BEAVERS CLUB - Safety issues or 90s approach to childhood?

[Alelou]

Hi 👋 my 6 year old son recently joined Beavers and is having a brilliant time. But I can’t help but feel uneasy about the approach to safety during the sessions. It seems the gate outside the hut is left open and the front door to the hut is also open so anyone can walk in at any time although I’m sure the leaders would notice if a kid walked out. At the end of the session kids just scramble and run around, running outside to go and play in the playground but no one is checking if the right parents are taking the right kids.

I don’t know if I’m being affected by too many scary headlines but I find it hard to relax when he’s in the club.

For those have kids in beavers is this all normal?

My friend said her rainbows is the same and my husband thinks I’m being ridiculous. He thinks it’s ‘relaxed’ but really good for DS. It does seem like a time warp of 90s childhood activities at Beavers which is great but the 90s approach to safety issues worry me a bit!

Am I overreacting? Thanks! X

The idea is that there’s never an opportunity when you’re helping because you’re never alone with a child. But only helping once shouldn’t allow you to build up a bond of trust with a child that would let you approach them elsewhere (like the soham murderer whom the girls knew from school).

I agree and I reckon its also that trade off between practically and risk. GG have to pay for every DBS and they probably dont want to do that for a parent who might only help once a year (camp / holidays being an exception where every over 18 sleeping over needs a DBS).

I don't understand the preference for locked doors.

Isn't fire statistically much greater risk than an active attacker?

Ah I see, that makes sense, thanks @museumum

i have family in Norway, and there, even primary schools don’t have any kind of gate! So the kids just play outside at play time, and the public street runs right alongside!

Yeap. And someone was that keen on attacking they could just come at pick up or drop off time.

At our cubs, we do get the cubs to queue up at the door and we let them out once we've seen who is picking them up - but we have no outdoor space at all, and the door opens straight out on to the pavement by a fairly busy road. I believe this also happens at beavers, but not at scouts.

We shut the front door after the meeting has started and it can't be opened from the outside, but we keep the side door unlocked and it can be opened from the outside, however we can't lock it as it is a fire escape route. But we've never had anyone at all enter that way during the meetings.

We do also have door alarms, as the cubs could, in theory, open the front or side door and wander off. It's never happened though.

Our Beavers are signed in then signed out at the end of the evening. All leaders have a DBS check and a certain percentage have done a first aid course. I’ve also done numerous online courses about safeguarding procedures.

our beavers group has doors locked once all arrived,

What about fire exits?

Volunteer as a leader or parent helper 🤷🏻‍♀️

I think those sort of clubs are still run in rather an old fashioned laid back sort of way.
DD did a trial at rainbows once aged about 5- they let the kids go out of the room and use the toilet in the foyer unaccompanied.The door to outside was close by and one could easily have slipped out or god forbid been escorted out by someone.
Put me off sending her for sure.

All leaders are required to hold a current DBS. Occasional helpers/parents don't need to hold one, unless they start to help on a regular basis, but they are not allowed to be unsupervised with the children, and they can't stay overnight on camps.

They must also hold a scout approved first response certificate which is renewed every three years. If they are new to scouts, they have to complete this in the first 12 months, but at all meetings there must be a current holder.

Yes, you’re right this isn’t in line with what you’re supposed to do in Scouting (I’ve run a Beaver colony in the past) but also, yes, you’re overreacting if these two things (open door and informal handover) are the sole points of concern.

It’s reasonable for doors to be opened or closed depending on the weather - the issue is can the leaders be sure they can supervise the children at all times.

End of sessions children should be released to parents one-by-one and the parents should tell leaders in advance if they are going home with a friend therefore so-and-so’s parent will be collecting etc. We did this as much as we could but frankly I’m not sure I can really say it’s all that much better practically than collection from a play area provided there’s a leader around. It takes months/years for leaders to work out whose child belonged to who so you’re just going on the child bring happy to be collected by whoever it is - and that’s before the parents have forgotten to say actually granny’s doing pick up today.

In answer to your question about DBS, yes, all the volunteers are checked and they all have to do lots of in person and online training including First Aid and Safeguarding and keep it up to date by repeating it every few years too. There are also rules about how many leaders you have to have to how many children (different ratios for the hut and for going elsewhere).

But if you are concerned then just have a chat and raise it with the leaders or better yet offer to volunteer. If things have become a bit slack it could well be because they are doing their best but they could really use an extra pair of hands to help out. If your child’s having a great time then they’re clearly doing a lot of things right.

Challenge them if you don’t like it. Horrendously, I know someone who’s 6yo died at beavers because of slack health and safety protocols. Don’t just assume because it’s an “organisation” that they are on the case

My youngest has just moved up from Beavers to Cubs and I don’t recognise this from our experience. When the Beavers came out a leader rushed ahead to the front gate onto the road and only let the Beaver out if the correct parent was waiting. If you wanted another parent to pick them up you had to message to say it was ok before the session started. Once I forgot and they rang me to check it was ok. So v safety conscious.

Our Rainbows leaders lock the doors and children are collected at the end one at a time.

Doors can't be locked, it's a fire risk. If there was a child who regularly runs off they'd give them extra support, additional risk assessment etc.
When ours were in Beavers we just went into the hall to get them. Cubs we waited outside and they were released

Leaders will be DBS checked. Parents who help regularly should also have DBS. If on parent rota probably not, but should never be on their own with a child. If attend camp then should have DBS

I agree with you Op, my daughter goes to brownies and I feel really uncomfortable about the door being unlocked when the children are inside. I thought I was being Ott but it’s a church all that has an open gate directly onto a main road, anyone could walk in.

If there was a fire and the doors were locked, nobody could get out.

Beaver leader here and as previous posters have said, volunteers are DBS checked and have received safeguarding training.

We ensure that each child is handed over to their appropriate adult at the end of the session. We don’t have the doors locked (neither do the cubs or scouts). We do watch to ensure that no one exits or enters and the children ask to use the loo so we can keep track of them.

You could offer to help out or be a volunteer to see if you are comfortable with the way that the sessions are run and you may see that the leaders are more aware of who is with who/leaving with what parents than you realised.

If that worries you, wait until cubs when they're all running wild in the woods in the dark 🤣

This. Always irritates when parents moan about how a volunteer group is run but make no effort to volunteer themselves.

the front door to the hut is also open so anyone can walk in at any time although I’m sure the leaders would notice if a kid walked out. At the end of the session kids just scramble and run around, running outside to go and play in the playground but no one is checking if the right parents are taking the right kids.

This goes against what should be happening.
All activities, not only including, but especially those at the normal hut / meeting place should be risk assessed. There is no way that Beavers should be being allowed out of the building at the end of the night without being handed over to the appropriate adult. The door thing - more of a grey area (hence the risk assessment being individual to each group in each venue) - but, as a rule I would expect no-one to be able to access the meeting place without being let in (or having their own key).

You would definitely be within your rights to ask to speak to the Leaders at the end of the meeting and say this is concerning you, and would you be able to see the risk assessment for this. If they try to brush you off, then ask to speak to the GLV (Group Lead Volunteer) who ought to be aware of risk assessments.

Our church rooms has fire exits with push bars which can only be opened from the inside.

The doors aren't locked for Brownies, but they have been for other bookings.