Don't want dd to be under pressure in year 11.

[Forthisthread222]

Dd is behinde at school. She's just finished year 10 so will be going into year 11. She got the following marks end of year grades.

English language 3. Predicted 4
English literature 2. Predicted 0
Maths 1+ predicted 3-
Combined science 3-3 predicted 3-3
RE 2+ predicted 2
Business study p2 predicted p2
Geography 3 predicted 4
Creative media p2 predictive p2

Personally im not worried about her grades. I feel like there are alternatives in education that she could study at college or other educational settings. We are not an accedemic family. Well apart from my oldest ds . But everyone else not at all.

Dd feels under alot of pressure the school is very strict. There's definitely no school home life balance. I dont feel theres enough down time theres always something lingering.

I feel her grades dont define her as a person and her mental health is much more important. She's on the waiting list for CAMHS. She's in contact with samaritans. I know she was doing something with kooth but shes not mentioned them in a while. I dont think anything will come of CAMHS. But we will have to see.

I have given her lots of hugs told her not to worry . Told her to do her best for HER not the school its her who matters not them. I told her education is for ever. And theres alternatives in education such as animal courses, photography amd other things.

Yes, I would say so. (Does she have an EHCP?)
DD's courses have been
. Level 1 work based - portfolio of pictures with written descriptions, completed in college
. Level 1 theory based - assignments at Pass/Merit/Distinction, you can redo each to get a Pass, plus 2 multichoice exams you could take 3 times each, mainly completed in college
. Level 2 work based - written assignments and proof of practical but assignments mainly about the doing, mainly completed in college but DD did around 1-2 hrs weekly outside.

Interestingly all had pretty much the same amount of practical time, it is just the assessment method that changed.

She isn't going to do the Level 2 theory based as the way it is assessed (includes as I understand it larger cross topic assignments and a large cross topic practical test where you have to explain as you go) as it would be too much.

Ask to see timetables and examples of work as I found it very hard to really get a handle on what a typical week would look like.

What we have found is further education providers offer a big range of courses, from entry level up but (obviously) you can only do the ones they offer.

There seems to be a lot of courses asking for 4 grades 1-3 to get on to level 2 course which she will have. Or 5 grades over a 4 for a level 3 course. But they offer foundation year if you dont have that so you do level 1 then 2.

But, in my local area the foundation options are very restricted and the level 2 offer has genuinely been reduced to fewer subjects. But this is a very college dependent thing.

So yes there are options and your child's mental health issues the priority and she will find a great pathway.

No she doesn't have an ehcp .

Sorry I didn't understand the rest of your post.

I think yours saying level 1 is based on pictures and writing what has been learnt?

Level 2 work based so a placement and they do assessments on what they are learning ?

Sorry if I have it completely wrong.

My nephew did an animal care course at Capel after A levels which he enjoyed a lot. He was actually quite academically capable but not very engaged with education and although he ultimately found it was more for post GCSE students it helped him get back on track and now he's going to uni.

Our DS has ADHD and is predicted ok GCSEs but I'm preparing myself for the possibility he might not reach that if the sheer volume of work is too much for him (it's such a lot!). Capel is something he's actually quite interested in after his cousin's experience and I'm bearing it in mind as an option post GCSE.

Thats fantastic to hear. Its great your nephew did that as well. Probably let him rest academicly whist still doing something.

I agree its alot of work and pressure on children definitely sounds like a good thing to keep in mind. Good luck

Definitely go and look at the colleges at the vocational courses. If she is prepared to travel or confident with travelling there are lots of great specialist colleges around in London. My eldest dd went to a colleges specialising in creative arts (drama, media etc) and started on level 2 qualification, then did 2 year level 3 (equiv to A levels) and now has a place at university. She had a 40 minute train journey to get there.
All the colleges will make you resit maths and English if not already at grade 4 (they don’t get a choice as this is a government requirement), so would be good if she could focus on getting grade 4’s in those.

looking around the colleges and finding what she would like to do is very motivating as it gives the students a goal / purpose for working.

The school will most likely drop eng lit for her set anyway but dropping a subject so she can focus on core subjects is a good idea and worth making an appointment to speak to head of year in September.

However, please remember the schools are under enormous pressure to get students to meet their target grades, which is why some of that pressure gets passed down.

There's always resits, esp. for English & math. Plenty of wonderful & talented people end up doing resits. Not the end of the world. Good to get 4+ on first sitting, but this is not only chance to get those grades.

I wondered if there was scope for reframing the 'very strict' school. Does "very strict" = lots of structure and clear expectations about the effort she should put in, and the attitude she should have towards trying to learn? Are those bad things?

By being "very strict" they are saying "She CAN do this." It's when they stop being very strict that they would be saying "we give up, we can't help her". "Very strict" is a vote of confidence, they believe in her ability to improve her grades.

Also life sucks maybe... thing is, there is pressure in all areas of life & only by experiencing it, do we learn to cope with it. Even when we have competing stresses and demands. As long as you both know resits/other options will present themselves, then she can get thru the stressful period & find a good path forward.

I get what your saying . But none of it is worth damaging her mental health. I don't want her burning out . Worrying every minute of the day. Even when she's not doing school work she's still Worrying. Constantly waiting for more home work to pop up when she thought she was done.

Arrange a meeting with the school as soon as they are back in September and get them to set up a plan.

If she fails English and Maths she will have to re-sit, I would get a tutor to push her towards a 4 to avoid further stress and pressure if she doesn't get the grades.

I have a DD with ND and the pressure was awful but on the long run it was worth concentrating on the subjects she needed (English/Maths) and wanted for going now on A-level. We ignored others.

Saying that, DD thrives on structure so doing a bit each day/every other day in the holidays actually helped her more than just hanging around.

Not quite.
'Work based' can just mean practical sessions at college. Though DD's Level2 did have 2 lots of 1 week placements.
I think however that the key thing is to try to get a grip in advance of what the course looks like, what writing is required, how much support etc. It may not always be best to go straight away for the hardest level you qualify for.

English language 3. Predicted 4
English literature 2. Predicted 0
Maths 1+ predicted 3-
Combined science 3-3 predicted 3-3
RE 2+ predicted 2
Business study p2 predicted p2
Geography 3 predicted 4
Creative media p2 predictive p2

I would talk to her about her plans for the future and what sort of job she would like to do. Then I would sit down with her looking at her results and say to her that you can ask the school if you can drop some of them, but even if the school don’t let you drop some of them it is always possible for her as a person to adjust the amount of effort she puts into each of them.

In this particular case, I would want to be focusing on the ones that she is doing quite well in, with a bit of the ones that she might need for a further course. So English language stays, as does combine science and geography. I would ditch English literature and RE, in favour of spending much more time on maths - including out of school if needs be. Maths is important for so many things, and she at least needs functional maths.

I don’t know what P2 means so I can’t help that, but I would look to see whether either or both courses might be helpful for her future plans/qualifications that she would like to do. I would then focus on whichever of them is most likely to be helpful to her.

Even if the school doesn’t say that she can drop things, you can tell her that it’s alright for her to focus in on the ones she really needs.

I cant afford a tutor. And it would be more pressure for her. She needs a break not more work.

I don’t think you understand the position your daughter will be in if she gets these grades at the end of year 11 though? It’ll be even more pressure.

Agreed. And a life without pressure is unrealistic. It's teaching coping strategies that's important because pressure will inevitably crop up throughout life.

Then she can do courses at lower levels.

Pressure is great until it is too much and the person breaks down.
Then spends the next 5 years (and counting) recovering.

Exactly she can do lower level courses. Obviously its better if she can pass gcse. But if she cant then there's other ways . She may pass them at a later age. But I feel that's OK.

I would ask if there is any option for DD to drop a GCSE or two to have better focus and perhaps grades in the others. A number of kids did this in DD's school and had supervised free periods to do homework etc instead of having to do so much at home as well. Not all schools can do this but it's worth asking. They really don't need 8+ GCSEs when they are not going to go down a linear academic route and doing so many is ridiculous across the board.

I only did 8 and I went to an average comprehensive in Greater Manchester and I'm a solicitor who has worked in top firms in London, FWIW.

There's definitely nothing to loose by asking.

Could she repeat year 10 and do fewer GCSEs?

Hi OP,

I used to teach in a secondary school and I have taught many students who were getting the same sort of results as your daughter.

the first thing I want to say is that her mental health must come first. You say she has been in touch with the Samaritans and is using Kooth.

what sort of distress is she in? Is she self harming? Has she talked about feeling suicidal?

most years in the school I worked in there would be a student who tried to kill themselves at least partially in response to the pressure from school.

it’s now required for everyone to continue in education until 18 and as a result most FE colleges especially the bigger ones offer a large range of courses. Level 1 vocational courses do not need GCSEs at grade 4 or above to get into, and many colleges also offer entry level courses that students who got no GCSEs (so all results U) can do.

there WILL be a course for her. And FE colleges are good at building up confidence again after GCSEs.

don’t focus on the GCSEs. Focus on her as a person and making sure that she knows that you love her and that she is a good person and has skills and qualities that you value.

many teens can be very successful in other areas if they are not academically inclined - ones I have known have had great people skills (which businesses really value) and work in customer relations or in retail. Other students I’ve known have had an interest in sport and gone into sports coaching for kids.

schools and colleges often give the impression that if you don’t get English and maths at grade 4 your life is over and you are doomed. This is absolutely not the case.

build your daughter up. Try to find activities outside school she enjoys (if she doesn’t already do some) - consider drama, dance, cadets, etc.

No i dont thiblnk they even dp that on school. Not 100% though. But anyway dd was in year 10 and going to year 9 for just 1 lesson as she was struggling . And she felt embarrassed and asked to stop. So a whole repeat wont work for her .

Don't call her non academic. Let the school do what you don't care about so she stands a chance as an adult who can read, write and add up to at least the basic standard.

Thank you. Yes she has low level self harmed. She does seem to follow the advice given such as flicking an elastic band. Splashing cold water on her face and other things.

Yes I agree definitely first for her mental health. And I just have a feeling she will do better when school comes to an end. By doing a course that allows her to grow in something she wants to do at her own pace at a level that suits her.

I literally told dd it doesn't matter if she doesn't pass her gcse theres always alternatives and learning is for life. I told her that it's her that matters nothing else and I want her happy.

Restart year 10 in a new school? Year 11 is going to be hell with those grades now, unless she puts in a lot of work over the summer.