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Adoption

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Adoption or IVF with donor sperm?

78 replies

strawberrydreamcake · 20/08/2014 15:30

I am 37 soon and I'm single.

I really would love a child and feel I have a lot to offer to 'motherhood' - am a reception/year 1 teacher and deputy head of an infant school so I love children, as you'd hope!

I always thought I'd meet Mr Right and have the conventional marriage, children and so on. It isn't looking likely so I need to think outside the box as it were.

The things I'm wondering are:

  1. Do your finances/ debt impinge on your suitability? I haven't got a very good credit rating - perversely this is because i have no credit history to speak of! But it has sometimes been a problem.
  1. I'm single. I know they would say this isn't an issue - but would it be really? I don't have any family who could help.
  1. I would want to if possible choose the name of the child myself.
  1. I would prefer to adopt a girl, or two girls.
  1. I wouldn't want any contact with the birth parents at all to speak of.

I hope I haven't offended anyone but the above are the reasons I might be turned away - and if that's the case, I obviously need to think about other ways of becoming a mum. I want to make sure I'm as suited to the process as the process is to me and I definitely don't want to be given funny looks or similar.

Please remember I am new to this so won't know the things you all know.

OP posts:
GrimbleGrumble · 21/08/2014 18:02

Single adopter here too. I work 4 days in a stressful caring job. At the moment it's fine. I couldn't manage 5 days but I'm sure some people do. I need a day off mid week to do the chores and reconnect properly with little one. If my child needed me to I'd give up or change jobs. Having to leave on time every day takes some getting used to and I end up working after little one's in bed but I don't mind. Having friends who are rock solid reliable has been vital for me as little ones get sick and I've also had a series of mishaps due to multi-tasking and tiredness which seems pretty common amongst my single parent friends.

As far as I know I could have got pregnant but adoption was my first choice and definitely right for me but i was never concerned with genes, names or contact. It's the hardest and best thing I've ever done.

Good luck whatever you choose

Maryz · 21/08/2014 18:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

trufflehunterthebadger · 21/08/2014 18:28

OP, at no point did i suggest that you were a hard nosed career woman, did I ? I simply pointed out that your career would have to take a back seat for a while - which is the truth ! If you've read that as some sort of put down or assumption it certainly was not meant that way and you will definitely need to develop thicker skin, as a parent you will need it.

dimples76 · 22/08/2014 07:34

OP I faced exactly your dilemma and I don't think either option is easy. I have chosen adoption and my sister who is also single has twins conceived using donor sperm.

I think you're doing the best thing by researching both options. I was in a similar position to you re housing and shared your concern that if I moved to a family sized home in a more family friendly neighbourhood that I might still be knocked back. Before I made the move I attended open evenings at a range of LAs and VAs and also phoned some sws. All the sws gave me the same message - they wanted me to move pre application but from the information I had given them they saw no reason why I couldn't adopt. That gave me some more confidence to move forward.

I have recently been approved and I would say as a singleton the issue sw seemed most concerned about was support. I think you mostly just need to think of occasions when you might need practical help, emotional support or guidance and think about who you would turn to.

Best of luck

KristinaM · 22/08/2014 21:16

I agree with Mary -if you can give birth to a baby then do so , by whatever means. As she said, it's quicker, much easier , much less stressful and has better outcomes.

Ive done both and the pregnancies and births were a walk in the park compared with adoption ( and I didn't have easy births ) .

Also a single parent it's much easier to plan for the birth , maternity leave and childcare when you go back to work. With an adopted child the timescales are very uncertain, you don't get 9 months notice, and it's hard to organise around your work with a child with " issues " if not with SN.

Unless you have been TTC and had problems, there is no reason to think that you will have problems conceiving just because of your age . The figures you read for " odds of conceiving at 37" are skewed by the numbers who have been TTC for years without success. Obviously if you have been TTC since you were 30 and haven't done so by 37, you are much more likely to need some assistance than women like you who start TTC in their late 30s.

HTH and good luck

HerNameIsRed · 26/08/2014 22:18

Hello, I hope it's OK to jump on this thread. My partner and I (we are a same-sex couple) have been talking about adoption for a while and have been to our LA's information evening - we feel ready to go ahead with it and fully aware of the challenges involved etc ... but reading this thread and the comments about donor insemination vs adoption has made me question whether we have been foolish to discount donor insemination so quickly - we were quite convinced adoption is the route for us so barely talked about donor sperm tbh. we are both early-mid thirties and there are no known reasons why we should have any difficulty conceiving, although neither of us have any strong desire to be pregnant or have a baby with our genes, etc. our main reason for choosing adoption rather than a sperm donor because we felt that there might be some resentment or anger from a child conceived through donor sperm in the future that we have knowingly denied them a father/access to a relationship with their father - and we felt that we didn't have a strong enough justification for this other than wanting a newborn! I know the same could be applied to an adopted child but it feels different IYSWIM? Sorry for the long post, I'm so confused and I just wondered if any of you have been in a similar position or any advice about whether we should give more thought to donor sperm as an option.

Maryz · 26/08/2014 23:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Italiangreyhound · 27/08/2014 00:23

HerNameIsRed welcome. In my personal opinion it is always better to fully explore why you are choosing one route over another in something that has such massive potential in your lives. This is not to say adoption is right or wrong or donor sperm/egg is right or wrong, just that I feel it is very much better to know you have made a decision knowing all the facts and feelings of yourself (and your partner).

As I said up-thread the biological pull can be very strong so good to know you have explored it and know what you are doing is right for you. Talking, reading and thinking about it together need only delay you a short time but in the long run it would be good to know whichever route you go down you have done the best thing.

There is such a thing as donor embryos, which might also be an option if you were to wish to go down that route, the baby would not be genetically linked to either of you but would be biologically linked to the one who gives birth to it.

Adoption can be, I believe, a wonderful thing, and totally right for many people. If you choose it, it is helpful to know you made a positive choice.

Whatever you do, all the very best of luck.

KristinaM · 27/08/2014 07:47

Another option would be to use sperm from a man you know . Obviously you would have to be agree about what role he would play in you child's life.

Very few adopted children have an ongoing relationship with their bio families. Some have some contact, usually a letter once a year TO the birth family but not many write back ( even though that's usually part of the agreement ) . A very few have face to face contact, some do with siblings or grandparents . It's usually with their mothers side. Most fathers have disappeared long ago , or there are good reasons why they are being kept out of the child's life .

I know two lesbian couples who have adopted. One did the adoption route and the other the DI from a friend. Both are mixed race couples and they get far more question from other nosey people and their own kids about ethnicity than about adoption

Once people get over that " how weird to have two mums " thing < yawn>

KristinaM · 27/08/2014 07:55

I should add that we have bio and non bio kids in our family . Most of the time you forget which ones are which, it's not relevant to the day to day parenting stuff.

That will be even less of an issue I guess if one of you gives birth to the child and you are both involved from the moment of conception

I mean it's not important Compared to things such as your child having SN or other challenges . Not saying biology doesn't count at all

It's a bit like the whole " how did you give birth " and " did you breast feed " thing. It's a big deal at the time and it can have long term implications for the child's health . But when you are taking one to gymnastics and another to football and doing homework in the car and sorting out fights and wondering what on earth you will make for tea .......It's all pretty irrelevant .

HerNameIsRed · 27/08/2014 08:58

Thank you for taking the time to reply, Maryz, KristinaM and Italiangreyhound.

Maryz - not offended by your comments in the slightest and they made perfect sense to me.

Kristina - a known donor is definitely something I've thought about as I much prefer that idea to unknown DI, but the friend I would think of is having his own fertility issues with his wife, so not an ideal situation! We don't really know anyone else who would be interested in this/whose partners would be happy with them doing it.

Italian - the biological pull you mentioned just isn't there for either of us at all which is why we've always been quite sure that adoption is for us. I guess some of the comments on this thread (ie that if we can avoid the adoption route we should because it's quicker/easier/better outcomes to go for DI) made me question whether we should give it more thought.

Some parts of DI like I mentioned in my last post make me feel uncomfortable - like how could we justify to a potentially angry/frustrated child who wants to know who their dad is, why we brought them into the world. But is that any more or less difficult than to talking to an adopted child about their potentially traumatic early life?

I have always felt that adoption was right for us and this just feels like a massive curveball - so maybe it's just last minute nerves before we submit ROI? Now I'm just rambling, sorry!

Italiangreyhound · 27/08/2014 09:39

Don't think of it as a curve ball, think of it as a pause to reflect. Adoption is brilliant, you just need to go in with your eyes open. Do not be discouraged.

Greengrow · 27/08/2014 09:42

I have a close relative who had children by donor. I believe that is much the best way. For some of us (and I will annoy the adopters intensely with this) having out own genetic child with our DNA really matters.

Even if you do not have fertile eggs and use a donor egg even then it is a lot simpler than adoption and you have the child to bear it, breastfeed it, have it immediately, make it in that sense.

I am not denigrating in any way the wonderful job adopters do but do consider the donor sperm option. You will also avoid social worker scrutiny and any kind of vetting which must be humiliating and awful for many (again the adopters will disagree with me over the process if they found it easy). Instead you just get pregnant and have your baby and it is none of the business of social services. There are also then no issues with the child later wanting to trace birth parents never mind the better chance the child will not have problems or disabilities which again I admire adopters for taking on but are not ideal.

I don't think my close relative has had any problems with her children having a donor sperm father. They have always known and they know they are special. Anyway your choice and good luck.

Upsydaisymustdie · 27/08/2014 10:05

Green grow, I don't think you'll annoy any adopters by stating quite reasonably that for some people, the biological pull and the pregnancy are very important! However, while the adoption application process is not "easy", neither is it "humiliating and awful" as far as I'm aware (and I'm an adopter with a reasonably large circle of adoptive parent friends). For some people, adoption is very much the positive choice; we are all different!

Maryz · 27/08/2014 10:59

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Kewcumber · 27/08/2014 11:34

Greengrow - perhaps you are right and for some people DNA does really matter.more than anything else. Certainly when I was first trying to get pregnant it didn't occur to me not to try to get pregnant as my first choice. After a lot of "humiliating and awful" fertility treatment I discovered that DNA really didn't matter to me as much as I'd thought, nurturing mattered and being a family and watching a child grow up and all the joy and fulfillment that entailed.

If DNA had really mattered that much to me then I wouldn't have stopped after my fertility treatment failed (as some people do) - sometimes you don't really know what matters to you until its tested and very few parents with the "usual" genetically related children acquired without too much difficulty think that DNA is important to them but in the absence of that having been challenged you don;t really know that, you just assume it.

I think wondering what you would say to a child created from your eggs and donor sperm is very valid and you may well decide against it.

For the record I found fertility treatment significantly more humiliating and stressful than adoption, adoption was longer (sort of) and stressful and a bit intrusive but never humiliating and not really awful either.

However I have on occasions counselled possible single adopters to consider embryo adoption before adoption (even though I chose not to go that route myself) because it seems a sensible option for them.

Good luck Red

Greengrass - it takes a lot to annoy adopters IME - we are past masters in dealing with the worlds most insane and annoying comments and yours weren't either!

Kewcumber · 27/08/2014 11:35

Oops greengrow not greengrass!

Kewcumber · 27/08/2014 16:51

I would have stopped after fertility treatment failed - otherwise that sentence makes no sense at all!

wonderpants · 27/08/2014 17:35

I come into this as a foster carer with again, no intention to offend, just to share our journey.

I have 2 birth children, and when we went through the fostering assessment, I strongly thought that although I could care for a child that wasn't mine, I wouldn't love them the same. After all, I couldn't hand my children over to adopters.

I said to my supervising social worker very soon after our first foster child was placed that I had obviously talked bollocks, as I loved this baby girl as intensely and totally as I did my own. It really proved to me that the DNA that I had thought made a difference, really didn't.

However, this didn't bring heartache when it came to adoption. There were such good reasons for her to be placed further away, and although there is no doubt she would have been loved as our own had we adopted her, the love I felt let me do the best thing for her. I can only liken it to evacutees in the war. I would take any heartbreak for my kids to have a better, safer life. Her family (adoptive) cherish the love we have for her, and we totally respect them as a family.

So I suppose my point is that it is really hard to predict how you will feel. But love is not genetic!!

Italiangreyhound · 27/08/2014 22:44

wonderpants what a lovely post and how brillianty you talked about doing the best for children.

Greengrow you don't offend me but I must agree with Upsydaisymustdie and say I did not find the process of adoption at all humiliating and awful. I wonder if you have been through it yourself or have a good friend who has and has found it humiliating and awful. I am only asking because I think it is helpful not to assume these things unless you have experience of it. I had someone tell me before we started the adoption process that as Christians we would not be treated 'well' or words to that affect. When I asked the lady why she felt that, had she experience of it, she said no, I think she had just assumed it and in fact we were treated excellently.

Also, Greengrow, although I agree with some of your comments and would always encourage people to consider having a baby if that is an option, I do not think genetics or biology are really the crucial point. If I found out my birth daughter had been 'swapped at birth at the local hospital by accident' I would not love her any less. And finally, having had treatment with donor eggs and thought about all this prior to our adoption I do not think you can say of donor insemination " There are also then no issues with the child later wanting to trace birth parents..."

This is because now in the UK (and other places) donors are not truly anonymous, in the sense that children born from donated egg, sperm or gamete can trace the donor if they wish to (while the 'recipient' cannot trace that person themselves). I do not say this to put people off, it is just a fact. If you go to another country then the treatment may be totally anonymous. Wanting the child (if there was one, there was not) to be able to know the donor if they wished was one reason that my husband and I tried to have a baby with donor eggs in this country, because we wanted a child conceived in this way to have the chance to trace the donor if they wished to.

Barbadosgirl · 27/08/2014 22:49

Wonderpants how lovely, thank you.

This was exactly the choice my husband and I had and we chose adoption. I think the answer is that we made that choice because it felt right for us. I am not sure DNA ever mattered to us and I was not someone who was massively bothered about carrying a child. However, that is very important to some people and cannot be automatically factored out of everyone's decision. I also found the investigations and prodding and poking so much more difficult than the approval assessment (firstly, very frustrating that I spent what seemed like months with hands and medical equipment up my nether regions when my fertility was not an issue and secondly, I love talking about myself which is essentially what the Homestudy is about- bit of a show off here).

My bestie chose DS, her child is four and is the other light of my life and this was absolutely the right choice for her. However, the idea that there will be no issues over tracing etc. with DS is something with which I have to respectfully disagree. She is brimming full of questions already (this is a same sex couple situation and so, precocious being she is, she is starting to put two and two together!)

We did an awful lot of soul searching and questioning before going ahead with our path and so I think the posters are being v sensible in asking questions. Good luck with your decisions.

BettyBotter · 28/08/2014 12:32

Hernameisred

You say our main reason for choosing adoption rather than a sperm donor because we felt that there might be some resentment or anger from a child conceived through donor sperm in the future that we have knowingly denied them a father/access to a relationship with their father

I work with families of all sorts I'm not a social worker and I'd suggest that adopted dcs who don't have a 'father-figure' are no more or no less interested or resentful about who their bio father is than dcs born by DI and dcs of single mums who don't know their dads. Many adopted dcs have little info about their bio father and this can lead to all the same questions as dcs who've joined their families any other way. Some might fantasise that their dad would be some kind of hero, others might be resentful that 'everyone has a dad except me' and a large number are mildly curious or just aren't interested at their current stage in life. It depends entirely on that child and their personality and nothing much to do with their conception!

I hope you don't mind me suggesting this. I wanted to give you some food for thought and you sound like you'll be lovely mums just with all the careful thinking you're doing now Smile

Kewcumber · 28/08/2014 12:49

Thats a good point Betty. I am a single adopter and DS who is nearly 9 certainly feels the lack of a father. He's not exactly resentful but certainly he wishes he had one. We have no information about the identity of his birth father.

Its certainly an area we talk about and one that needs careful handling.

Greengrow · 28/08/2014 17:01

My close relative did the donor insemination by importing from the US where they tell you more about the characteristics of the donor. It was a bit mroe expensive but worth it and they are single so the issue that the child might be the genetic child of one parent and not the other did not arise. The children do not yet (teenagers) seem at all concerned they do not see their father - they can let him know they would like contact once 18 but they are not told who he is by the US clinic and it is up to him if he wants contact (this is not the UK system although they were born here the sperm came by import from the US).

It is true I have not been through adoption so it may well not be humiliating and awful. I think I would just have resented anyone checking if I was or was not suitable - it sounds an awful thing to go have to submit yourself to (I had my children in a long marriage and got pregnant each time on the first or second try so I certainly do not have adoption experience).

Italiangreyhound · 28/08/2014 18:32

Greengrow thanks for coming back and explaining why you felt it may be an 'awful thing to go have to submit yourself to '. Of course others may feel this way too, those who adopt and those who do not but I feel that possibly for those of us who have adopted when you understand why social workers need to know all about you, you feel differently. To me the process is not totally invasive and the reason social workers want to know you are financially secure, in reasonable health and that if you are in a relationship it is stable is because they know the children in the looked after system have already had a bad start to life. To have other set backs, like to suffer because of upheaval, marriage break up etc or ill health of parents would be even harder than for the average child.

This is not to say adopters do not get ill, or their marriages do not break up, sadly they do. But to say that the social workers have done all they can to make sure the family/couple or single who receives this child is a safe pair of hands to have a child in.

When we made our wills we had to decide where dd would go in the very unlikely event that both dh and I died before her! (Yes, not a nice thing to even think about). For me it was a no-brainer, I had my sister in mind all along, she is lovely, kind, and has kids, knows what to do, and loves our dd etc etc. Had my sister not been an option we would have had to think very hard hard about who to entrust our beloved daughter to in the (hopefully very unlikely event) of our deaths. Likewise social workers are putting children in their care into families. What an awesome and formidable task! Who would want to do that without full knowledge of the family/couple/individual in question?

For us in our county the adoption process (after initial enquiries and open days) begins with preparation, not to adopt, but to know if you want/are ready/feel able to adopt. That intimal training is so child-centrered that by the time you come through those three and half days you know a lot about what you may be 'dealing with' and I think that helps to put our own minor discomforts about talking about our lives, our pasts and doing the 'homework' into perspective.

I say this simply to explain that this training is there to put off those who are not ready and to galvanise those who are so all that follows, like the social worker visits, are really in a context of what is best for the child/ren.

Our child's social worker visited today. He was very happy. He said he could see a difference in our son. Any mild annoyance at needing to be back for the meeting from our day out melted away as I saw a big smile on his face and he said how relaxed our son looks.

I just wanted to explain because although adoption is not for everyone the process one goes through is to prepare for the task of being approved, and matched and then most of all of raising the child - not simply to satisfy social services. For this reason I do think it helps to see it as a whole.