Andrew Lawrence (comedian) is being cancelled but doubling down (trigger warning)

[AdultHumanF]

TW: Liverpool crash

Andrew Lawrence is a comedian. He made a joke about the Liverpool crash earlier this week and is now being “cancelled” by many comedy venues and so on. Instead of apologizing, he’s doubling down and continuing to make jokes.

Im interested to hear peoples thoughts on this. Personally, I think it’s far too soon for jokes, and jokes about people being injured are rarely funny anyway. That said, I don’t know if it’s right to police jokes in this way?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cq69zdpr0r5o.amp

He can say what he wants, but he can also suffer the consequences of it.

I don't think he's very funny. But these comedy clubs which cancel right-wing comedians while allowing left-wing comedians like Frankie Boyle who has said some disgusting things to play on are just deeply hypocritical.

I don't think people should be cancelled for a bad joke because they are right wing. Otherwise at some point when the pendulum has swung, comedians who are left-wing who tell bad jokes will be cancelled. It's always surprising to me that people don't realize this. Almost like no one's ever read any history.

It's incredibly illiberal to believe that the consequences of saying something you don't agree with should be the withdrawal of the right to earn your living.

No, comedians should never be cancelled for making jokes, even ones that offend some people. Funny is so subjective that individually we have to be prepared to just ignore the stuff we don't like to be sure we will get the stuff we do.

Also, I am so done with venue managers imposing their moral values on acts they disagree with. It's a slippery slope, and they aren't the people I want in charge of what I can go and see. I can make that choice for myself.

If a comedian consistently isn't funny, they won't be comedians for long. It's one industry where natural selection works pretty well.

That article references a gig at Caddies in Essex, he's really not having his success cancelled. Caddies is an indoor crazy golf with a giant ball pit that children have parties at.
He's trying to get noticed.

No need to cancel him, no one is buying tickets for his shows.
Just another talentless gobshite trying to get noticed by being unfunny about Liverpool. Pissing off an entire city when you rely on people paying to see you perform isn't really the cunning plan he thinks it is.

It’s a private business though, you have no innate right to see whatever entertainer you want. If a venue doesn’t want to support an artist that’s their decision, if you want someone to have a platform you can be the one to give it to them but they aren’t owed it by anyone.

The phrase 'too soon' seems apt.

I read 'Tickling the English' by Dara O'Briain. One of the things he talks about it is when are jokes 'too soon'.

He then goes on to say a few days after the shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes someone made a joke, but it wasn't actually about the shooting but the route taken on the underground.

I think there are two things, yes it can be too soon and I don't think making fun of victims is ever funny.

This was both too soon and making fun of the victims.

Tbh this is what he wants. The controversy. Hes pretty unknown and this sort of thing and subsequent threads about him will be music to his ears. He won’t be cancelled from everywhere

This is true but really it should be audience appetite that dictates whether someone disappears from the face of entertainment. Perhaps he isnt popular enough for those venues anyway

I dont know who he is and from whats on this thread he doesnt sound my cup of tea but I actually find it refreshing that someone doesnt apologise and go all mealy mouthed with apologies for something they clearly planned and meant in the first place. This happens all the time in politics and entertainment.

If thats your bag, then own it and continue making jokes, the audience will decide if they like it or not.

Lots of comedians have said over the years that apparently its fine to offend people with jokes and nothing should be off the table.

By his own admission he'll earn a lot of money from his joke, due to the engagement.

Even if a comedy club decided they didn't want him at an upcoming gig.

How is he going to earn money from a joke, or that joke?

Would they make jokes about the Southport killings that night?

Ultimately jokes need to be funny. That's the litmus test for comedy. If you say something hateful, and nasty, that's not funny, then is it even comedy?

If you have enough followers on Twitter, have paid for a blue tick and get a big response to a post, Twitter gives you money.

It's a change that Musk made a couple of years ago to encourage rage-bait shitposts engagement.

Being "cancelled" is the most meaningless thing. It's not even a real consequence - it seems from this thread this person has been cancelled before; yet here he still is in the public eye.

He said something for shock value. It shocked and had consequences.

Gets even dafter when the free speech gets brought up when someone is cancelled. As if cancelling is in the same league as being executed or disappeared.

No idea.

And being funny is subjective. Im sure there are people who find him funny, otherwise he wouldnt still be going. See also Roy Brown and Jim Davidson and the likes

I remember now at a comedy club in Crystal Palace, just after Diana died, it was a few days after it, and the comedian made a joke about it and the audience gasped/booed - intake of breath type of thing.

And he said 'oh too soon?' and people sort of indicated yes, too soon and he just moved on to the next bit of his act.

No great loss to the comedy world.

I didnt know this

I'm not saying they can't no platform people although of course there are equality laws they need to stay on the right side of. I'm saying they shouldn't.

It's a dangerous road to go down because if a business makes a values-based decision on one performer, all future performers allowed to go ahead will be deemed to have passed their test regardless of whether they have applied it rigorously, or consistently or at all.

Anyway, I'm no more comfortable with businesses making arbitrary, value-based decisions about what we should be allowed to see than I would be if the state made those decisions. It is self-indulgent, and if it becomes widespread, it can be a dangerously anti free speech practice, especially when vocal minorities disproportionately police conformity with particular views. The obvious example of this is when Joanna Cherry was no-platformed by a venue at the Edinburgh Fringe 2 years ago because she dared to be a lesbian who spoke in favour of single sex spaces. That wasn't comedy, obviously, but the no-platforming of people who may offend led to women being unable to express their concerns about their rights for years, and ultimately led to them seeking redress in the courts.

You’re being ridiculous, that’s not how the world works. Venues make decisions about what they host literally every day, whether it’s a certain genre of music only, or only indie films or performers who support their political stance. It’s normal!
It’s a private business.
It’s nothing like anti free speech, someone can say what they want but they aren’t owed a stage at someone else’s cost to say it from.

I assume you aren’t up in arms that kneecap were pulled from one of their shows?

That's subjective. Some may find it funny, some may not. Frankie Boyle has had thousands of complaints and been investigated many times by the BBC. I'm sure many find his jokes disgusting and unfunny.

No comedian should be cancelled for telling a joke.

You can be offended, you can refuse to buy tickets to a show or watch anything with them on.

Those are appropriate consequences, the individual can choose not to support or like an entertainer/comedian.

But it IS chilling and inappropriate for venues to be cancelling a comedian because of any joke. Cancelling a show because no one bought tickets would be another thing entirely.

You're being disingenuous as you seem to see no platforming as a series of separate events rather than a somewhat militant trend to cancel people.

People have lost their jobs, recording contracts, acting roles, publishing contracts and gigs because of pressure from social media and this is another example of that.

I don't remember anyone being 'cancelled' before knee jerk reactions on social media took off. It's not about people facing the consequences of their behaviour (how self righteous) or private businesses making a choice. It's about craven capitulation to public pressure.

Imagine being the parent of one of the injured children and reading that. It's literally just happened and he's made a " joke" in poor taste. It's a free country and he can say what he wants but he has to expect backlash and deal with it.