why are people so against judging criminals, fraudsters and chronic scroungers?

[YourWaryPlumBalonz]

There's someone at my church who is well known for avoiding work whenever possible and was actually convicted of fraud. Yet whenever anyone expresses a negative opinion about her, we're told not to judge.
I understand that nobody is perfect and that people can make mistakes. I also appreciate that people can have difficult backgrounds, health problems or circumstances that contribute to bad decisions.
However, at what point is judgement simply a reasonable response to someone's actions? If someone repeatedly lies, cheats, commits fraud or lives off others while expecting sympathy, why is it wrong to think less of them because of that behaviour?
To me, there seems to be a difference between judging a person's worth as a human being and judging their actions and character. If someone's behaviour consistently harms other people, shouldn't we be able to say that's unacceptable without being told we're being unkind?

MrsBennetsPoorNervesAreBack · Today 19:04
Interesting that you mention your church.
Doesn't your religion teach you not to judge others.

What about if the fraudster at the church was a man who had been to Eton, votes Tory and voted leave in the referendum. Would it be ok to judge him?

Well, I wouldn't know. I'm not a Christian.

But my understanding is that Christians are not supposed to judge.

Exactly. Judging isn't for people who commit serious crimes, its for silly people who vote for things like Brexit or demonstrate against housing thousands of men in their local villages.

The Bible is full of judgement.

Jeremiah 17:11: "The person who gets money dishonestly is like a bird that hatches eggs it didn’t lay. In the prime of life he will lose his riches, and in the end he is nothing but a fool."

No of course we should judge bad behaviour. Christians are urged to use discernment. But judging another person is different. We should judge wrong actions as wrong, but extend understanding where possible to the person.

It'll be because of your religion. I'm not religious, no one in my life would tell me 'not to judge' a convicted fraudster. It's entirely reasonable to judge as untrustworthy someone who is proven to be untrustworthy.

If they're telling you not to judge her in a general/gossipy way then that's entirely in keeping with their, and presumably your, philosophical beliefs.

If they're telling you off for suggesting they shouldn't have made her treasurer, that's just stupidity.

Are they asking you not to judge or are they asking you not to have a bitch about her at church? Some people feel uncomfortable being there while people are doing a character assassination and then having to watch everyone smile and be nice to the person next time everyone meets. It can feel two faced even if you aren't the one doing the bitching.

Because if you pick the shittiest person in a given situation, pour all your empathy onto them, come up with dumb excuses why their behaviour is fine (linked to their “identity” for extra cookies) and loudly defend them then everyone will think you are great and you can have a good bask. You can see it right now with the news footage of France. Someone made a literal video demonstrating how it’s not that bad to have your face burned off by a stranger in the street after that woman was attacked and got loads more positive attention from morons than if she’d said “fuck me - burning strangers in the street is a bit much to protest that your textbooks are getting old”.

I used to go to church but left about 5 or 6 years ago.
I actually think this is how lots of inappropriate sexual and criminal behaviour goes under the radar in churches because everyone is so keen not to judge. People turning a blind eye to abuse for fear of not being judgemental gives people the green light to get away with it.
Theres a thread (cant remember on what board) about a minister at a church who was suspended and investigated for sexual misconduct, a lot of people were involved in that church or knew the minister. Lots of people knew "but didnt want to judge"

One family in the church actually offered for a convicted paedophile to stay with them when they had young children....which i was quite astounded by, but they were all about forgiveness, and not judging. Maybe they are better people than me but there isnt a chance id be willing to take that risk.

Love the sinner, Hate the sin ?

Just ask others at your church OP, or do you need to hate the sinner? Why?

I find this mostly in British culture. Other cultures judge, and rightly so. It’s part of societal expectations and you are shunned if you don’t conform.

Part of the point of Christianity is that pretty much everyone has done things wrong.

in general the focus tends to be on supporting each other to be better rather than on telling someone they’re a bad person.

Yes, presumably that’s the point. Your religion is encouraging you to do something it considers worthwhile- if it wasn’t difficult then wouldn’t need the encouragement.

Maybe speak to your priest/vicar/whatever.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5590438-im-often-confused-by-discussions-around-poverty-addiction-and-crime-because-they-seem-to-focus-heavily-on-society-and-not-much-on-individual-responsibility?reply=155421178

Why you starting so many threads OP and barely bothering to reply OP?

i cba tbh

And there it is.

But you can be bothered to shit-stir. Funny that.

OP have you been bored this weekend.

If a man shall not work, neither shall he eat.

Yeah and I think worth reporting at this point.

I started writing a long explanation on Judge not.....as one of the most misinterpreted pieces of Scripture bandied about this days, it's about hypocrisy if you read the context.
But this is Munsnet so I'm either going to be calked a God botherer or no one will bother to read it.
But if you are interested in getting the interpretation of it correct. And many other Scripture quotations remember Context, Content and Intent.and Google.

Ahh yes, but you are quoting the Old Testament there. Christians are supposed to follow the new covenant and all that.

As an atheist, this is something I find interesting. How like the OP appears to do, Christians use the OT and NT and intermix them to get to some sort of position that suits them.

Someone said they leave it to the legal system -hilarious!
we’ve no prison places, years of wait for a court case, slapped hand for much of criminality, and woke judges who side with the poor criminal.

So many purported Christians in this country; so few actually practising the teachings of Christianity.

How can you know what the many Christians are doing or saying - are you God?