Tourette’s/BAFTAs offensive language

[Lochroy]

I wasn’t watching, I’ve just read the article on BBC news. I will admit I know little of Tourette’s and therefore posting to understand.

The tics agree involuntary, and often use offensive language. But what I’m struggling to get my head around is excusing use of the N word because it was caused by the disability when it was (seemingly) only directed at black people?

Also presumably it’s learned vocab so children don’t have swear words as tics? How does this develop?

So should you - for offending people with Tourette’s with your ignorant and ill- informed comment about their condition.

Whether you meant it or not.

The same as they’ve been saying all the way through the thread. That the man is disabled and has no control over his actions in this respect, and that if there was no intent to offend, reasonable, intelligent and compassionate people would not take offence once they understood the situation.

I suggest you educate yourself on Tourette’s seeing as you admit you know nothing about it. I assure you people living with it don’t NEED to pretend just to say a slur.

But what does history in the US have to do with John Davidson? Why do we need to go away and educate ourselves?

Yes I know and I understand. I watched the JA documentaries from years ago.

I'm saying that given the nature of the disability both JA and the organisers must have anticipated racist comments. Did no-one think to suggest JA watched from the bar before 2 black men went on stage.

I’m torn on the view that BBC should have done more to edit out his ticks. Why should he be censored?? On the other hand, I appreciate the sensitivity around the words he could involuntarily say. I’m sad for him though. This should have been a celebration, a victory! It’s turned out to just be evidence of how little understanding and compassion there is for people suffering with this cruel disability.

It shouldn't have been broadcast. They had a couple of hours to edit it out, not just have a white man presenter say apologies if anyone is offended. It is offensive and has an impact. Both people of colour knowing that the BBC didn't care enough to edit it out and the man with tourettes becoming a major news headline for his tics.

They probably were aware, but I wonder if that would be the first thing that comes to your mind - even if you know it on an intellectual level - if someone shouts (the worst) racial slur at you? In the footage I saw, both men paused for a second and you could almost physically see them processing what had just happened. It was probably a horrible shock - not to mention that it’s an incredibly violent word which has often been used alongside physical violence - they had a split second in a very public space to determine the level of threat.

I think in 2026 we should be able to hold space for both experiences. What a mortifying and horrible situation for all involved. The BBC should not have broadcast it, and there should have been appropriate debriefing offered with all parties involved in a sensitive and supportive way. It’s difficult, but there’s a duty of care to everyone involved that was sorely missed here and really, it should have been handled better. No need at all to take sides. No one is right or wrong or say one person has it harder than another. It’s just awful all round,

Surely someone with Tourette’s can’t help what they say with their tics - it’s the illness. We should be understanding and sympathetic, not blaming someone for being ill - they are already suffering enough. Imagine what their life is like and how terrible their life is with this illness affecting them every moment of every day. I can’t imagine how awful their life is. They deserve compassion.

You explain to your child about Tourettes and to have compassion towards him.

Exactly, if you hurt someone, you say sorry, even if you didn't mean to hurt them.

This is perhaps one of the most balanced responses I’ve seen on these threads about the BAFTAS. (Although, on the Black MN thread I started we’ve had a very reasonable discussion)

The whole point of why Tourette’s is such a curse is that you continually insult people you don’t want to insult, with the worst atrocious bad language that your brain dredges up. To not recognise this is the precise problem is to not understand anything about what this man has been through. And others. Do you think he wanted that to happen? Do you think he wanted to say Fuck the Queen to the Queen??

Of course it’s not ‘okay’, but what would you suggest then for someone with Tourette’s? The only alternative would be for them to shut themselves away, which no-one would want to see happen……would they?

I can assure you I do understand Tourettes. I also understand personal responsibility and he did not physically have to be there.

Why do people keep making this ridiculous comparison?!

Running over someone’s foot ina wheelchair causes pain and is probably from being a little careless of someone near you. People with Tourette’s are simply going about their day and something pops out that is NOTHING to do with anyone. People on wheelchairs don’t spend all day running over people’s feet, but people with Tourette’s do go around shouting expletives. They’d do nothing but apologise if they took your view. Why should they live that life just because of other people’s ignorance?

The correct analogy is apologising for simply being in a wheelchair. Presumably you’re against that?

Do you think he just tics at black men?! God the amount of people who have absolutely no clue on how tics manifest themselves or Coprolalia.

People should watch the documentaries/film before commenting.

They can't. My BIL suffers with it. He had insulted many people and he absolutely hate himself for it. Luckily people are mostly understanding. What people don't see is it actually causes physical pain sometimes when they tick. My BIL has episodes where he physically attacks himself. Got so bad once he walked on crutches for 6 months 😔

You are the one twisting what posters are saying to suit your own narrative. This is a man who has a disability and no agency over what triggers his outbursts. You presumably are mature and intelligent, but seem to want to refuse to accept that there is no fault and no intent. Anyone who questions what you’re failing is immediately called a bigot and a racist. Out of interest, not all those who suffer from Tourette’s are white. Would you apply the same terms to a black person who shouted out ‘racist slurs’ because they are disabled and have no control over how their outbursts are triggered ?

I find this very interesting. In terms of physical pain, yes, but the emotional impact of (for example) my dh elbowing me in the face in his sleep would be worlds away from how I'd feel if he did it in the middle of an argument. Wouldn't how you feel when called offensives names be more similar to emotional/psychological distress than to physical pain?
(though I agree re the redaction)

So he should just stay indoors at all times?

Sorry, but this is imbalanced.
Why does one persons needs trump another.
If I had a disability and accidentally hurt someone, I wouldn’t apologise for being me, but I’d apologise for the harm nonetheless!
There is some balance to be had here but plenty on MN believe that no black or brown person should ever be offended if the harm wasn’t meant.

You said “if you hurt someone”. How might you do that? Accidentally bumping into them? You have control over your body and so you are rightfully expected to apologise in that scenario. He has no control over his Tourette’s.

You seem to be completely incapable of understanding this disability. It’s mad reading your arguments. Why don’t you understand that his disability means he shouts the most offensive thing in that moment. What that shows, is that he really really does know that it is offensive. He’s not a racist, he is disabled.

he didn’t shout “fuck the Queen!” At the black men winning the award. He didn’t call the Queen a racial slur. It’s BECAUSE he knows what is inappropriate that his tick shows this.

There is not a top trumps where Racism is the ace. This man isn’t racist. He has a disability. Go and argue with actual racists. The men accepting the award thankfully will understand that a disabled man was in the room, NOT segregated, but invited to the BAFTAs precisely because of his awareness raising film.

I feel for all 3 involved but strongly believe the priority should have been Michael B Jordan and Delroy Lindo.
The impact of the N word regardless of intent should have been edited and addressed immediately. The BBC have made a huge error in allowing this to happen and be aired.
The usual pathetic…’if anyone was offended’ remark at the end of apology just compounded it. Disgusting insult to entire black film community.

Exactly 💯 this. Neurological conditions are very hard to live with and having had one for over a decade, it's not something I'd ever want anyone else to experience.