Is this disability discrimination?

[oldandknackerd]

My current workplace is relocating to a site that will be at least a 45 drive away which although not ideal is fine (I currently work 10mins away from home and this was one of the reasons I applied.
Unfortunately my car is 14 years old and although very reliable it's age does means a large repair bill could happen if something was to go wrong and there's no way i can afford to pay a large bill without saving up for it ....
I could in theory get public transport to the new site but it would take me 3 buses and a 20 minute walk (total nearly 2 hours each way )
Due to having severe arthritis cold and fatigue are things that make my condition worse (I already have a couple of small 'reasonable adjustments in place to accommodate this)and reality don't think i could manage the journey via public transport if for any reason I couldn't use my car .

My point is could or should my organisation be making a reasonable adjustment under the DDA for the above scenario?

Just for clarity I earn 25k a year as a lone parent so there is no way i can afford to buy a newer car ..

You really should have read the full thread, given that I have posted that I am disabled and receive PIP at the higher level in both categories. My point, had you bothered to read it, was not "disability bashing". The OP has severe arthritis (their description) and would prefer not to spend two hours on public transport and then walk for 20 minutes especially when it is cold. As someone with severe arthritis I would love to be able to get on a bus and/or walk for 20 minutes in any weather.

And yes, I am aware that some people struggle to get awarded PIP. Others sail through with no problems. 50% are awarded PIP on their first application. Some valid claims are certainly rejected unfairly, but there are also people who apply without meeting the criteria too.

Perhaps had you read the thread you wouldn't be rushing to the sort of judgements that you accuse others of?

I do get the daily living element of pip but not entitled to anything for mobility.

@EmmaMaria I read most of the thread...but it's a long one so I may have not seen everything. I saw enough to read some really ignorant posts.

I did not accuse you of disability bashing. I said I was sick of seeing it on MN.

But I stand by what i said. You can't presume anything with PIP. @oldandknackerd has confirmed they don't get mobility.

So I see. And even before that they it was clear that they were able to travel to work - I don't envy them the journey, nor do I blame them for not wanting to do it. But that has nothing to do with disability and everything to do with their car being older and possibly unreliable. Whilst I agree with you that the negative stereotypes etc are overwhelming, a part of that attitude is fostered by exactly this kind of thing - playing a disability card for something that clearly has nothing to do with disability. Yes, it's the minority - but it's the minority that are "making waves" that people see and hear, not the majority who are just trying their best to get on with life. In another context you could say the same about football fans (only a minority are hooligans but football fans all get tarred with that brush) or Brits abroad (the majority are great, but I cringe at a minority who are just awful).

Besides which - it was only two pages long and you chose to single me out for your comments, not the other "ignorant posts" you refer to. And arthritis is one of the conditions that has the highest award rate for PIP, which is very relevant - for better or for worse it is very visible, and it is visible disabilities that tend to do better with claims throughout the whole process. It shouldn't be like that but it is.

I'm sorry you felt singled out. I didn't mean to upset you. I found your post a bit abrupt and as I say, I know loads of people with my disability who cannot get anything through PIP.

Perhaps I got a bit muddled between two threads I was reading. I can't always read every post or keep up when it's being updated quickly. That is part of my disability which affects me cognitively.

I was trying to address your point and then make a general comment that there were some really awful posts that lack understanding of disability on this thread and others yesterday...and now today.

I will agree to disagree about @oldandknackerd 's op. If I was in her shoes, I would be feeling anxious because I know I cannot do public transport either. I do think there may be some legal info she can access because this is a change of usual workplace and it's usually mentioned in contract. It is worth exploring what can be done to help her. I don't really agree with your position I'm afraid, but accept your point of view is based on your experience, as is mine.

I don't think it has nothing to do with her disability. If her car died now, she could cope with a short journey on public transport. She cannot do that in the new place. Asking about RA doesn't make her entitled or making waves or guaranteed to get it. I hope @oldandknackerd had a good boss who will be able help perhaps agreeing to some WFH or something should the situation arise.

You could move house? Start saving for a newer car.

No it's not disability discrimination.

Unfortunately I can't afford either ..

@MewithME I will agree to disagree about 's op. If I was in her shoes, I would be feeling anxious because I know I cannot do public transport either. I do think there may be some legal info she can access because this is a change of usual workplace and it's usually mentioned in contract. It is worth exploring what can be done to help her. I don't really agree with your position I'm afraid, but accept your point of view is based on your experience, as is mine.

I still think you are missing the point - she can do public transport, she simply doesn't want to. And I am not blaming her for that because if I could even get on a bus, I wouldn't want to commute for hours on public transport. But not wanting to has nothing to do with my disability. Just as her not wanting to has nothing to do with her condition either. If I could get on the bus, I still wouldn't. Choice, not health.

The issue with change of workplace (which is actually not what she asked, hence she didn't get that answer) is different. That has nothing to do with disability. It would be a grey area. As a general rule, even if there is a relocation clause in contracts (and actually, even though there isn't) the sticking point is that the general rule is that a relocation of up to 90 minutes travel time each way is the starting point for a reasonable "ask". If the OP was dependant on public transport she could claim redudancy - but she isn't and her employer presumably knows that. The fact that she might occasionally be dependant on public transport doesn't count - that could happen to anyone. Unfortunately the DWP applies the same condition to unemployment benefits - so the OP may be sanctioned if she quit her job. Obviously if the employer were to make her redundant that would not be a problem. But I am assuming since she hasn't sought any advice on leaving the employment that that isn't what she wants to do.

My point is that it's not a case of being unwilling to use public transport and I would in normal circumstances be quite happy to do so if my car was awaiting repair ...
Unfortunately the long commute via public transport and being exposed to adverse weather would exasperate my condition leaving me in pain hence my original question about it being disability discrimination and whether my employer should be making reasonable adjustments to accommodate this...
I love my job and want to continue working as long as possible

There is a difference between what the employer chooses to do and what they must do. They can choose to do anything they want. But there is no evidence at all that this is disability discrimination, or that they must do something. In legal terms your arthritis might flare, occasionally, if you have to use public transport in adverse weather. But the "reasonable adjustment" could easily be to tell you to take annual or sick leave if you are unable to get to the workplace. Nobody can tell you what your employer might choose to do, but I would not be throwing around phrases about discrimination, because there is no evidence of it, and the outcome you get may not be to your liking.

OP, kindly, you're talking as though you expect your car to die imminently

Get some breakdown cover

Get any work done to your car when you can and minimise the risk of being without your car

You do seem very focused on being without a car - I am also disabled and drive and I understand it. But I wouldn't think that by your company moving property, they would need to instigate any adjustments for you.

As things stand:
You're able to drive to work
You have a vehicle
Your vehicle works

I've NO legal knowledge, but think it's poor that employers can add 90 minutes onto a daily commute without recompense. Have your colleagues not also been unhappy? It will impact them, too (probably less than it impacts you, admittedly!).

However, what adjustments would you ask for? They might just say your role in that location is no longer needed, and offer to make you redundant, or allow you to take unpaid leave if your car breaks down... no knowledge of employment law, but I'd be phoning ACAS to clarify situation.

Agree, I think op needs some employment advice from likes of ACAS on the contractural change of place of work. Many companies would offer a transitional arrangement such as mileage/travel allowance for a fixed period or potential voluntary redundancy. Although op says that is not an option, it could be argued the role no longer exists at current place of work and relocation distance is not reasonable. It might even be possible to try it for a period to assess the impact.

This is incorrect! If it was enough to treat everyone the same then there wouldn't be any reasonable adjustments.

@oldandknackerd it's pointless getting loads of responses if half are wrong.

Thanks everyone for all the suggestions and comments. I think I need to contact ACAS and then speak to my employer re finding a solution to a potential barrier in regards getting to work

By your post you clearly don't understand how the Equality Act applies in this and similar scenarios.

Your post is extremely offensive for using the phrase 'playing the disability card'.

You mean because Op intends to investigate whether changing her work place and her employer appearing to fail to properly consider what effect that will have on Ops ability to carry out her work that is 'playing the disability card'. Exchange that for race and see how it sounds now.

Thankfully the government of England does think that people with disabilities do need protection from unscrupulous employers and employers ignorant of their statutory duties and have seen fit to legislate against it. Or do you think you know better.

Actually offensive and disgusted doesn't cover what I think about your foul post.

Offensive and disgusted about covers your posting - you clearly haven't read the thread and you certainly don't know me, because I know a great deal about the Equality Act (including the fact that its "protections" are far less trhan people think they are) - and I know better than you (and actually on many subjects I appear to know better than the government of England too).

There is absolutely nothing stopping the OP from carrying out her work other than a vague possibility that has not happened and may never happen, and so simply deciding that it must be disability discrimination if it did is quite certainly "playing the disability card". She has made it repeatedly clear that the "carless journey" is not impossible - simply not her preference. Exchange that for race and actually it shows exactly how ridiculous her suggestion is. Not wanting to get on a few busses and walk for 20 minutes because one might be black, for example, would be a stupid argument.

You really ought to educate yourself, and read the full thread, before making such nasty and personal attacks on others.

@oldandknackerd

I'm not expecting a reasonable adjustment because my car is old.
I'm asking for a reasonable adjustment because catching public transport isn't a viable option due to my disability
But there is no demand that you catch public transport. That's your choice.

What actually do you want them to do. Specifics.

OP. If your car does would you then expect the company to pay for taxis permanently?

OP with respect you said your car is reliable but nothings happened to it? It’s just a “what if”. Start saving for if that times comes, you’re going to need to anyway.

Good heavens there are so many wrong and uninformed or just plain ignorant responses on this thread.

let’s hope these eejits are not employers

My company moved last year and we were told redundancy wasn't an option. So we all got individual consultations and could ask our own questions with a manager and a HR person. For example some people asked about bike to work, we have multiple offices so some people asked about using other offices, claiming mileage for a certain period to the new office, working from home and changing work hours. Also people just ask mundane questions like what kind of coffee machine will we have and how will the desks be arranged and where will our team sit. Many people worked from home more or changed work patterns as a result. Also people did leave which was sad for me as I think we lost some good people but they no doubt found better opportunities as they are great.

Do you have constructive (or any) knowledge to add, or are you just out to offend as many people as possible?

There is another option, it is one that I suggested ages back but which the OP, and of people who apparently know a lot more about disability than I do (according to them), rejected out of hand....

I'm asking for a reasonable adjustment because catching public transport isn't a viable option due to my disability

If those last four words are the case, then the OP's condition has deteriorated since their last PIP assessment and they should ask for a review. That would be in their best interests with regard to their entire quality of life and not just getting to and from work.

All of this.

Plus speak to access for work, they may be able to help with funds

Or try turn2us to see what grants are available.

Traveling by public transport makes my disability much worse too so it is totally reasonable to feel the way you do.

When our employer moved just a few miles they paid people a fair amount extra for a few years to cover the possible additional costs. I think our union negotiated it.