Any other adopters out there?

[suejonez]

I'm in the process of adopting internationally. Hoping to be matched by Sept. Anyone else?

suejonez - you have to understand that I come from the point of view of having worked for a charity that dealt with these enquiries. Every time there was a feature on Chinese babies in the media we'd get loads of calls from people asking how much it would cost to adopt a Chinese baby! Angelia Jolie was a single parent when she adopted her two kiddies, what are the chances of a single parent being able to adopt legally without a large cash payment being involved?

I'm fairly certain no-one on Mumsnet would do that and I wouldn't deny any of you your children, just as you wouldn't deny me my black brothers in a white family.

But therein lies the difference I suppose, my brothers were British, these babies are being taken from their home countries. Although I do agree with your point about being loved no matter which country they happen to end up in.

I didn't mean my post to be critical of parents on here. I was just having a bit of a rant I suppose having just read more about Angelina Jolie and this thread, it just brought it all to my mind. I also remember the media phoning the founder of our charity and trying to get her to support the theory that rich families are looking to foreign countries more and more to adopt as money overrules law. She wouldn't so he just made something up and wrote his article anyway, quoting our charity as one of those who 'sold' babies!

Anyway, I am sorry if I caused you any pain.

Oops, sorry that post came from me.

Hi
The article in the paper this weekend by Jane Clarke (single adopter - India) was in the Times and not in the Guardian and was def worth reading if you can manage to get a copy from someone.
Good luck to all in the process of adopting whether in this country or abroad it's a long at times fustrating and lonely experience. One which so many don't understand as we can see from the postings here. We have adopted 2 wonderful girls from India (my husband is Indian) and the Indian govt tried very hard to place them with families in India first and then families living abroad where both parents were of Indian origin. We were not the first choice for them but we were at the time the only ones prepared to go ahead and the Indian govt were aware that family life is a better option than life in an institution. We are in no doubt at all how very lucky we have been to be sharing our lives with them. They are very much our real daughters, theybreal sisters and us their real parents. Fate (and much hard work!) has brought us all together - let noone undermine the relationship we have with them! suejonez i hope you are matched soon and can start the next stage of this exciting journey to parenthood.

"what are the chances of a single parent being able to adopt legally without a large cash payment being involved" - pretty good actually. Are you implying my adoption won't be legal?! I can assure you I'm hardly rich and won't be breaking any laws in any countries.

I understand that you find it irritating fielding the wave of calls that come in after things like the tsunami but a microscopic number of those people will go on to adopt. You cannot tar all intercountry adopters with the same brush as an uniformed general public who are acting on the spur of the moment and would never get through even the earliest of the many, many hurdles involved.

You're entitled to your opinion that children should stay in their birth country. Do you apply that philosophy only to children who don't have parents or do you believe that children who have a family should equally be barred from emigrating to an ethnically different country? Just interested how far the arguments carries.

I don't agree that the fact that your brothers are british makes a difference. Children don't get a choice about when, where and to whom they are born and I don't accept that british children are inherently more deserving of a home than any other child. but we can agree to disagree on that. If it makes you feel better, the £3,500 that Richmond council charged me for my home study will be put towards the local authority care for the children that they wouldn't let me adopt because I'm white.

You don't need to apologise, I don't know you and therefore wasn't hurt by your views. I learnt sometime ago that the majority of people I tell about my adoption feel entitled to an opinion and feel obligated to share that opinion with me. After a particularly difficult episode with a friend (now more of an aquaintance) I developed a different attitude.

My deal with anyone who feels the need to share their disapproval of my adoption is - I won't judge your decision not to adopt if you don't judge my decision to adopt.

Beemail - was it the Sunday Times? I have that - just haven't had a chance to read it yet.

suejonez, I had no idea of your situation, if you were married or single or gay or anything so my post was not personally directed at you. I held up Angelina Jolie as an example of someone that I think critically of.

I know in this country it is hard enough to adopt if you are married let alone single. I also know that it is easier to adopt in Middle East countries if you have the money. Those are facts and not based on yours or anyone else's personal experience.

Don't get so defensive about your adoption that you are take every argument personally. I have seen both sides of adoption, I've seen children given loving homes and I've seen people hand over wads of cash to 'buy' their children (the recentish case of the Kilshaws and the two little babies from America springs to mind). These are the cases that I am criticising, not yours.

Difficult to know how to respond to you Rhubarb without escalating this.

My post stated quite clearly that I was single so I'm sure you can see why I would be defensive at your implication that the only way single women could adopt was by illegally buying children.
The Kilshaws attempted to adopt almost 7 years ago now and the law was changed (partly as a result of that case) to prevent the same thing happening again.

I don't feel that I was being defensive (at least not in the way you mean), I don't have to listen to others opinions on this matter and be silent. I choose to reply with my own beliefs. If you had said that you thought women should not be allowed to have elective caesarians and I'd had one and you KNEW I'd had one, I would take your comments personally. It's difficult not to.

I do however understand that you didn't intend to criticise me personally.

I did not read your post that said you were single. I read the OP and that was it.

Sorry if I said anything wrong. Am I not allowed a say at all? I have not disagreed with you as far as I know, I have voiced a general opinion without quoting any other posting or referring to any posters situation. I have drawn from my own experiences.

Ok, I'll leave you to it.

I don't honestly see how I have offended, but I'll apologise anyway if it stops an argument.

No need to apologise - as I said "I do however understand that you didn't intend to criticise me personally"

I am slightly confused that you didn't read either post where I said I was single as they were in reponse to your posts!

I read your post on Monday, 29 May, 2006 11:24:22 PM and that's when I realised that you were single, before then I hadn't a clue about your personal circumstances. I am wary of responding to posts as my opinion was meant to be general and not to offend or criticise any Mumsnetters.

i don't see what's so wrong about going abroad to adopt and not wanting to do an in-country adoption first. most children up for adoption in this country do have special needs or are older; this may not be for everyone who wishes to adopt. and if they are able to go elsewhere to adopt a baby if that's what they want, then i don't see why not.

It's OK - I also know that you can't be expected to realise how many people take it upon themselves to inform me of their view on adoption when I tell them I'm doing it. It particularly irritates when they would never in a million years consider adoption themselves. (no thats not aimed at you! I know you would consider it - you mentioned it before)

As for the bloody Kilshaws, I could murder them myself for the damage they did to legitimate adopters in the UK.

Difference of opinion and a bit of argy bargy never hurt anyone. We can kiss and make up now. (thats the closest face I can make to a "kissy" one)

They are not the people I have a problem with expat, my problem is with those people who pay for children and governments who don't bother to check up on those people or go through the right channels because to them, one less unwanted baby is one less problem for them.

I think there are more illegitimate adopters than we care to know about. Suejonez I wish you well!

Suejonez - the article was in the Times mag on Sat. I support you wholeheartedly - I'm not sure how one would define an "illegitimate adopter" all I can say is that when we adopted our children there is simply no way we would have been able to do so without going through intense scutiny both here and in India. We were not allowed to even make a donation to the orphanage at the tme of adoption in case this was ever misconstrued as paying for a child. Whilst I know there are unscupulous people out there I can say that over the years i have met many intercountry adopters - most of whom would have been prepared nay wanted to adopt here but were unable to od so because of reasons similar to our own. We are a racially mixed cpuple and they wouldn't place a white or an ethnically Asian child with us and there were very few children in the care system for whom we would have been deemed to be ethnically suitable. We were prepared to consider older children and those with disabilities. I agree - do not criticise adopters unless you have been there yourself. It's a hard route to parenthood and presents additional challenges throughout . It' s not one anyone I know has undertaken lightly and most have us have experienced great difficulties en route. The rewards are great and i can recommend it wholeheartedly but agree with Suejonez that for some reason once we announce our intentions we become open to the kind of questionning I know many would find it hard to believe. you really just have to rise above it and keep the end in sight!!

I understand the road you have to go down. My sister adopted 2 children when it was thought she could have none of her own, she had to wait 2 years. In fact, adoption sort of runs in my life, with my two brothers and I also have 2 friends who were adopted.

I'm all for adoption and I do think it's a crying shame that so many unwanted babies are aborted because the mothers never even consider adoption, it just doesn't come into it - but then I suppose it is a very difficult thing to do.

Not so much in this country, but in America there is money being exchanged for children. They bypass the government because some of these children are never registered, and the orphanages just want them off their hands, they have more children than they can deal with.

I realise that once you tell people you want to adopt, they suddenly become the world's authority on adoption! But that's the same once you announce your plans to have a baby/second child/get married or do anything in life. It's all part of the territory!

Sue if you're still on this thread and still looking for a car seat I have a spare baby one you can have for free. I may not be of any use to you though as it only goes up to about 9months. It's the Mamas&Papas click in base one. We're in Hampshire if that's anywhere near you. If you're interested, CAT me in case I forget to check this thread again as I was really just being nosey about all the new boards.

If not, then all my very best wishes for the adoption and motherhood.

Thanks homemama, I'm still trying to decide what to do, I'm off to check out Tesco Extra at the weekend as I'm told they do some reasonable 0-4 seats by Britax. Kind of you to offer.

So why does being rich make you a less desirable parent. It only makes your difficult and painful journey of adoption just a little easier. Why on earth would you begrudge that of anyone. And if money gets children out of an orphanage and into a family, when the government can't do it. What is so wrong with that. When the day comes that there is a loving family for every child on this planet, then maybe we can afford the luxury of saying that rich people shouldn't be able to adopt more easily than poor people. In the meantime, I think that almost anything that gets children into the hands of people (whatever their color, race, marital situation, sexual preference) who will love and cherish them, is a good thing.

suejonez, I have a car seat in the uk that is good from birth to 80 lbs. It goes frontwards and backwards and reclines and converts into a booster seat and makes tea for you in the morning (just kidding about the last bit). It would be my pleasure to give it to you. Only catch is that it is in London with my husband. Are you anywhere near London? I am in the usa, so you would have to pick it up from my husband sometime between the 17th and 22nd of June. It is in exellent shape and has not been in any accidents.

SofiaAmes, I will be your friend for life if you give me your car seat - if you can get me one that makes tea in the morning I may have to marry you and have your babies. Actually I can't do that its a lie - hence the adoption - so you're safe on that score.

Yes I'm in London - live in Kew so I could pick up and Sunday 17th would be fine.

You have no idea how appropriate your offer is as I've just shlepped all the way out to New malden to tesco Extra in pursuit of the elusive Britax car seat they supposedly sell. Hah. Hot and no car seat.

You are an angel! Can I buy your children something instead if you don't want any money for it?

SJ

So happy, that I could help.

We have just sold our house in Acton and my husband is staying with a friend in Finchley. He is scuba diving in Egypt at the moment and will be back on the 16th. He then leaves for the usa on the 23rd, so that's the window for getting the seat. My dh has to find the various attachments and hopefully he knows where they are. I did put them all neatly together with the seat, but he is male after all. I can't ask him right now, so I think the 17th will work, but won't know for sure until I speak with him.

The car seat is an American one, by the way.

Don't worry about anything for my kids, dh will have enough of his own stuff to bring over. Just give a good loving home to your new child and the whole world will be a better place.
Why don't you CAT me and I'll give you numbers etc. for dh.
I can also give you lots of advice about travelling with small children long distances on planes. I am now an expert on it having done the 11 hour trip from london to la twice a year since my kids were born.

I assume the car seat being American is OK - it doesn't eject non-american children does it? I cat you tomorrow and wait to hear if Sunday 17th is OK.

Thanks again

SueJ

Hi everyone,
always feel like a gatecrasher joining in established conversations. I'm an approved adopter waiting for a child to be found. We've two birth children of our own and wanted to give a child a chance in life that had had a bad start - feel awful now tho - s.w brought details of a child and it's not tugging at my heart strings yet, don't feel any emotion towards this particular profile, but loads of dread as the child has issues in abundance which I don't know if I could cope with.

hi Lilybongo its me how you doing give me a ring if you want why not start a new thread other people may have experience of this specific circumstance we were told of a child and we decided to say no i felt very guilty for a very long time i still think of that child i asked a few times and found out that the child had been adopted so a happy end but i felt that there must be something wrong with me why couldent i accept that child .