Should I try shape my (potentially neurodiverse) children's behaviour?

[SpinningTops]

I'm not quite brave enough for AIBU so go easy on me.

Both of my children potentially have ADHD / autism. They're both on the huge waiting lists for assessment.

Their behaviour is really manic and frantic and I'm finding them difficult to manage. Alone they are better but together it's like they form a pack and no attempts at parenting penetrate.

They're kind hearted kids, nothing malicious about what they do but it all feels so chaotic. So I really want to try and shape their behaviour but also worry that this is just who they are and that I need to accept it. We have had some success in the past but it requires almost constant vigilance and effort which is exhausting.

So do I exhaust myself and probably end up burnt out from trying to make them into calmer, more socially acceptable humans, or do I embrace it and just pad their bedroom walls and let them bounce off them every waking moment?

What age?

I think there's a balance. They need to be able to authentically themselves but also need to be able to function in society as far as their ability allows them to.

My autistic, ADHD son was super wild. He still leans that way but we have tried to give him some outlets and also to teach him how to show calm behaviours.

I think there's a difference between teaching masking and teaching functional behaviours. I will admit, it's a fine line though

All parenting shapes children's behaviour surely, irrespective of additional needs you should still aim to help your children learn about the world and their role in it, interactions with others etc

One day they'll be having to make a living in the sometimes harsh world. They need to know how 'fit' in. I speak as someone in a family with many neurodiverse members. The ones who have learned how to do it are in good jobs, have friends, engage in life. The one who can't, has a rather less happy time.

8 and 6

Definitely.
Outlets, expectations, boundaries, scaffolding, like routine and structure.
It doesn’t mean pretending they’re NT. Both my ADHD were late diagnosed and happy they were brought up as they were.

Both have model behaviour at school, very much rule followers.

I think home is their outlet but it's so exhausting to be around.

I think you need to do both. I really do think it's important to consider it from the viewpoint of helping them to be as well prepared for life as an adult as possible, to allow them to function happily and get along well in all aspects of life.

That takes some work, unfortunately, and can be extremely exhausting. But will be worth it in the end.

what do you mean by ‘shape their behaviour’? If you’re referring to trying out ABA ‘therapy’ then I would strongly advise not to. I believe that taking a purely behavioural approach can be detrimental to an ND persons health and wellbeing. It’s basically forcing NT behaviour on someone too vulnerable to understand what’s happening to them. This ain’t to say you can’t encourage your children to be polite etc, this is more insidious. It’s basically like training a dog with treats. It’s saying ‘behave like I’m telling you to behave or else you won’t get a treat’. This doesn’t fundamentally change their desire to be who they are, instead it makes them suppress themselves to appease you.

What you could try is more holistic methods. I think you should embrace their active nature. Take them to places where they can have an appropriate outlet like the woods, swimming, the park, climbing etc.

In terms of methods you could try at home, Floortime is a far more individual friendly approach to therapy, as this encourages positive social interaction. Just google ‘Flootime therapy’. It is virtually free, it just takes up your time. Very ND friendly.

Biggest difference to a “normal childhood” I’d advise is go very low dopamine. Practically no screen time, definitely nothing like Bluey. Board games, crafting, and cassette tapes!

Yes, we're very low screen time because I don't think it helps long term. They don't have tablets and are allowed TV for an hour on weekend evenings.

But on the other hand it means they've almost invented their own world of chaos to fill their screen free life. It's great in summer as they play outside. Harder in these dark winter months.

Yes I would. You have a greater chance of successfully influencing their behaviour while they are younger - with the goal of helping them live happy lives with friends and jobs, positive functioning in society.

All parents shape their children and some need it more than others. Also to make an easier home life for you!

Your instincts will be good - follow them! And healthy advice as on this thread.

It's stuff like they can trash a room through chaotic play but find it utterly overwhelming to tidy it up.
But I think they need to learn that if they create the mess they tidy it up. But we have so many meltdowns.
We may remove toys so it's less overwhelming a task but then the sofa cushions are off etc.
it's like they need constant supervision to stop them going wild but I have other things I need to do e.g. cook dinner.

An example of a good way I might shape behaviour is to read to them during dinner, to keep them seating and help them zone out of the fidgeting and chatting that extends meal times to hours. But that's only possible if I eat at a separate time. Audiobooks do not work in the same way.

I feel I know what I need to do but don't have the time to fully commit to making it work. It's like it will only work whilst I'm present and actively working on it!

The general answer - yes.
Would you achieve your goal 100%? There is no guarantee.
Bear in mind you will need to use special strategies, stay patient and probably will start using medications at some point.

Totally agree. Model calm behaviour and don’t out up with crap. Consequences for bad, praise for good.

Well you can direct it in a positive way

• no jumping on the beds go and jump on a trampoline.
• No climbing up furniture but install climbing hand holds and monkey bars on the ceiling if you own your home.
• teaching different behaviour is necessary in different places is fine, you might have to be explicit for example modelling a whisper in the library as they may not pick up on behaviours intuitively, or practise going to the cinema / theatre at home so they know what to expect and when.
• being consistent, you can't allow some behaviours some times but then have a go at them when your patience has run out and you've had enough, either it's ok to do or it's not, and if it's not provide an acceptable outlet for that need in a different way

The meal time example isn't an appropriate method as you aren't teaching them good table manners and they won't always be read to and it's just a distraction technique so might as well watch a screen as they won't be engaging stomach and brain to identify when they are full.

A wobble cushion on the other hand and wipe clean conversation cards or a regular game of "Would you rather ..." Would be more appropriate and allow you to eat at the same time. If they need to get up you make a job for them "Simon could you go and refill my cup with water/ get the salt / get the yogurts from the fridge, thank you" giving Simon a chance to have a positive movement break.

I feel you. It can be so exhausting. The climbing up things, sofa cushions taken off to form an assault course, throwing things around. I’m far from expert, just another mum, but some I try to look at that behaviour and what it telling me. Instead of meeting thrown toys on the floor with ‘no! Stop it!’ For example, I’ve tried the Floortime method where you can do these things in a more controlled or safe way, so encouraging throwing but in an appropriate way, in the right context, like throwing a ball. What are they getting out of trashing a room? You could play with a toy with them in an orderly way, then make it messy and that shows them the process of order and disorder. Maybe I’m talking nonsense but I try to think of it as what will be satisfying but also teach my DC a concept they can apply to other things. Some days after work I’m knackered and don’t do much though so I’m only human can’t do therapy all the time!

They do both have wobble cushions.
We have tried taking games and those conversation prompts etc but it just means my eldest doesn't eat, it's all too distracting.

Have you changed the environment so it's less high arousal, bright lights off and using lamps or candles. Turning off washing machines / extractor fans etc so it's not loud. Serving up less so it's not so overwhelming but they can go and get more if they want

That's part of how they are already trying to cope with a world not set up for them. They are masking all day at school and unmasking at home. You can't expect much more from them.

Kids like this need consistency and boundaries. Set some boundaries and stick to it. I also have a strategy of saying yes to things where I can so that when I say no, they know I mean it.

We all have our own limits of what's acceptable to us in terms of behaviour so you need to find your own limits and implement those. Also "different houses have different rules" is very useful as a blanket answer when they say their friends are allowed this and that.

IF ADHD. Early am exercise and access to exercise. Mini trampoline, treadmill, exercise bike. Roller blades. Best is swimming.
Breakfast and 45 minutes of exercise,
My trio did competitive sports with early am practice 3x per week plus afterschool. Grandson likes the peleton! Logs on and goes
Divide and conquer.
no ASD experience

I think there’s a compromise to be had. Daily exercise and daily park visits along with various strategies - visual lists to tick off, Alexa alarms to cement timings and routines, rewards, attention and warmth,

Hmmmmmmm I’m on the fence on this one. I have two with ASD. They are extremely well behaved in the world and at home too but we do set up home to help them release the pent up out in the world energy particularly when they are/were young. My younger one sofa crashed, trampolined, spun, twirled for all of the early years. The other is was all sensory play slime, painting and drawing on walls, make up/creams on toys and over every surface. They do and did have chores though so they are functional at home too.

One of mine is an adult now and that one has filled the extreme dopamine chasing with an adult extreme sport while every other aspect of their life is extremely functional too. Job, uni, friends etc. I think letting home be a bit more chaotic worked all in all.