The working world has become ridiculous

[Rothschild]

Recently a manager at my company attended an online meeting in tears because of a minor issue regarding her child's school. She excused herself from the meeting and took a mental health day.

I can barely get hold of anyone at 3pm in my (large) organisation because everyone is doing school pick up. I don't believe they're getting much work done once they've picked up because they become hard to contact, don't respond to messages and won't attend meetings, despite it being their normal working hours.

It's ridiculous. When our children were small we paid for wrap around childcare or for someone to collect. We were available to work between 3 and 4pm and afterwards.

I'm not talking about anyone who has negotiated flexibility or finishes at 3pm, I'm talking about others who are, frankly, taking the piss.

And if I had taken a mental health day every time I'd had some difficulty in my life I'd have hardly worked.

Well from my perspective when work stop asking me to attend meetings at 5am because that’s when we can get the china based person we need or 8pm because that suits the US based person better or to be on call all weekend to work a 14 hour shift at whatever point they decide they are ready to start my steps in a cutover I’ll possibly start feeling some need to make myself available at 3pm for whoever wants to meet then. Until that point I’ll pick my kids up, work flexibly with some give and take and feel 100% justified.

Oh I work with someone who is autistic, he will disappear for hours on end in the middle of the day, not attend meetings he is meant to be at and then around 3/4 times a month will get overwhelmed/have a panic attack and then sign off for the day, the strange thing is this is always before 10.30 am, it's never happened after lunch, odd. He's always told not to worry about it and it's usually me who picks up the slack.

I have 3 young children primary aged, never do I play on this, I think I have done 1 school pickup since Sept. Not all working parents are like this. My work do actually say to me if a meeting is booked for 3 "can you make it or are you on school pickup?" I'm never on school pickup!

I think on the whole people are realising that they are disposable to companies and they aren't being paid accordingly due to col and they simply aren't willing to burn themselves into the ground for an employer the way previous generations did. People want more flexibility and balance for themselves and that's not just parents, it's also people with caring responsibilities for older relatives or single people who want to be able to maintain hobbies or mental health in winter etc. I think covid especially showed that a lot of companies can be more flexible.

I moved to a more 'corporate ' role after working in the charity sector for years and I was absolutely blown away at the stress and pressure people were working under. I'd come from a job that was extremely high stress - quite literally life or death at times. And suddenly I was losing sleep at night over paperwork. Colleagues were going to get their blood pressure checked on their lunch because they felt so panicked, they actually fundraised to get a defibrillator put into they office. And I was expected to be grateful for the 'generous' 30 min flexi time I could use in a day. Although it was also 'noted' if I actually used any of it. I left and never ever looked back.

I think a lot of the problem is that due to the aggressive political pushback on paying sickness and disability benefits there are a surprising number of people in work who shouldn't really be there. This is obviously shit for both them and their colleagues who have to pick up extra work etc as a result. I am long-term disabled and ill - frankly, it makes me slightly shit at my job, but the alternative is to die in destitution waiting for a personal injury award which will take years to be paid out, if it is at all.

Also, as a lone parent I'm ALWAYS on school pick up and pay more than my mortgage for childcare each month so i am limited to who I'll work for as a result. An employer who can be flexible with this is essential to me sustaining work. I find it interesting when people argue that flexible working is bad for women but conveniently forget about lone parents who are dependent on flexibility and family friendly workplaces.

I'll also add that at smt level I'm always on call, work extremely hard and would never take the piss with my workload. Even with working flexibly and doing school runs etc I'm usually over on my hours each month on my timesheet, my hours are just spread more across the week.

@Rothschild As a part-timer and a remote worker, it's bloody annoying that Monday seems to almost be a non-working day for many. Can't get a hold of people, and they're very sluggish to reply.

Im hybrid and I take a 30 min lunch break between 3 and 3.30pm to get my child from school. I then get back to work whilst he watches tv.

Id like to have a more continental view of work so what if some one isn't available for 20 mins at 3!!

Let's have a more French view ,Scandinavian attitude rather than the USA work work work hamster wheel attitude.

@Lavender14 Culturally, I'm surrounded by people always chasing shiny corporate job titles in order to increase their status. Work & life balance is patchy, but even if people sign off, the general 'hustle' culture is high. They tend to employ ambitious, very, very young women because they think they're easier to fool & manipulate, easier to squeeze more work out of. Most people in my old department were hired in under the age of 25, and many of them were just 22 or 23, when they started with us, with this being their first post uni job.

It's insane, isn't it? I rememeber being made ill with stress about ridiculous pretend work that existed for its own sake and served no actual purpose besides being something for which the client could be billed (professional services).

Exactly. I would never work for an employer who was so cold and cruel that they wouldn't allow time off when someone's dog or cat dies.

There are some very stern employers here, and it makes me glad I am self employed, and choose my own hours, and can take holidays/days off when I want to.

DH is not so fortunate, and he has an employer who will never bend or flex a single millimetre. (He works 30 hours a week - his contracted hours...) Therefore he doesn't 'bend or flex' either, and will never do a single second of overtime when they're desperate because someone's called in sick. The stiff, rigid, 'work-is-more-important-than-homelife-and-family' manager has to do it. And they don't get paid extra for it because they're salaried.

Shame. You reap what you sew.

At a point, you can only take on what you are compensated for or it will destroy you. My job is a support role in which I facilitate the work of people whose hourly rate is at least ten times mine. I have a lot of responsibility and I work very hard, but I simply cannot afford to be drawn into the headspace of someone who earns my daily rate in an hour.

I do think it is something to do with COVID which has changed offices and work. It certainly changed me. Previously I worked really hard, all through COVID, no oversight, and delivered. By the end however it was incredibly obvious that literally being motivated to do an excellent job was completely unimportant. Completely. I could have done it to half the standard, half the effort and far less stress.

I now do something vastly less useful, better paid, and care about it far less. Employment (rather than running a business) is just really not work the effort to make it really excellent. Go home and build a business or something. That is actually an investment in you.

YANBU

I have friends who are fuming that their companies have decided to go back to full time in the office because it will mean that they cant pick up kids, do errands etc. and that it will cost them a fortune in childcare. Without realising that that is precisely WHY the company wants them in! For a start if they really are working full time from home, why aren't they already paying for childcare? Its written in to WFH contracts that childcare mustnt be done by them during work hours as I understand it.

They all think that no one will notice, that they are the only ones. But thats simply not true.

Or maybe low productivity is why wages are in the toilet? I don’t work in an office based role so no idea which is true!

Agree OP, something in work culture changed after Covid.

my workable solution is to hire people who are 100 percent available and non-slacking during stated working hours. There are plenty of them. Those who are unavailable need not apply.

It works well for us.

Or perhaps people really are stressed out. COL out of control, no work life balance when you’re constantly connected. Housing issues. Extortionate child care costs, can’t get by on a single income. Getting to retirement eventually & not even having enough for heating, and food.

People are feeling pressured, and like they’re living in a rat race. The planet is dying, climate change, and egomaniac elitists in control, that are creating a dystopian nightmarish future for us.

And now, being taxed on our pensions too. I can understand why people are stressed. You’re looking at things from one very small perspective.

And those are all external factors, excluding personal health, genetics, family history of mental health issues, neurodivergence, upbringing, socioeconomic factors etc…

And AI!

I agree that school run time is full of people taking the piss. I actually worked 8am-2pm 5 days a week for a few years. I've went back to full time but with early finishes on Monday and Wednesday only as frankly nobody else was working their hours so why should I lose money for being honest?

Maybe you should be more organised and hold your meetings earlier in the day. Who would have time to meaningfully action anything from a meeting that started after 3 anyway. If you are having meetings late in the day to prove some kind of point about what a martyr you are then I’m afraid it sounds like you are that one person in the office that lives for your job.

I worked like a dog through Covid splitting childcare with my ex and working to 11 and 12 at night. We got divorced post Covid and a large factor in it was having spent no time together for months.

I really wish I hadn't bothered and just done bugger all like everyone else as I didn't get promoted, no bonus or big pay rise or anything.

Yeah this is not the flex you think it is.

I was going to say, who holds meetings past 3pm … it’s outside of core hours. Also, not everyone has their priorities messed up, children/family come first.

Exactly. The problem in this country is 100% employers. The people who work hard and are conscientious get taken for mugs. The people that have a laugh and suck up make it up the greasy pole regardless of how little work they put in. It might well be that op’s colleges have worked this out sooner than the op.