Surprised by not being able to get ambulance

[FrenchFancie]

This is in no way to have a dig at the ambulance service or at the hospitals (but maybe slightly at the junior doctors strike) but I have been really surprised recently when, for the first time in aaages, I have had to call 999 twice, and on both occasions wasn’t able to get an ambulance.

firstly my daughter was having an asthma attack, and not responding to medication. After 10 reliever puffs we called, and were told it would be a 1-2 hour wait. So we stuffed her in the back of the car and drove like idiots to the local hospital instead, where she was seen straight away. But it was a scary midnight drive. Her asthma plan states to ring 999 after 10 puffs and the ambulance should attend within 10 minutes.

second was through work where a child was having an epileptic seizure and again, we were told it was an unknown wait time, possibly 1-2 hours.

both of these things I felt really scared about, wanting urgent professional help and support, but it wasn’t available. I know I’m not going to get an ambulance for an adult with broken ankle, but kids with quick onset, possibly life threatening conditions, I was shocked there was nothing available.

is this the same now everywhere? It’s been years since I had to call 999 (like 10 years) and got a quick response last time (daughter fell off changing table, was in London and overreacted to her banging her head but the crew were lovely).

I don’t blame the ambulance service or 999 operators - in fact on both occasions the operator sounded stressed and upset they couldn’t get me help.

what, if anything, can be done about this situation?

The problem is it's not an unusual state of play. The Ambulance documentary programmes/999 one show this quite clearly. There was also a Panorama recently where a reporter went undercover as a call handler.

Wait times for ambulances are terrible and have been for some time. It's a huge problem.

Yep I know the French system well and yes you need to top up part of the fees but everyone has insurance for that , usually subsidized through their work place. People on minimum income get it through the state . Serious ilness ( cancer heart diabetes etc) is fully covered even without private insurance anywzy. People can choose where they go , so they make their own mammogram appointment or ultrasound or blood test etc . There’s not the hanging around waiting for a letter from the NHS. They can easily get second opinions. Access is more restricted in deserted rural areas , so everything isn’t rosy but if you want that ultrasound asap there’s nothing to stop you driving miles away to have it.
The NHS isn’t free and while it was and is a wonderful concept the British public deserve better for their money.

I don’t think it’s everywhere. A couple of years ago my DM was able to get an ambulance when she didn’t really need one. I was really shocked by it all.

I agree with much that you say . There are indeed corrupt and greedy senior doctors . Narcissists , sociopaths & psychopaths exist everywhere & particularly in the higher echelons of politics and medicine .
I’m trying to state that it is really hard for a decent doctor , finding themselves within a corrupted , broken NHS to bring the public’s attention to the deliberate political decisions that have brought us here .
If they try , the public’s wrath comes down on THEIR heads and so , like many who have tried before them , they leave . Many doctors and nurses DO care about their patients but soon find it impossible to work for the current NHS .
I know , of course , about the status of GPs without the NHS .
So many practices are now owned by American health companies who restrict the tests and services that the GPs are allowed to offer , enormously reducing the quality of medical care for us but maximising profits for shareholders.
An analogous situation can be found in the UK’s privatised water companies , sold off by Thatcher et al to foreign companies who care nothing for polluting & ruining our waterways & seas .
It’s a tragic mess but not the fault of MOST doctors , immigrants nor Boomers .

I absolutely agree with this, the French system is so much better and I'd be happy to pay for insurance to cover the top up. In fact it would probably not cost the average person much more than currently, if not less. Hopefully there would be no need for so many people to resort to private health care which could mean that staff remain working in the NHS and things will improve.
At the moment we're all paying through the nose for the NHS and do deserve a better service. The aspect of choice in the French system means that poor providers don't get the business, good providers get more patients and hence more money to put into their business for extra operating theatres, clinic space, staff and equipment. Also the people who misuse the NHS one way or another, be it uneccessary A&E trips or doctor's appointments, end up paying for the time that they are wasting.
I'm happy to pay if I get what I'm paying for, at the moment that is simply not the case. I don't think that the average citizen realises just how much they are spending personally on the current sub-standard service. And so many people are paying for private Health insurance on top of this.

This. It’s clinics run by consultants that get cancelled so they can cover A&E and the wards. The wards are full and sadly a lot of these people do not need hospital care but are not well enough to discharge them home to take care of themselves. Therefore A&E can’t move people to the wards. If A&E are full an ambulance crew have to stay with said patient until handover. This on top of people ringing for ambulances when that’s maybe not the most appropriate way of getting them medical help.

Its not the public’s fault though. If they order an ambulance maybe it’s because they couldn’t get a GP appointment etc etc It’s been hammered into people not to stretch the NHS . No one in the right mind wants to sit in A and E for hours or in ambulance for no reason.

I’ve been sat in A&E for hours and hours with my children so I do know it’s a last resort. I was merely saying there is a small minority that call when it should be pharmacy/GP/111 or out of hours GP, which is true. I’m not blaming every single member of the public.

They won't send an ambulance to anyone who calls for one. They categorise all the calls and some people will be redirected to other services like 111

, I just mean it’s kind of counter productive and letting politicians off the hook to blame the public in any way at this point but I understand what you mean .

My mum has been in hospital for 12 weeks now, she needs a care home but due to her complex behaviour & needs 3 homes up to now have rejected her. She no longer knows us, her brain won't connect to her limbs to mobilise, she has stopped eating, was 14 stone she went in & now weighs under 8 stone. I wish they would just stop treating things like the frequent infections she keeps on getting, make her comfortable & let nature take its course, she has no prospect of getting better & no quality of life. The ward she is on is full of patients in identical states, no wonder health & social care are over run.

This is indeed an issue that’s just going to get bigger and bigger imo. We are physically healthier and healthier which is wonderful and living longer lives which is great if we hold in to our mental cognition , I don’t know how society is going to manage if people get to say 90 /100 on average without finding effective medication to treat dementia. How is the world going to manage? I’m sorry about your Mum it’s an awful thing to go through for her and for you.

I’ve done a living will. Basically if I’m diagnosed with dementia I don’t want any treatment for anything except pain relief. I’ve given it to my GP, have a copy at home and a copy on my phone
my mum with Alzheimer’s had a chest infection which went to sepsis and my dad hadn’t done POA despite me constantly bugging him about it. Thankfully the doctors were sensible and we didn’t treat the sepsis, she died peacefully

isn’t the thing about living wills that they won’t work with dementia because we won’t have the capacity to agree when the time comes ? But yes I really must do one !!

It should be ok because I’ve done it while I have capacity to state what I want when I don’t have capacity. If that makes sense!

If you make it whilst you have capacity and you don't use it to ask anyone to do anything illegal, it is just refusals of treatment options and care. Then it is legal.
But you must do it when you have capacity, likewise you can only set up a LPoA for health and welfare whilst you have capacity and once you've lost capacity the option simply is not available to you anymore.

I wrote my advanced decision to refuse treatment in my 30s, i intended to update it as i age (particularly the DNACPR bit, once i hit 70 i have no intention of having CPR for a non healthy setting cardiac arrest), but there will be no doubt that it was done at a time of full capacity.

Ok I am definitely going to look into one !!

I left the ambulance service because of this :(
it broke my heart leaving people to it for hours.
However, I would say 50 percent of jobs people just panicked and lacked the common sense in the moment to help their loved one into a car and drive to a & e. It is totally understandable, and remember you can actually call from the car as you are travelling if you are worried things are getting worse for the patient on your journey (ie you can call and say I am travelling southbound on the A425 heading to local hospital and xx is happening).

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