Andy Burnham’s coup

[Sandysandybeaches]

I’m feeling increasingly annoyed and worried about this.
He seems like a decent chap and clearly popular in Manchester but it feels increasingly ‘off’ that he is arriving like done kind of messiah to save us all. It feels like an arrogance and very undemocratic. Were there really no Labour mps up to the job?
His aims and vision sound great but there was nothing about how he’ll actualy achieve it and I worry that people will soon feel let down and the trust in mainstream parties will be broken even further.

Thr focus on Manchester I find worrying from someone who wants to run the entire country. How does an extra layer of admin in other place help everyone else who still lives somewhere peripheral? No offence to Mancunians but they’re even further from me than London and I am not interested in the place, in fact it sounds like rural areas, the south west and north east will be even more ignored.

It does feel increasingly like a bloodless coup.

Yep

It does feel increasingly like a bloodless coup.

I agree.

I broadly agree although I think accents are always doubled edged swords. Burnham and Raynor may both suffer from being perceived as a less intelligent but I think they are also automatically credited as being more down to earth and in touch with the 'common' man or woman. Both play on this a lot and this is why they may be seen as less intellectual than the Starmers or Sunaks. The problem with being an intellectual though is you're seen as being out of touch and unrelatable for great swathes of the population.

It's all a dangerous dance and unfortunately with politics, many people feel that they need to lean into perceived strengths which might further compound perceived weaknesses in people's minds.

🤞

I see a Reform and Tory pact getting the numbers before the leftish coalition

Not across the UK, in London perhaps. But rents still rising elsewhere.

Unlike your dad I daren't venture a prediction about a winner, but he's obviously right that a constituency exists who are anti Reform more than they're pro anything else. There's the split even on the central to far right as well.

Be interesting to see if FPTP survives a genuinely multi party system with no clear runaway leader, if that's what we still have by the time the next GE rolls around.

I thought that Burnham has also given promises on PR, too. Which is why Caroline Lucas was urging the Greens not to put up a candidate even in Makerfield, to endorse Burnham.

Thanks for sharing that. I think he should publicly apologise for this and if he did the same to Truss and Sunak, too. This is setting a very poor standard - especially as it is a way of courting a lot of likes and support.

They didn't really campaign much, from what I hear. The Lib Dems neither. Maybe it was sort of unofficial. Although it could've been to save resources and keep powder dry for the mayoral elections as much as anything. I'd expect Labour to win that one, but the Greens must have their eye on second.

I would also say GM contains a constituency of people who are broadly left or even central, would've been pissed off with the Greens/Lib Dems for splitting the vote if Reform won or got close to Makerfield, but when not pissed off will vote Green or Lib Dem in council elections and perhaps as a first preference for mayor with Labour 2nd. It made sense for both the Greens and Lib Dems not to do anything to endanger that, for a seat they couldn't win.

Did you think it was undemocratic when Farage stood down 317 Brexit Party candidates in Conservative seats in the 2019 GE?

I think it was her dad who thought it undemocratic not her.

Most of what Farage does seems undemocratic to me. Being bought off by foreign powers....?

It's not a coup. He is a democratically elected MP. There will be a process before he becomes Labour leader, which is far from guaranteed. Is he our saviour? No. Might he do a decent job? Yes, given his experience and credentials. We better hope he can.

Indeed. Sorry, I slightly misunderstood your post. It is your dad that thinks tactical voting is undemocratic, not you?

The only reason he has mentioned the emphasis on the north is because Labour have lost the northern heartlands to Reform. He thinks that appealing to their sense of northerness is going to override any other issues they face or are worried about and turn back to Labour. It is nothing to do with wanting to run the whole country effectively, it’s a ploy to keep Reform out of those areas which will weaken Reform in the GE. It’s just about power for Labour, not what is good for the country.

I can’t stand any of the fuckers any more. There is no integrity left. Just power grabs and u turns when they feel settled.

I think Labour was doing a decent job in difficult circumstances and it's a shame the merry-go-round of PMs is continuing. Still, Burnham is intelligent and has a good track record of getting people on side, so I hope to God he stays. I'm not optimistic though. I think Labour could bring back Jesus H Christ and give everyone in the country 100 quid and a playstation and the papers would still moan.

I genuinely struggle to understand this level of cynicism. Why wouldn’t a man who was born & raised in the North, who represented a Northern constituency for 16 years and who was the Mayor of a major Northern city, not be genuine in caring about the North?!

Were you asleep when May, Sunak and Truss became PM without the public having a say or was it OK then because they were Tories?

This. Completely. I would really struggle to vote Labour again simply because of the way that this has been done. What a waste of money with the unnecessary by-election and unnecessary mayoral election now required in Manchester.

The thing I find most interesting about the whole shebang is that so many of the Cabinet possibles are from the Blair era.

Why do we not have more amazing backbenchers? Why is Burnham the only candidate for leader out of over 400 MPs?

I think a lot of people, myself included, did indeed think it was an absolute travesty and thought they were voting for something different.

What is more important to me is that Burnham called out the others, even though they held high office (were not only already MPs) and some of them had internal elections. Burnham called for a GE when it was someone else.

Also possible.

Critics of the two party system may see a Tory/Reform/Restore party v a Labour/Libdem/Green party.

Plus ca change.

I was starting to warm towards Starmer.

I think this coup has been a huge act of self harm from Labour.

They seem focused on lobbyists, unions and internal politics, with constituents as a very distant afterthought, and actually running a prospering country nowhere to be seen.