DD14 hatred of PE is causing problems - what should I do?

[teaandtoastwouldbenice]

I know it’s fairly common and I certainly didn’t enjoy PE - but it didn’t really cause that much of an issue. Hoping other parents with similar age DC can advise.

DD14 year 9 was a sporty child, in all the school clubs, competitions and a girls football team.
Now she is obsessed with worry around PE, she begs for a day off each week (I don’t let her stay home) she’s tearful even thinking about it in the lead up to Thursdays lessons. She doesn’t want to get out of bed on Thursdays, sullen and unhappy - basically it’s becoming far too big an issue.

Main problem seems to be the communal changing, her hair getting messed up and her getting sweaty - all minor fixable issues I realise but it’s not minor to her. She doesn’t like it that it’s boys and girls, says the other girls hate sport so don’t join in, so it’s 2 hours of boredom and feeling depressed about how she used to be good at sport and now isn’t (she’s fine and does outside sports clubs)

Otherwise DD has been a really good student, excelling academically, great behaviour in school, good group of friends.

This has gone on for months and I don't know how to tackle it. It’s becoming a real barrier to school on the whole and her feelings about going in. She’s miserable when she comes home and ‘hates’ school - despite doing well.

I’ve spoken to staff twice. They are not seeing a issue as DD is well behaved, joins in etc

I had no idea some schools still split by gender for PE nowadays. The city where I live is all mixed gender for all PE lessons - I'm in Scotland though so maybe it is different elsewhere. It's definitely all together in any state school around me though.

I wish PE was optional - some kids thrive in it, and for some it's genuinely distressing. I was in the latter group and it didn't do me any good at all. I made up every excuse going and almost didn't finish high school because I was failing PE (I'm American). They were going to make me go to summer school just for PE until I conveniently 'sprained my ankle'. Luckily my mum had nothing but sympathy for me and wrote me many, many excuses.

If you've tried offering all the various options for hygiene / products / new clothes / etc etc and it is genuinely making her this miserable, I would absolutely ask the school what they'd need from you to excuse her from PE. No reason to trash her mental health as she's staying active in ways she enjoys. If she wasn't active in other ways I might push her a bit, but if it's just PE that's the issue I would support her in finding a way out.

Other possible reasons: earache, sensory issues such as the smell of the changing rooms and the noise in the sports hall.

Solidarity with her, I was a serious PE hater. Hated getting changed, hated getting sweaty, hated getting my hair messed up. I have ASD as well so the sports hall was a sensory nightmare. The smell of a sports hall makes me feel sick.

If she’s sporty, fit, and she really really hates it I would ask if you can withdraw her. Does it teach reliance? No. But I remember how much I hated PE and it put me off exercise and sport for years so I think if I’d been pulled out it would have had a net long run benefit.

School PE facilities and teenagers just aren’t a good fit. Changing rooms are never clean, there’s always a weird smell and there’s never any privacy. It’s not a fight I would have personally. I’d be the parent writing notes and making a nice private gym available with supplemental sports activities. I don’t understand why they keep trying to flog this horse when time could probably be better used elsewhere in the curriculum.

You ucan ask for her to be withdrawn from PE but they might say no, and they also might say only if you physically come and pick her up, because we have no one free to look after her.

Talk with her about whether there are any levers or ideas that might help. It might give you some clues towards things that have distressed her that she hasn't told you about.

There is value in commiserating with her and expecting her to get on with it. In Y11 my daughter like most others had a countdown to being able to give it up and we cheered her along with it. But yes there comes a point to look at other options. Some schools will quietly have a SEN type group away from the mainstream class - PE in a group of 60 is basically inaccessible for some children so schools often need to make alternate provision - or they may be able to give her a break from it with 6 weeks of forest school or something. It's treading a line between encouraging just sucking it up, which really is valuable, and where that gets counterproductive. There also might be some other provisions like being allowed to change quietly in an out of the way toilet. But they can't give concessions to everyone so it's a case of being the squeaky wheel while also convincing them you will be discreet about any adjustments.

In theory, PE is compulsory in senior school , even in KS4. Even for students not taking PE for GCSE.

I'd withdraw her and tell school she can go to the library instead. No one ever got fit at secondary PE. It's a hive of bullying and mean girls.

Just make sure she is active outside of school.

Admittedly this was private school I know but my school started offering a few different options for the girls by the time we were 14.
i did aerobics, self defence and Pilates. A teacher happened to teach Pilates on the side and they got on the aerobics and self defence instructors. The sportier girls could still do any of the other sports but this was great for me who was frankly terrible at netball and this ended years of PE horror. Aerobics was sweaty but something like yoga
and Pilates could be nice (and social) option?

My worry is her extreme distress impacting her whole school experience, her sullenness at home and her feeling of ‘hating school’.

My senior school days were completely ruined by PE - we were forced into COMMUNAL SHOWERS. 14year olds, all at different stages of development.
OP I would just take her out of PE, tell the school, and let her enjoy her school days.

Is anyone bullying her?
It seems that there's been a big change in her attitude from loving sport to hating it.

What sports do they do? I was taught tackling in rugby in PE at school (hated it). It had to be split by sex.

We really struggled with PE with dd. Her ASD and medical issues made it a challenge. I was thrilled when she aged out.

Communal changing was a huge problem for her. When pressed, the school will provide alternatives. They can’t force children to disrobe in front of one another. Yes, I realize if every child complained that would cause logistical issues, I really don’t care if did. Privacy is a basic right.

as for the class itself, our issues were different from yours. We needed dd to be allowed alternate activities on occasion. That finally happened after multiple trips to a&e and subsequent missed school.

PE is awful for so many children. It doesn’t need to be. It could so easily inspire a love of fitness. It is frustrating.

They don't tackle in rugby I think - assumed that was just to avoid bad injuries in school but maybe it's for the gender thing too. They do gymnastics, netball, basketball, football... normal PE stuff. I was interested enough to check and there's no rule about it - just an encouragement from Scottish government for co-ed PE.

Speak to school again. Just because they don't 'see' the issue doesn't mean there isn't one!

One of my kids is similar, gets super anxious and doesn't want to go. Girls and boys are not mixed at their school but boys dominating is a very real issue and needs dealing with.

This is such a problem in high schools that you'd think they would try and address it.

We have exactly this situation as well. School PE is awful, unless you’re one of the super sporty. We have a DD who is on a team outside school, does various sports that are beyond the narrow PE curriculum, but the PE teacher hates her because she objected to doing football outside in the pouring rain at 9am, meaning she was wet through all day! Talk about how to put girls/women off sport!

Hi, Head of PE here 👋 You cannot withdraw from PE as it is part of the National Curriculum in England. Parents have no legal right to withdraw from it and schools have a legal duty to deliver it to all children.

However, no one goes into teaching (or I certainly didn't) to have children in lessons experiencing the worst time of their week. I would recommend a meeting with the Head of PE and possibly Head of Year/pastoral support due to the wellbeing issues you've raised. There are so many solutions that can be put in place to make your daughter feel more comfortable in PE, maybe even enjoy it again.

I did my dissertation about Year 9 girls and their attitudes to PE. The way I run my PE department is very different to any other schools I've seen because the children have a huge part in deciding which sports we learn, how they prefer to be grouped, what they are most comfortable wearing etc. I get all their feedback and make changes ready for September.

Oh yeah, and we had the situation where she was put in a group with 6 boys and then told off for not joining in. The fact they wouldn’t even pass the ball to her went unnoticed.

You’ve got to be about the only PE teacher ever with this attitude! We did a bigger range of sports when I was at school than they do today. It’s literally football and rugby and then ‘fitness’ and a bit of table tennis. No swimming, table tennis, basketball, volleyball, hockey, cricket…

Oh, I got detentions too, I just didn't go to those either.

@offherrockingchair all the people in my department feel the same way as it makes teaching so much more enjoyable. Nothing more boring than 5 lessons of Netball on repeat when I could have some variety in my own day too!

Our students do things like Frisbee Golf, American Football, Tckoukball, Handball, Softball, Zumba, Boccia, Orienteering, Rock-It Ball, Volleyball, Round-Net in addition to the traditonal Cricket, Rounders, Basketball, Football, Rugby, Netball, Tennis, Badminton, Dance, Gymnastics etc. We have a huge number of sports to offer as I've chosen to make that a priority instead of buying 100 new footballs every year.

The children all fill in an online survey for me and then groups of them sit with me to plan out what their next year will look like based on the survey results. I do have to ensure we are National Curriculum compliant - they can't just do Badminton all year even if that's what they want 😂

So in a nutshell it’s because it messes up her hair. She needs to get a grip and crack on. Resilience anyone?

They shouldn't be doing PE in " friendship groups ". That's down to the teacher to mix up the students so everyone participates. Do make the teacher aware of difficulties within the group.

if you are somehow unaware of the physical differences between males and females at this age, I’m not sure anyone can really help you.
also no one idea why you’ve included total segregation as no one is suggesting that, just for sport.
most girls leave sport around this age due to multiple reasons. Body image, shame and periods being the main ones. As males are on average 10-20% stronger than their female counterparts, mixed sex increases the risk of injury on females, but also means that girls come second all the time which isn’t very motivating.
there are some girls, not many, who actually thrive on it, beating people with physical advantages over you is obviously both wonderful and challenging, but that clearly isn’t going to apply to 99% of females.
it isn’t difficult to find research paper after research paper detailing one on the big reasons teenage girls leave sport is the fact that they have to do it with the boys.
I’m a PE teacher at a private school, we run single sex from key stage 3 following all the advice.

My daughter was the same, super sporty - training 6 days a week out of school - but hated PE half the time.

Mixed PE sounds awful, I'm all for coed schools in general, but it really should be seperate in secondary schools.

In terms of practical ways to make it better, a strong anti-perspirant that she puts on right before. My eldest (now 21) uses a natural one normally, but has her 'chemical weapons grade' ones for sport. It can be a process of trial and error as different bodies respond differently.

I agree with the french plait comments.

For the communal changing rooms, is there a (likely highly unused) shower cubical to go in? This might be the main part to tough through as there isn't a huge amount to be done I imagine.

I'd second speaking to the PE teachers, although I'm not holding my breath!

The way we treat girls' (and boys') PE is awful. If left to their own devices, I think my girls would exercise 24/7 now - it's only the degrees stopping them! But at school, they were both reluctant PE participants. We made sure to foster sport outside of school, without making it a big deal. It's such a shame that as a country we have so many great female athletes, who talk loads about the issues of girls and women in sports, and it still isn't being fixed at the school level.

wizard that looks like an incredibly limited option of activity. Don't your school provide things like yoga, jogging, circuits, dance, body combat style classes too?

Team sports are the work of the devil and perfect for bullying.