Friend still believes in "chavs"?

[waytoooldforthisshite]

Had a funny (well, slightly depressing) conversation today. my friend came round all flustered, telling me that she'd been "harassed by chavs" outside the shop. One was some teenager who asked for her number 🙄

Tried to explain that "chavs" aren't even real, it's a tabloid invented stereotype/myth from the early 2000s that was basically used to demonise working class people. But she just went on about it like she was quoting The Sun from 2004. I ended up showing her this article. She's 39.... and I expected her to know a bit better but what can ya do eh?

Just feels so outdated now. You don't really hear anyone say "chav" anymore (thankfully), and it's weird how those old class-based stereotypes still linger. I honestly felt like I'd timetravelled back to the Little Britain era 😂

Anyone else still know people who talk like that?

@ColinWhoIsNotAChav , so call me reductive! I have said that the use of the word chav is a slur. It is offensive, every post on this thread agrees.

What the main dispute is about is whether the term is a blanket term used to slur/demonise the working class. You clearly see it as such, but others like myself do not. I see it as a word used to describe a type of person and your introductory post alluded to that.

You stand by your belief that chavs don't exist. Chavs are not myth. And I will go as far as saying that some people do identify as chavs.

My DGD, 14 told me that a girl in her year said,
in year 7, that she wanted to be a chav, and that others identify as such. They are not thugs. The girl who wanted to be one is certainly not working class. They are now year 10 and she has moved on!

Just as it is not a blanket term to describe the working class, it does also has levels of meaning, which you, OP and Owen Jones are determined to shut down.

Nope. Not all working class youth. Just the chavvy ones.

The fact you felt the need to post this on a parenting forum though? Seriously? 🤣🤣🤣

1. you must be great fun at parties
2. is this a serious post? Like who actually GAF ?

The thing is op, language can't really be controlled; it evolves by itself. So whatever the origin of the word 'chav', it now has a meaning that everyone understands. Whether or not the word is a slur, or made up, is kind of irrelevant to the point you're making. Every individual that uses the word will have a type of person in their head that it refers to. The type may actually vary a little from person to person, but generally it is a word that evokes a certain image, more or less. Language takes on a life of its own, so regardless of the history/suitability of the word, or the morals around it, it is too late, it exists as a concept. So if your friend uses the word about a certain type of person, yes, they do exist, as she just encountered them. You dislike the word, and that's fair enough. But your argument would make more sense if you concentrated on that. Blindly and stubbornly repeating 'chavs are a myth' is fighting a losing battle.

Won’t somebody think of the gang bangas and hoodies?

If someone was harassed by black kids would it be ok to use a racist term to describe them? Still no.

I think it's ok to call out an unacceptable term while still supporting your friend through her experience.

Being a chav is a choice. Being black is not. That's the difference.

I don't see chavs that way. The original ones were in their fake Burberry with gold chains, stolen or knock off training shoes. If they got a car it was a hot hatch. And yes they didn't work. But then the loadsamoney character came along and that was chavvy. Someone who might have a 2nd or 3rd hand Range Rover, knock off designer labels and acquire tattoos. Their icons are/were the Beckham's who aren't chavvy but were somehow seen to be (by some). The crown was taken by the Vardys. Kate Price absolutely is chav material. Just my opinion and I'm not looking to argue

The term chavs is still used but from reading these posts there are variations on what people would consider chavs… around here it isn’t necessarily whether people wear sportswear or whether they work… it’s more mannerisms, personalities, lifestyles and their ‘brashness’ and in turn there is particular clothing/music/car linking those as being chavs but I could see other people with the same sportswear/music/car and I wouldn’t think chav…
In my teens you were either a chav, townie, or valley, if a boy was into their looks, gym etc they were spice boy there was a term for a girl but I can’t remember it
I will say those who associate as being chavs do wear the badge of chav proud and isn’t necessarily used as an insult but granted these people are probably the right age for the time frame op is referring to now day the terms have changed lots more different labels used yet all are understood without a need for description

Would you call a person one to their face (and expect them to take it well)? People are using terms like pikey on this thread as well - in my mind, chav is a slur in the same way, and not really an acceptable way to describe someone. OPs original question was whether there are actually people who still use these terms and talk like this. I guess the answer's yes.

Depends on the person and the situation. I have done but not everyone considers it a slur, some aspire to it.

No, it demonises lazy good for nothings/benefits culture. They generally don’t have jobs, so would not call them working class. I grew up in Glasgow and agree with pp - they were called NEDs there. My kids refer to dodgy lads as road men now, young lads that think they are gangsters (and generally smoke weed).

This ^^

not very empathic are you op!!

regarding the word chav - my age group of friends use it! It’s common parlance. I wouldn’t use it to mean working class people though.

Working class people don’t deserve a slur like that.

chavs are more about people who don’t work because they can’t be bothered to work or make a contribution to society and are crass / vulgar and loud and generally just well ‘chavvy’.
They hang around high streets and street corners with no aims or ambition in life.

I guess maybe I’ve invented some of this then all by myself!!
I totally get why your friend OP referred to them as chavs!

I agree. I wouldn’t call myself working class but I’d never think of working class as chav. That is a complete insult . The point of chavs I thought is they don’t work! They hang around with no ambition or aspirations and are obnoxious.

It’s totally wrong in my view to equate a chav to someone who is working class. Disgraceful.

@Carla786 why what?

I thought pikey was an ethnic slur against gypsies?

Sorry, I meant to reply to the whole of your comment but then I had to do something...

Re gaming the system, how could this be stopped? It seems like early on the government decided to turn a blind eye to fraud like this? Could stricter benefit enforcement aimed at getting people off the system have helped?

Also 'pikey'. I thought that was an ethnic slur against gypsies? But in this case it was used differently?

You’ve asked a lot of questions that posters have patiently answered in good faith. Answers result in more questions from you. So…. what do you think? What’s your position/ skin in the game?

OP, I can't believe what I'm reading 😂 I think you are very confused. Chavs do exist and it's nothing to do with being or insulting working class people.

wow talk about refusing to budge on your view! Get what you are saying about the origin but that’s the thing with the English language, words evolve as do the context and meaning. Gay used to mean happy but now people use that to describe sexuality, are you going to argue that all people who describe themselves as gay are only happy as that’s the origin of the word?

you will also find that chav is a word in the Oxford English Dictionary ‘a young person of a type characterised by coarse and brash behaviours (with connotations of low social status)’

You obviously don't live on a council estate 🤣 And no, I'm not saying everyone on a council estate are chavs, I know so many amazing upstanding people who don't have much but would do anything for their community. However there's still a hardcore group of absolute wrong'uns who are definitely chavs through and through

I don't know... If I was 39 and was harrassed by a bunch of young men as I peacefully went about my own business, I might have referred to them as chavs as well. Especially if just venting to someone I thought of as a close friend.

Honestly OP, if you think chavs don't exist, then you haven't walked down my local precinct lately! Come with me one day soon, and I'll point you out at least 5.

Your poor friend. She was trying to tell you about an upsetting and potentially scary situation for a woman on her own, and you launch into a lecture about her vocabulary. She won't turn to you for support next time.

😂

I'm sorry to tell you but storytelling is not your forte

I need their friend @'chavisamyth to also join in!