Did some ND children starve before chicken nuggets were invented?

[BusWankers]

I'm not being horrible, genuinely curious.

You read on here how a child who has autism or some other issue, will only eat safe foods. Usually a lot of things like chicken nuggets, a particular brand of cheese and onion crisps, Nutella, supermarket pizzas (UPF mostly)

Do we think children in the 1920s just went hungry? Or perhaps they were forced to eat foods they didn't like. After all you do hear stories,of adults even now being made to sit at the table and choke down food etc.

DB in 70s/80s (not diagnosed as DM insists there's nothing "wrong" with him, didn't speak until 3, never had a relationship, used to scream and kick as older child) used to eat and still eats a very limited diet - lots of potatoes. He won't eat chicken but ate other meats. He became obese and was the only one of us who Mum said "ate properly" saying we didn't eat enough, she was also obese.

There was massive pressure at school to finish your plate or get hit due to "starving children in Africa". Remember hiding food in our socks. Thankfully it had eased by time DB got to school.

I have an ASD DS and he refused chicken nuggets for years. He often doesn't like food touching but eats a good range now at 18 including almost every fruit, carrots, radish, broccoli, most meats, potatoes, plain rice, plain pasta, cheese. He will also eat curries maybe as they are sweeter. He has never responded to starve or eat it, he would starve for a few days. But he does respond well to buffet type presentation of different things in separate dishes though eats in colours - will have a plate of all green and a plate of all beige. I remember one poor child being sick at school when we had the free milk and crying saying her Dad would beat her if she got the vomit on her dress and teacher didn't do anything other than say she could decline milk but she was too scared of her Dad to do that and said she would get beaten for making a show of herself refusing. She and we were so happy when Thatcher stopped the milk.

Someone early in the thread made an excellent point about toddlers and weaning, it’s absolutely normal and expected that children will reject foods particularly at the first exposure. This can make parents nervous and anxious and potentially latch on to pathologising a normal reaction. Parenting is bloody hard.

Didn't happen in my house in the 50s or 60s. Amazing how lives vary.

My Aunt (dad's sister) was born in the 1940s and lived off a certain type of biscuit.

As an adult she was vegan who didn't eat potatoes, so had a very limited diet (keeping in mind some of the decades this covered!)

She lived until she was about 80.

I struggle with some foods and my grandparents (mum's parents) were very kind but insistent we ate everything on the plate when they looked after grandkids in the holidays. It was hell for me to try and eat a pork chop (for example) and I was so unhappy, my dad picked up on it and spoke to them so I got special dispensation!

I wish I had a pound for every time someone told me that my son wouldn't starve himself and would eventually eat if he was hungry enough.

The ignorance around this is astounding. Yes, my son would have starved if he wasn't allowed his safe foods.

Even if I did manage to get him to try something different he would just gag on it anyway. Arfid wasn't as well known about when he was young. My son is an adult now and there are a few meals that he can eat, but he's still underweight and nothing he eats is particularly healthy.

We all want our children to have healthy diets, we all want them to thrive. If we could get them to eat healthier we would.

How many kids with ARFID are avoidant and how many are restrictive? It would be interesting to compare the data about that. Also is the support the same for both and if so, why?

They obviously chose whatever safe food was available in that culture. I know ND kids in the 90s who would only eat white bread and apples. Chicken nuggets obviously did exist but it wasn't as widely available then as it is now. ND kids in Asia will probably only stick with plain rice or bao buns (the white steamed kind).

Another interesting example in pop culture is the book Harriet the Spy. Harriet was clearly ND and had to have a tomato sandwich for lunch every single day. This was casually woven into the storyline and doesn't play any role in the plot but it's an interesting insight in ARFID kids before common safe foods were widely available.

They ate what they were given or went hungry, so they ate what they were given. Even in my day there was no, 'if you don't want that you can have something else', there was nothing else. Food was bought, prepared, put on the table and you ate it.

My dad just ate very plain stuff (he’s 75) like bread and butter, potatoes, plain meat, my gran described him as a VERY fussy eater as a child
he still reverts back to meat and 2 veg but my mum pushed him a little and he found other stuff he liked so he will eat Indian, pizza, seafood etc etc as she said she loved food and wanted him to be able to enjoy it as well

That is heartbreaking. That poor little boy.

Or you didn't and died.

For DP’s granny, who was born in 1906, her ‘chicken nuggets’ were jam sandwiches. She did eat a few other things, but you could have counted them on one hand. I know she ate porridge. DP lived with her for a couple of years and said she cooked normal food for him and the rest of the family.

There was a really good thread on Reddit about this a month ago. Lots of people from around the world chimed in.

What foods do picky-eaters in your culture eat?

www.reddit.com/r/Cooking/comments/1ldv3r6/what_foods_do_pickyeaters_in_your_culture_eat/

Unless you’re in the habit of chasing down antelopes and chewing on raw meat, I’m not sure how your question is relevant. It isn’t.

Or the parents worked out what was in their power to get they'd eat and got it and hoped it was enough to keep their kids alive - like now.

It was just different stuff to now - and possible due to more variables either sometimes rejected adding to frustraions or sometimes lead to some additional flexiblity.

Pretty sure that was what my DGP ended up doing. I do remember my own parents - with their own food issues - occaionally trying to force or guilt me into eating things I that made me gag - mostly though Dad usually gave in and found alternatives but would still offer orginal just in case- which is what I think my DGP actually ended up doing even with there much more limited options.

I don't belive most parents shurgged and let their kids die - I think they worried and tried but had less access to information and support than modern parents and there was probbaly a whole lot more shame and blame than now.

My DM fed DSis home made custard with extra cream (and some salt!) stirred in when she was little. DSis had stopped eating after a tummy bug and wouldn't eat anything but DM's calorific stealth-custard for months. DSis transitioned to scrambled eggs followed by really runny macaroni cheese, and gradually introduced additional bland foods, but it took a long time. I know DM found the hardest part was to just carry on as if it was normal, not wanting DSis to pick up any additional anxiety around food.

This was the reason we booked 1 week lol. DC hadn't been abroad before so we weren't sure how it would have went and I was glad it was only a week by the end of it because I was desperate to get DC home and fed.

It's not even a case of starving them they will literally starve themselves if the routine/surroundings aren't what they are used to 💕

Im glad your DC can manage buffets better now, im very apprehensive to try again after the sheer worry of that holiday lol. We literally tried everything by even taking the food out of the restaurant back to the room etc but DC just point blank refused.

I have my Great grandmother’s tea set from c 1900. It was originally for 12, the sugar bowl
is enormous, and it includes 2 larger plates which my Gran told me were ‘bread and butter plates’.

This is a very interesting thread. I know a family dealing with a very fussy eater who claims to only like M&S ham sandwiches at lunchtime, but he manages fine when he’s on holiday. As soon as they’re home, he refuses anything else. This has to be at least in part a control issue.

We have done a lot of self catering too @Mini1977 - it's difficult! We took frozen individual portions of mashed potato on our last UK trip...

IME for any eating disorder there’s only scant support when the child/adult is severely underweight.

I suspect my son is restrictive but I’m not 100% sure. He basically lives on milk, but has a small rota of safe foods that he cycles through every few weeks or months. The stage between foods is always tricky.

I have a special eye roll for the people who say ‘well in my day you ate what was put in front of you or you starved’. No you didn’t. If you had decent parents, they found workarounds. It just wasn’t talked about so much back then. Making a child eat food that causes them to retch is child abuse. My mum made some low effort substitutions for my brother and sister, who both struggled with certain textures. It was done without any fanfare and my mum was happy as long as they were eating something. I look back and am thankful for her innate compassion and understanding.

Anybody who wants try and win a battle with my youngest child will find that his desire not to eat what he doesn’t like will vastly outweigh their desire to watch him starve to death. Unless they’re a particularly cruel specimen of humanity.

You probably didn’t know anyone with ARFID then, because most parents wouldn’t persist with that approach when it was clear it wasn’t working and their child was suffering.

The children I knew had parents who didn’t exactly advertise how they fed their children, but siblings of the children ate normal diets, so presumably they eventually catered to their child just like parents do now.

Everyone’s opinion is irrelevant. It’s an opinion.

I have said multiple times that there are exceptions to the rule and that some children may be affected to such an extent. But the reality is that not EVERY kid who eats nothing but chicken nuggets will starve themselves to death if nothing else is offered. A large proportion, I believe, would start to eat another food they deemed safe.

Is there support when Arfid kids are overweight?

It would be interesting to read about those who do not have safe foods too just ones who choose the same foods because they like routine. Seems there is a lot of focus on certain elements and not all.

We didn't have processed food in the house, so my brother relied on toast, soup and mashed potato. He did spend long periods of time when he didn't eat, because he didn't like to, but he ate when he was starving.