adoptee has no recompose in adulthood to annul that adoption order.
Adult adoptees should have the right and freedom to choose to re-establish their original identity which was previously removed from them without consent.

The adoption order is a piece of paper for an adult adoptee. They are perfectly able to reject their adoptive family, go and live with their birth family, change their name. I suspect that the number if people who do this isn't huge. Reunions often don't work out.

I adopted siblings who were able to see each other every day for mirroring etc. They might have got more mirroring with their birth family but then again they would probably be dead.

Yes an adoptee as you put it are 'They are perfectly able to reject their adoptive family, go and live with their birth family, change their name'

Firstly, that's not the point. An adoptee may want to decide to return to their natural identity but at present that's impossible. Secondly, why do you believe adoptee's want to as adult's live with bio family? You'll find most adult adoptees don't want to do that. Have you considered it could be to do with desiring to live (for some adoptee's) an authentic life and have their rights given back? Perhaps that's not a question you're willing to answer, would like to fudge or for you or another poster (along any moment) to chastise my views as whatever you folks decide to view my contribution to the discussion

The adoption order is a piece of paper for an adult adoptee. An adoption order is not a piece of paper. Don't be so arrogant and flippant. An adoption order legally separates the adoptee from all bio family members permanently. Some piece of paper 📃 eh?

Nobody's taking about reunions really. If there are then that's between the adoptee and bio family. Many work out, many don't. I don't understand your point.

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:15

Arran2024 · 12/07/2026 00:42

The bio child grows up with family history/cultural stories and practices and genetic mirroring etc,. The adoptee does not get that connection. The adoptee has no recompose in adulthood to annul that adoption order.
Adult adoptees should have the right and freedom to choose to re-establish their original identity which was previously removed from them without consent.

The adoption order is a piece of paper for an adult adoptee. They are perfectly able to reject their adoptive family, go and live with their birth family, change their name. I suspect that the number if people who do this isn't huge. Reunions often don't work out.

I adopted siblings who were able to see each other every day for mirroring etc. They might have got more mirroring with their birth family but then again they would probably be dead.

Not all adopted children grow up with siblings. I'm talking about what happens to children that don't have that connection. Your situation isn't everyone's.

Arran2024 · 15/07/2026 22:23

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:15

Not all adopted children grow up with siblings. I'm talking about what happens to children that don't have that connection. Your situation isn't everyone's.

You seem to struggle with people not sticking to your agenda but I am allowed to say stuff you don't like or find interesting. And I don't call other people "arrogant" just because I don't agree with them.

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:38

UsernameAlreadyTaken101 · 12/07/2026 00:47

Also, kinship care is absolutely the first possible option sought where I live.

There is a growing understanding that adoption isn't just a one time 'act' it's a life long.

It's not a "growing understanding" - how insanely patronising. You don't think we adopters realise this???

There is also a great emphasis on culture, background, religion etc when raising an adopted child. I'm surprised you don't know this.
However it is not always in the child's best interest and can cause further upset as it can reinforce the feeling that they don't belong in their new family. Many children who have physical memories of abuse don't really want reminding of their past or to be constantly told that they part of a culture which they don't want to be.
I have a good friend who is physically very different to her (adopted) family and stood out as looking 'foreign' which caused all sorts of bullying and trauma for her growing up. She wasn't remotely interested in finding out what her actual ethnicity was (birth mother wouldn't say) but she was acutely aware that other people had an issue with it. She had a relationship with her birth mother while she was still living but was so adamant that adoption was the best thing that could have happened to her. She had no desire to restore her identity or whatever you are on about. Nor do I. And I'm sure there are thousand just like us.
We don't need others speaking on out behalf of what we feel or what we need!

Edited

It's not a "growing understanding" - how insanely patronising. You don't think we adopters realise this???

Wasn't meant to be patronising. Sorry you've taken it this way. My point still stands, there's absolutely a growing understanding of how adoption affects the child. More understanding is good. It's hardly insane or patronising.

There is also a great emphasis on culture, background, religion etc when raising an adopted child. I'm surprised you don't know this.

I understand this. Doesn't mean that the emphasis is carried through correctly or meaningfully. Perhaps it's something you do, not all.

However it is not always in the child's best interest and can cause further upset as it can reinforce the feeling that they don't belong in their new family. Many children who have physical memories of abuse don't really want reminding of their past or to be constantly told that they part of a culture which they don't want to be.

There's also an argument that a child will try to adapt to their new situation and feel shame or that they would be letting their new family down. Of course there are cases where the abuse has hurt the child absolutely terribly and they can't revisit. Not all thou.

I have a good friend who is physically very different to her (adopted) family and stood out as looking 'foreign' which caused all sorts of bullying and trauma for her growing up. She wasn't remotely interested in finding out what her actual ethnicity was (birth mother wouldn't say) but she was acutely aware that other people had an issue with it. She had a relationship with her birth mother while she was still living but was so adamant that adoption was the best thing that could have happened to her. She had no desire to restore her identity or whatever you are on about.

You can't talk about how other adoptee's feel. Not your story to tell.

Nor do I. And I'm sure there are thousand just like us. Fantastic. Happy for you.

We don't need others speaking on out behalf of what we feel or what we

Adoptee's absolutely do. Particularly from adoptee's. Reforming adoption, how its practiced now and what can be done in the future to help understand the issues and human rights violations adoptee's face has to be key. You're okay with your adoption but wouldn't it be nice if things like open adoption (with safe family members) actually happened in the spirit that's written about? Letterbox letters are so censored that bio mother's can sign off as mum and tell their child they are loved and missed? At the moment that's not happening. At present many bio mothers/family members are being heavily censored in exactly what they can say. For a family member not to be able to sign off as mum/gran or whatever is revolting

Where upon in adulthood, at whatever age can decide what identify is to them and choose?

Adoptee's can't though. You're being terribly misinformed or disingenuous or just really not understanding the law of adoption. No adoptee can under present law revert back to their original identity. That needs to change.

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:44

Arran2024 · 15/07/2026 22:23

You seem to struggle with people not sticking to your agenda but I am allowed to say stuff you don't like or find interesting. And I don't call other people "arrogant" just because I don't agree with them.

Sure. You seem to struggle with different viewpoints though. You seem to struggle with understanding that adoptee's have no rights in adoption. Of course you can call people names like arrogant. It doesn't make it true. I have no agenda, though you're the second poster to tell me in this thread I have! Oh well 🤷‍♀️

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:47

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:44

Sure. You seem to struggle with different viewpoints though. You seem to struggle with understanding that adoptee's have no rights in adoption. Of course you can call people names like arrogant. It doesn't make it true. I have no agenda, though you're the second poster to tell me in this thread I have! Oh well 🤷‍♀️

I called you arrogant and flippant because you were being so by saying an adoption order was just a bit of paper.

If it's just a bit of paper why do children have to lose many rights to access safe external care?

Arran2024 · 15/07/2026 23:06

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 22:44

Sure. You seem to struggle with different viewpoints though. You seem to struggle with understanding that adoptee's have no rights in adoption. Of course you can call people names like arrogant. It doesn't make it true. I have no agenda, though you're the second poster to tell me in this thread I have! Oh well 🤷‍♀️

I haven't called anyone arrogant - that was you!

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 23:09

Arran2024 · 15/07/2026 23:06

I haven't called anyone arrogant - that was you!

I couldn't edit hence my next comment. I stand by my comment that you are being arrogant and flippant by describing adoption to an adoptee is 'just a piece of paper '. It was absolutely an arrogant and flippant thing to say.

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 23:29

UsernameAlreadyTaken101 · 11/07/2026 21:37

Although I should add that according to The Promise in Scotland, the child's views are pertinent to all discussions and decisions.

That's a great step.

ThePieceHall · 16/07/2026 01:42

ForDearSwan · 15/07/2026 21:39

You're not comparing apples to pears in the slightest. You're comparing adoptee's. That's important. Not withstanding adoptee's have the same issues, regardless of what decade they came from. The only real difference really is that folks these days (some of us) understand that adoption is traumatic.

Not any of us here is disputing that adoption is traumatic. As I’ve said previously, you are highly disputatious. To what end, I’m not sure. No doubt you will now accuse me of being rude and others of trying to banish you from the discussion. You seem to enjoy playing the victim. But in so doing you are constantly derailing an interesting discussion.

ForDearSwan · 16/07/2026 02:01

Not any of us here is disputing that adoption is traumatic. As I’ve said previously, you are highly disputatious.

Disputatious (adjective) describes someone or something that is fond of arguing, contentious, or likely to provoke debate. It characterizes people who are quick to disagree, as well as topics, legal issues, or environments filled with controversy and debate. Gosh!

That's your opinion. Which we both agree you're entitled to. I am equally entitled to air my opinions on a public forum. .

You have with out a doubt been rude to me on two occasions, another poster said you were too

You seem to enjoy playing the victim.

No idea what your yapping on about here but it comes across as snide.

But in so doing you are constantly derailing an interesting discussion.

I'm not though.

My point still stands, adoptee's now and from the sixties etc, have the same issues. Nice bit of projection there nevertheless!

Arran2024 · 16/07/2026 09:03

ForDearSwan · 16/07/2026 02:01

Not any of us here is disputing that adoption is traumatic. As I’ve said previously, you are highly disputatious.

Disputatious (adjective) describes someone or something that is fond of arguing, contentious, or likely to provoke debate. It characterizes people who are quick to disagree, as well as topics, legal issues, or environments filled with controversy and debate. Gosh!

That's your opinion. Which we both agree you're entitled to. I am equally entitled to air my opinions on a public forum. .

You have with out a doubt been rude to me on two occasions, another poster said you were too

You seem to enjoy playing the victim.

No idea what your yapping on about here but it comes across as snide.

But in so doing you are constantly derailing an interesting discussion.

I'm not though.

My point still stands, adoptee's now and from the sixties etc, have the same issues. Nice bit of projection there nevertheless!

I suggest you check out the definition of arrogant because it doesn't mean "having a different opinion to me" but rather feelings of superiority and I fail to see how me saying that the adoption order is a piece of paper and that adoptees can choose to go back and live with their birth family shows any feelings of superiority. It's just a comment. You are entirely entitled to disagree with it without throwing slurs at me.

mercutio84 · 10/08/2026 12:22

Ridiculous. As a gay male adopter with my husband we are raising well balanced , happy, thriving children who are loved and doing extremely well given the traumas they had suffered when they came to us. They would have remained in the care system had we not adopted.

The issue is that people with such bigotted opinions like the poster here are far more likely to cause harm to their children than us and THEY should not be able to adopt.

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