I am scared of the state of healthcare system

[Notsurewhattheansweris]

I am going to start saying that I respect all the clinicians and doctors and my personal experience has generally been positivie (with the exception of one case which likely led to a physchological trauma).

Whenever I see things on Mumsnet, there are so many stories of negligence, people being fobbed off, missed cancers etc. etc.

I find it really difficult after my own experience to feel safe anymore. It did leave me with a health anxiety that I am in therapy for but I cannot see the end to it because ultimately, I do not feel safe anymore.

What do you do, how do you cope? Or is it just my anxiety talking and we only see the scariest stories here that are still rare and not the norm?

From Macmillan 2023

Previous international comparison studies have consistently shown the UK has among some of the worst cancer survival rates in Europeix, however results published from these studies do not yet include the latest available data, due to the scale of data collection and analysis needed.
To better understand the current picture in the run-up to the UK’s General Election, Macmillan has compared the most up-to-date official statistics for cancer survival across the four UK nations with the equivalent data for Sweden, Norway and Denmark. All three countries have relatively similar healthcare systems to the UK and also publish high-quality cancer survival statistics.
As well as considerably poorer survival for colon, prostate and cervical cancer, the comparison (see table below) also shows survival rates for breast cancer are lagging up to 10 years behind.
The data also shows that other countries have been able to achieve substantial improvements in survival in recent years, with five-year survival rates for men with colon cancer in Denmark increasing from less than 60% for those diagnosed in 2007-2011 to more than 70% in the most recent figures. In comparison, the five-year survival rate for men with colon cancer in England has shown little to no improvement over the same time period and may even be getting worse.

OP, remember people seldom tell you their good experiences. People love to moan. I've had four experiences of needing medical help immediately over 20 years. The NHS has been fab, and fast on every occasion.

1.Routine screening for bc, recalled for biopsy the next day, saw consultant surgeon in 18 days, in surgery 23 days after that. chemo, radio all to schedule and now sorted. I couldn't have asked for more.

2.Idiot ex brought ds home on NYE with a 4 day old infected dog bite. arm swollen, ds whimpering with a bad fever. A&E saw him immediately despite it being busy, cleaned the wound, gave him iv ABs to hold the infection until the following morning, got us out of A&E which was full of drunk idiots, and we had a follow up appt NYD at 9am.

3.DS age 2 caught swine flu, admitted to paed icu within an hour. They were brilliant.

4.Me with a twisted ovarian dermoid. In agony, managed to get myself to A&E in the early hours. Passed out in triage and made it onto the morning surgical list.

When it's really urgent, I've never had a problem. The NHS is fabulous.
There is a lot you can do to protect yourself as well.

• Diet - eat 30 different fruit & veg a week. Sounds daunting but it's easy. That maximises your immune system. Avoid processed rubbish. Cook from scratch. It's much easier to keep your weight down too.
• Exercise - do some three times a week. You don't need gym membership or anything fancy. Three long walks will do.
• Self care - good hygiene, go to bed if you feel poorly, listen to your body.
• Avoid alcohol, vaping, smoking, illegal drugs.

And maybe take some leave. You sound stressed and anxious. Time to put yourself first for a few weeks.

Okay - and again am not saying NHS isn't in trouble - but there's a big difference between it being 'much worse than other countries' as a blanket statement and a piece from a charity comparing the UK to 3 of the richest countries on specific cancers. If OP is a man at risk from colon cancer who can move to Denmark, then sure this is a greenlight to do that. But it's not the same as UK is the worst in the world leg it now or face certain death, which was the original implication.

Last year they saved my son's life. He wasn't expected to survive but did against the odds because they went above and beyond and never gave up on him.

I'll always be incredibly grateful to them. They were absolutely amazing.

Until we have a care passport feom birth that records what we put in against what we take out there is no evidence for that statement on an individual basis. Firther some people pay in far more than they ever take out. The NHS is paid for by the people for the people and as a significant contributor I expect my significant contributions to extrapolate to better care for everyone than is currently provided.

I am not prepared to pay a penny more for the current NHS.

This is fair and overscreening can be problematic.

I don't have health anxiety - I am just choosing to screen as a prophylactic measure.

Well the NHS killed my kid, I don't trust it anymore.

The only thing you can do, is care for yourself as much as you can. And hope you don't need it.

I would be to frightened to live in the uk without private healthcare. I’m in my 50’s and where i live you can’t see a doctor. I’m well aware that when I’m elderly I’ll have to make huge sacrifices to stay insured.

I remember when my grandma was ill, “her” doctor, or always the same doctor, would pay her a home visit the day of her phonecall.

This old chesnut. Unless you are a higher rate tax payer ( ironically those most likely to have private insurance) you are not paying in anything like what you will take out over your lifetime. The older you are the more likely this is to be true ( as tax rates were lower in the past and pensions more generous).

Sinking more money into it will only make it worse. It needs rationalising and cutting waste/superfluous jobs.

With respect my mother is 89 and paid excrutiating rates of tax in the 70s; as did my father. My mother and step continue to pay not just income tax but also CGT. In the 80s I paid 60%.

Mother worked from the age of 16 until.she was 60ish when she looked after my grandmother who had severe alzheimers and kept her out of a nursing home for two or three years longer than necessary. Step worked from 15 until 72.

My family are not just individual net contributors but we have suppprted tens of others and thos tens of others deserve better care than they get.

I'm sure as a Dr you are very clever but clearly you know little about the UK's fiscal history. Therefore if there's a chestnut available I would venture you don't try to teach others to suck on it.

Also, many people hardly use NHS services. DH's grandad died in his armchair aged 92, having seen a Dr twice apart from his army medicals. MIL is similar. She worked all her life, had three children at home, has visited the GP about three times in the last 30 years and has had one colonoscopy - again 89. DH's father was much the same, just dropping dead from a heart attack aged 78.

Enjoy your chestnut.

So your family are net contributors- great. Most people are not, most people need circa £400,000 spending on health ans social care in the last 10 years of their life. There are an awful lot more of them than there ever have been before.

The UK is not a relatively low tax regime, the overall tax take from individuals is fairly high. It is not just income tax that the Government takes.

We absolutely can/could aim for an EU style health system and we should but that not only takes guts but serious thinking and competence which seems sorely lacking at the moment.

As I said, an endless litany of excuses.

Diagnosed with dual cancers. One has endless treatment lines, the other has 4. I’m terrified, clinging onto our NHS like a limpet. Regardless of this, the speed the NHS have worked at, has been incredible ( even in a&e). I will die of the 4 lines of treatment cancer. I don’t blame the NHS, but I HATE the “ together we will beat cancer adverts” giving the impression that every cancer is curable, it’s not, but people don’t want to hear that.

@Notsurewhattheansweris could you afford to join Benenden care as a minimal option , it really does get you seen and dealt with quicker . My sister had her gall bladder removed through Benenden before the date for the initial scan had come through on the NHS . Personally I think the NHS has been pretty crap for many years ,our local trust was quite happy to just let me die when I was 50 but fortunately we could afford to get private care .

Sorry to hear that, and wish you well.

I have a similar sort of story - I was diagnosed with bowel cancer eighteen months ago after a routine screening test which was very quickly dealt with by surgery. Unfortunately the diagnostic scans also showed up a thickened uterus and further investigations after I'd recovered from the bowel surgery showed that I also had endometrial cancer. That meant further surgery and radiotherapy. The latter wasn't completely successful so I'm left with non-curable cancer that I'm told should be controllable - currently just by taking a daily tablet to prevent excess oestregen production.

I had no symptoms for any of this and twenty years ago prior to these routime screening programs things may well have been terminal before I was even diagnosed. I've been lucky in never having to have much interaction with the NHS for most of my 65 year life, but I really can't fault the speed, professionalism and care I've experienced over the last eighteen months. I'm sure that there must be some mismanagement , a need for more money etc and it may well be a bit of a postcode lottery but if it is I've seen no evidence of it myself.

Most people need £400k in the last ten years of their life. Can you quote your source please?

You have not acknowledged the fact that you noted that previous generations paid very low rates of tax when that is not correct.

Thread on here about someone enduring a thirty two hour wait in A and E with a perforated bowel

Ok I’ll erase my own experience and take the experience of a complete stranger retold by a complete stranger instead. That would
be sensible level headed behaviour

My DH is still alive due to life saving surgery. I was so impressed with the level of care he got. His surgeon even popped in at times after he finished for the day including evenings and weekends and he often said he was glad he was able to help. In the daytime I would say all the staff were wonderful that I met at visiting times and the staff in the critical care unit were amazing .His after care has been excellent .It does seem to vary at different hospitals from the look of things.

Of course that wasn't the original implication

https://ecancer.org/en/news/24058-uk-survival-ranksamong-the-worst-in-the-world-for-deadliest-cancers#

https://gmdpacademy.org/news/uks-cancer-survival-rates-compared-to-comparable-nations-key-insights-from-2024/

I have chronic pain and the lack of help /support is awful. It’s more under control now but at times I’ve felt very frightened and my condition got worse from the neglect. Also the level of responsibility I had for managing high level meds with zero guidance is honestly terrifying.

To be fair, most people under pension age rarely need to access healthcare, so I don't know why working people worry so much about it.
You say yourself, OP, that you have anxiety - so that is something you need to address, either via the NHS or a private therapist.

We've just needed to access emergency care for my daughter - it was really good in terms of clinical care, speed of response at a&e, getting surgery quickly and an efficient discharge. Hospital is falling apart though.