Sovereign Citizens - they aren't driving, they're travelling and don't need drivers license, insurance etc

[cakeorwine]

Inspired by the Auditor thread. There are people who think they are sovereign citizens and don't need a licence, tax or insurance

Loads of YouTube videos from police interacting with them and normally breaking their windows

How do people fall for such stuff?

An inability to think critically - either because of stupidity, ignorance or poor education.

If you don’t apply any critical thinking, the logic is quite sound in their argument. If you, for one split second, apply any outside knowledge it all falls apart.

These are great clips on YT, very entertaining when I've had my fill of reading for a while! Even better are the DUI (drink driving) vids. In most states of the US the cops must offer a standardised field sobriety test (walk the line, stand on one leg etc.) to ascertain if the driver is impaired. Honestly, some of them can't even walk but still go through the tests. Only in the States ha ha. Some very funny, some very scary when you think these people were actually driving before being stopped.

Anyway, you can see how much of an expert I am re DUI and Sovereign Citizens (they are nuts mostly), all gained from watching YT. It's great.

I think you also need a large dash of narcissim and paranoia too, just from the self confidence to spout twaddle and complete conviction that everyone is always thinking about "tricking" them because they are so central to everyone else's life.

Yes I was going to say I thought it was the good old Freeman of the Land people

They dont pay their mortgages and then wonder why their house gets repossessed

They manage to take one out in the first place though, they're engaged with society and rules and regulations enough to do that. Strange

They’re basically tight arse CFers

It probably started with a man who read a book ....

I too enjoy those YT US police bodycam videos & it's astonishing how stupid some people are.

If a large police officer armed with a gun, a taser, a pepper spray and a huge baton asked me to get out of my vehicle I think I'd fall over my own feet in my eagerness to comply. But a lot of drivers prefer to argue or fight, turning a mere police warning into a felony with jail time. And they're not all Sovereign Citizen crazies.

Some of the airport bust up videos are entertaining too.

There are some absolutely awesome videos on YouTube with some judges in America I love it. Judges mogen and Simpson being a couple of my favourites.

Yes

Mark Gordon, father of hapless Constance Marten’s children declared himself a Sovereign Citizen and cited the Magna Carta a lot in court.

It was behind a lot of their conspiracy theory / off grid / anti vaxxer/ anti authority beliefs

To me a lot of them seem like they have no power in their day to day lives so this is a way to get some, so a bit marginalised in their real lives. A bit like some people who are on volunteer committees and are power mad with it as they've never experienced being in charge of anything before.

Blimey that Irish policeman was so chilled! And the policewoman was so pissed off!

what an idiot man getting his family stranded.

Big thank-you to @cakeorwine for posting this.

The Irish policeman is so chill but firm in response to the eejit insisting he has an automobile not a car so doesn't need a driving licence.

Have an anti vaxer in my wider family who believed all this for a while and attempted to use it to get out out of a a ticket that arrived as he drove in a bus lane I think, anywho…Mang appeals later he had to pay £300 for a ticket that would have cost him £40. Still believes in it, so go figure!

There sure are some deluded numbskulls about, aren't there?

Hapless is not a word I would use to describe Constance Marten.

Apparently you don’t have to pay council tax if you didn’t sign a contract. Yay!

There's an instagram account of this type called Zen Jungle where a woman goes on about "legal identity" and how you as a person are separate from your legal identity. She tells us all about how her child has no birth certificate and that they pay no taxes. She also refuses to call herself and her husband "parents" because that then gives the government power over their child (or something like that - it didn't make a lot of sense).

Darrell Brooks comes to mind. Represented himself in court, invoking maritime law. Guess where he is now? Yep, prison. Scumbag. His outbursts are on YT in all their glory.

American here. This is where the movement originated. I think some get drawn into it as they think it offers an easy way out of some problem they’ve caused. So if they’ve had their drivers license revoked, they convince themselves that the right to travel lets them keep driving. If they’ve can’t pay their debts, they buy into the idea that the government keeps a secret account for them to draw on, etc.

The right to travel is in the constitution, but it was put in to prevent states from restricting or taxing the movement or migration of people from other states. The Supreme Court ruled over a century ago that states could still require people to have drivers licenses and register their cars.

I’ve never met a sovereign citizen, but they are out there.

Family member has declared themselves a SC. Hasn’t paid council tax or utility bills since the pandemic when they became sucked into all this nonsense. Believes they’ll be absolutely fine (does pay rent however) and doesn’t believe in climate change but has lots of woo ideas. It’s insanity but hasn’t had to deal with any consequences of refusing to pay for their bills.

Why haven’t their utilities been cut off by now? And how do councils enforce tax collection? Here if you don’t pay your local property taxes, the municipality can take the title to your house and sell it to settle your tax debts, and that does actually happen to a lot of sovereign citizens.

There is a child living at the property so they can’t cut off their utilities. But I’m surprised that they haven’t done more than send letters.

The council probably haven’t noticed

Oh I used to work within the court/ police system and youd be amazed how common it is.

People genuinely think that if they say they are xyz of xzy then they will be let free or they dont consent to be governed. As if that loop hole wouldn't have been closed