Changing baby's name - would really like your thoughts/experiences

[fashiongirl2014]

Hi ladies,
I must confess first that I have been lurking on here for a while but was too shy to post! I have found so many of your discussions so useful and only hope that I may be able to repay the favour in future.

I was hoping to get your views on changing a child's first name and whether it is something you have done. I am trying to understand the way people may have chosen to do this, or any tips you may be able to give me.

My husband and I have been linked to an 18 month old which we are of course thrilled about. We are going to panel in April with intros starting beginning of May.

We always said we would wait and see what our future child's name was before we had a view on whether we would change it (based on whether it was a 'normal' name or something crazy/celebrity inspired) however now we are here we are not sure what to do. There is so much emphasis from the SW to NOT change names etc "its the only good thing they ever did for them" kind of spiel which is thoroughly unhelpful! However our baby has a name we like, although the spelling is not the usual way. Our reasons for possibly wanting to change the first name in spite of this is because of the history surrounding the birth family and the type of disgusting criminal behaviour they have been involved in. We would be doing it to protect the child and really feel that under these circumstances we would be within our right to do so.

We were thinking of either keeping the name but spelling it the more usual way and adding a middle name or using the potential middle name as their new first name and making the existing first name a middle name with the usual spelling, hope that makes sense!

Would anyone have advice on how to do this or if in fact you think we shouldn't based on your own experiences? I am keen to find out how negative the responses were from SW/SS when you chose to do this and how you tackled them with it. We also need to consider that the child may be quite aware of what their name is even though they are quite young and so it may be difficult from that perspective too.

Any help/guidance would be so appreciated. Thank you!
breathing sigh of relief having posted finally!!

irishe what a beautiful post. So thoughtful.

I always feel when we talk about this subject that some birth parents will feel very sad about this topic but I also feel that those will be the ones who are not likely to be any kind of risk to their children! If they thought there was any adverse risk to their children they would want them protected, so they may well understand that it is a tough call for parents where there is a risk or where there is a concern.

I am so thankful that it appears there is no risk for us and the name can say but if it could not then so be it.

I think the fact I have lived and travelled in Asia where people often have a Chinese name and then an English name and that they seem happy to be more fluid on a name means I see names as less of a significant factor.

It's a really good point that we will not know what is significant to our child when they are older until they are older!

Some really thoughtful posts here.

We didn't change DD's first name but did change her middle names (so she has family names like DS) but we would have changed spellings if they were wrong / outlandish and would have changed the name completely if it posed a security risk etc. We had the reasons not to drilled into us at prep group but our SW was much more pragmatic and just said in an ideal world no changes would be needed, but we don't live in an ideal world and sometimes you just have to do what you think is right at the time.

As an adopted child my name was very important to me as it was part of my identity. It does worry me that you have not considered this. Also re the " disgusting" criminal behaviour please make sure your child does not pick up on the way you judge their birth family when they are older.

If you take the time to read the thread, six, you will see that many posters have discussed the issue of identity.

And some criminal behaviour is indeed disgusting and individuals and society have every right to judge. I'm afraid that many adoptive parents have to deal with difficult realities and the consequences of them. It's easy to be " non judgemental " about people who batter their kids if you are not parenting a child who is brain injured because of that abuse.

It's easy to not judge pregnant women who misuse drug or alcohol if you are not holding your sobbing child who hates being different because of her disabilities . Or your son who is being bullied because he is " stupid" .

And despite this, adopters have to present as positive a view as possible about birth parents who have done these things. Because they love their children and they care about their identity.

I suggest that you take a walk in these parents Shoes before you judge them.

I find this issue about judging the birth parents endlessly interesting. I've often said here that I think there's a huge gulf between the messages that are used to attract people into adoption ("You don't need to be special! Just an ordinary loving family") and the messages you then get throughout prep and home study which are basically: you are required to provide a lifetime of unpaid therapeutic care, and don't dare to expect anything approaching the joys of normal family life, and be endlessly respectful and positive - almost deferential - about the birth parents.

And of course that is our challenge: to provide the nearest possible thing to normal family life, while identifying and responding to all the ways in which our families are not 'normal'. When it comes to how we talk about birth parents, I think we are constantly aware of our responsibility to help our children develop an understanding of them that is as positive as possible without being negative. That is really not easy in some situations. And I'm aware of plenty of commentators happy to weigh in on these threads to tell us off if we get the balance wrong.

I absolutely accept that my child needs to grow up without feeling ashamed or stigmatised by her origins. I need to help her understand the many ways in which her birth parents could not offer good enough parenting for reasons that were not their fault. But she also needs to attribute a certain amount of blame to them or the adoption simply will not make sense. She will not be able to understand why she can't be with them, or she will idealise them and want to rescue them.

We were actually offered a little girl before we were matched with dd, and the main reason we said no was because her birth parents' actions were so horrifying, so truly disgusting, that I honestly couldn't see how I could manage communicating them to their child. Judgemental? Maybe, but our job is also to transmit moral values to our children. Even more importantly, as they uncover their own reactions to their birth parents' actions, they will look to us to see how we are handling it. We can't lead them into feelings of horror and shame, but neither should we act all cool and neutral and "It's not for me to judge" when any reasonable person would be judging like mad.

Lastly, I kind of doubt that it is possible to truly love someone and not judge those who have hurt them. Our children don't want to be raised by social workers; they want to be raised by parents. And parents don't close down their emotional responses to those who harm their children. So Six, I completely understand where you are coming from. And I am sure there are adoptive parents out there who slag off and demonise birth parents. I've not met them, though, and I've never seen them on the adoption board here. IME we take this responsibility very seriously, but anyone who thinks this is as simple as choosing not to judge is very mistaken. It's damn easy deciding not to be judgypants when you see someone smacking their kid in the supermarket; much harder when you are parenting a child who has experienced serious and sustained abuse.

yyy to everything Devora said.

As our SW told us another prospective adoptive parent said, "I'm going to say yes to rape and no to incest, and that's not something I ever thought I'd have to say".

And then how do you communicate that to your child without making their birth parents sound "disgusting" and while still making them feel positive about their origins, but as you say while still helping them understand why they could not live with their birth family.

About a month after DS was placed with us we found out some additional information about her behaviour that made us very very cross about risks she had put him through. It has been very hard not to judge her for that.

I just today found this article (a bit American but covers several relevant topics):

www.adoptivefamilies.com/articles.php?aid=1817

I am not judging anyone, I am giving my perspective as an adopted child. I suffered abuse and neglect by my birth parents however I would not have been helpful if my adoptive parents had judged them. That is the job of the sw and the courts.

That was meant to say as an adult who was adopted as a child.

Devora is very wise.

I can add nothing to her post, really, other than to add that I myself am an adopted child. As such, I'll say that the adopted child should always know the truth about their parents, even when the truth is unpalatable.

And of course that is our challenge: to provide the nearest possible thing to normal family life, while identifying and responding to all the ways in which our families are not 'normal'

Lastly, I kind of doubt that it is possible to truly love someone and not judge those who have hurt them

Devora - What a fantastic post. You just expressed it all so well

I don't express my judgements to my children. To them, as Devora said When it comes to how we talk about birth parents, I think we are constantly aware of our responsibility to help our children develop an understanding of them that is as positive as possible without being negative

That doesn't mean I don't judge

Or that I don't have a right to judge ie. a right to my feelings. I have the right to feel how I feel (which is hardly just judgemental, but a sometimes confusing and complicated mix of anger, sadness, sympathy, empathy, worry, frustration and more). Likewise, my children have the right to feel however they feel about their birth family and past.

We have to tell our children about their families, pasts and try and answer their questions, but we are not objective outsiders or narrators - we have to sort through our own feelings to do so, be aware of them and work out what we want to say, what we should say, how we should phrase and how much of our thoughts, whatever way they lean, it is appropriate for us to share

That's hard

SoonToBeSix I am so sorry for the things you have been through.

I have found mumsnet mums on the adoption threads (not to exclude dads but have not spoken to many personally) to be a very sensitive bunch. I have read their words, spoken by phone and private messages and met in real life with a number of adopters/prospective adopter through mumsnet. I have found most people to be very non-judgemental publicly. I would also hope to be that way when we finally adopt.

That does not mean that we do not have the right to make judgements about other people's behaviour, or to have opinions.

If a child were to tell me of horrible bullying behaviour at school, I would not say, 'that might be awful but I can't make a judgement.' I would say that is awful and what can we do to help, and maybe their behaviour is coming from their own problems etc etc....' I would reason it out. And I may well need to make a judgement that that behaviour is unacceptable. Because if it is not unacceptable then I might seem to accept it, which I (and the child) would almost certainly not want.

I understand that for a child who is talking or thinking about their birth family it is even more important to ‘reason out' the experiences rather than just giving a knee-jerk response. The family that have hurt the child have also been the ones to give them all the genes and all the family history etc that got them to that early point in life (which I mentioned before) so they are not just any unacceptable behaviour, they are more than that.

For some situations that behaviour might over-shadow other things but it does not wipe them out, if that makes sense.

Personally, I feel we do have a right to make a judgement in our own minds about others' behaviour and if it appropriate and sensitive to do so to talk to a child (once adopted) about the feelings they have. For me their feelings will come first and yet I will always have a right to my own options too, I will just choose (I hope wisely) how I express those.

In a very real sense I am not able to 'judge' birth parents, that will have been done by the people who made the decisions for the child to be taken into care and to be freed for adoption.

The problem is that we use the word 'judgement' to mean the thoughts and options we have about actions or situations, while it also means something legal.

Sometimes making no judgement (in a thoughts a feelings sense) could actually be quite cruel. For example, if someone told me something terrible and I felt unable to make a judgement about it in my own mind; I may feel unable to empathise with them. They may need to hear that they are right to form the judgement they have formed and the only way to truly express that is to share their thoughts.

I want to empathise that as a future adoptive parent I hope I would be very sensitive to my child, to their needs, and to what I felt would be most helpful to them, and I have learnt this from reading other mums on mumsnet adoption threads.

For children ( and adults ) who have been abused, it is very important for them to know and hear that it was NOt their fault, it was the fault of the abuser. So many ( probably all of them ) feel that they are to blame in some way.

Saying " oh well we can't judge, maybe they had a good reason to burn you with cigarettes / let their friends sexually abuse you for drug money " isn't very helpful.

Children who have been through that need the adults in their life to say " what they did was very wrong. If the police had caught them , they would have gone to prison . They did a terrible thing "

I don't agree that we can or should bring up our adopted children with the view that there is no right or wrong. Otherwise they will struggle to make relathionshops and fit in in society.

Devora, lilka and Kristina.... The voices of balance, experience, common sense and compassion as always.... I love your wise non judgemental and realistic opinions ....x

Can I just point out that not all children are adopted due to being abused. Some are put for adoption before birth because the mum feels too young or isn't mentally able to look after them. Does that make them a bad person? They decided to give their child a better life. I was naive. Young. Foolish. Made mistakes. But I never hurt my child. I was in a violent relationship but I did eventually manage to leave. And when someone has managed to convince you that should you leave you will lose your child you do hold on. I am ashamed that at the point I left I was actually at a point that I couldn't take any more and thought that actually our ds would be better off without me than living as we were.

I did have severe post natal depression. I did make mistakes. Am I a criminal. No. I am a mum who was struggling beyond belief. Isolated. Alone and had learnt that abuse was normal from my own childhood.

Miracle no one at all is thinking all birth parents are the same. It's totally right for you to remind people of that fact.

I think the situation that started this discussion was name changing and people have said about security risks in relation to this. We know that there is not a security risk for all children and not all children have been abused.

If they know their own name which at that age they will then I don't think you should change it. But changing the spelling won't affect anything.

I honestly believe the bottom line is every case is unique. I don't think I am seen as a security risk as the judge decided in final judgement that the possibility of Open adoption with once yearly face to face contact be fully explored with potential adopters though it should not prevent a placement should they feel unable to.

My son has a name that is regularly heard and a normal spelling. If I were to trace our ds by his name at one a week I probably still wouldn't have found him at 18. And all I'd be doing is tearing myself apart in the process.

Deliberate abuse and hurting a child isn't forgivable. However were there times I sat n just watched my son feeling overwhelmed wanting to burst into tears. Yes. I didnt though until he went to bed of a night. Maybe I should have asked for help but I'd asked before repeatedly (though under different social services) and no one wanted to listen or help.

My attitude to trying to play that off would be they have to abide by what their mum and dad say. If he did run away to me I would talk to him. Then get him to phone them and tell them exactly where he was and to collect him.

The same applies to my best friends little girl. I know at some point in about ten years time she will turn up on my doorstep. And I will tell her yep she's fine to be here.But she has to phone her mum and let her know where she is.

I think had I of gotten into the freedom programme earlier I wouldn't have ended up in another bad relationship but I did. As a result I lost my child and was raped.

social services also failed to protect my data during proceeedings from my now exh who stabbed me and threatened to kill me despite an order by the court stating my address/personal details be kept confidential. They "forgot" to erase my address (fortunately I had just moved but my best friend lives around the corner so could still have left me in a bad situation and I was living with her at the time)

I havent sued however it has ended up with me needing an anti harrassment order and police involvement and again me feeling unsafe and looking over my shoulder