Why are (some) people so against WFH?

[thistimenextyearwellbemillionaires]

I see so many threads on here about why people shouldn't be able to WFH and I don't really understand why people would be against it

For most people it seems make sense with their home life & financially as saving on commuting costs. When my children were young I was 5 days in the office and had to rush back from town to collect them and it was so stressful, it must be great for people not to have to do that now.

I know some people might take the piss a bit, but this happened when people were in the office full time too, there would always be someone always in late, leaving early etc.

I am lucky that my company is hybrid and no plans to change that. I've been offered another role recently which was a big pay rise but 5 days in the office and have decided to stay where I am. Where I work, whether you're in the office or at home you're expected to produce the same work and results and if you don't you'd be out so they're no slouch in terms of expectations of their employees.

Interested to know people's honest opinions.

Many people on mn can't see past their own experiences or projections - eg if their own particular role would be harder to do at home they can't see how anyone could do a decent job at home.

What works and what doesn't, and who will be taking the piss and who will be on Teams meetings each day will vary greatly.

Personally I go into the office 1-2 days a week and wfh the rest. In the office, if my team is in, I find it easier to chat casually about any questions I have, where at home it's easier to put my head down and concentrate.

Worst thing is going into the office then having remote meetings anyway.

I'm not sure - I think it's probably some combination of being a 🦖, wishing they could WFH, companies struggling with the idea of control, and narratives in the media.

Totally agree with your point about some people slacking wherever they are.

I honestly think the people who are so vocal in their anti other people working from home are usually jealous their job isn’t comparable with it.
They like to feel righteous and it makes them feel better to label everyone else who does wfh as workshy and lazy.
Some people can’t bear the thought they someone else might have a better deal than them.

I hate WFH and while I don’t begrudge anyone else WFH it does worry me that it will eventually become totally the norm as I don’t ever want to do it. I am really glad to be working in a fully onsite job but many in my field have gone hybrid / WFH. I know it was hard dashing back for school/nursery runs etc but that is such a short part of your working life unless you have DCS with big age gaps.

I don’t go around saying no one should WFH or calling anyone lazy for doing so though, I accept that it’s a great option for many. Just not me.

Many ppl can't work from home eg nurses but those that could potentially but whose work place doesn't allow it are probably jealous. I do both, not a choice, my company decided to cut space for employees so wfh. Personally I am not a fan only for the reason I like home to be home and it costs money to heat etc. My employer premises are very close to me, if I had an hour commute at each end of the day I would feel very different 🙃

A certain number of people who cannot WFH are insanely jealous of those who are able to. They want everyone up and out at 7 or 8 as they are.

I've wfh since 1995, plus a couple of years around 1990 so it's been interesting to see what happened due to lockdown and after.

Some people are down on wfh out of pure envy, I suspect.
Some are down on it because they can see some people are taking the piss.
Some are down on it because they don't understand the sorts of roles where it can work fine.

It suits some people in some roles, not others.

The main downside IME is social isolation.

I think hybrid is ok. The issue I have with full time WFH is training & collaboration. I started a new job earlier this year. The manager is full time WFH (moved away). We're all full time office.

I am struggling. I have a 30 minute zoom with them once a week, or I have to email or call. I was left at the mercy of an inexperienced & nasty staff member to train me. I need to be able to go chat, ask about something or discuss it, learn more, get support or even demonstrate my extra skills, which are being passed over, so can't progress. Instead I get emails when I'm already snowed under.

So full time WFH works for experienced staff, but it makes it hard to learn your job when you're a kinesthetic learner.

I'm not sure if it will become the norm - I've heard of a couple of companies moving back to a hybrid working pattern recently (and much to their staff's surprise).

I'd be happy enough to go into work one day per week if my workplace was nearby, but it's 145 miles away.

I remember seeing data about the WFH / hybrid / on site ratios, there were significant associations between these and degree of specialisation of role / salary etc.

Having teams together can bring about innovation. Youngsters need the guidance and training from older hands.
Business/town centres die without the daytime custom.

On the flip side you need smaller premises, some employees are better working at home.

But yes some people can take the piss and for some moving jobs it can be lonely, higher bills at home.

Each business will decide what they prefer for their employees, if you are asked to go back to the office or work there full time that's what you do.

As with everything works for some, doesn't work for others. It's currently a fairly new working experiment time will tell if it is overall advantageous overall or not.

After the pandemic I attempted to ring the DWP, on behalf of my disabled adult son, me on a landline my DD on her mobile. Some occasions it took 3 hours, I gave DS, name, address, NI number, told the woman it was a 10 year claim,3 times she asked me for these details I had already given her, she then said she was WFH and couldn't access everything. I have rung both Direct line and my bank,to hear children chatting, playing in the room, unprofessional! Thread on here recently asking what folk really get up to when working from home.

@MermaidMummy06, yes, that's a good point about training actually - I'm really happy to be able to work fully remotely at this stage of my career, but then I previously benefitted from years of in person training.

Like others on this thread, I feel hybrid is the way to go. It's up to us how often we come into the office and a fair number of us like to be in 1-2 days per week.

I recently recruited for my team and said for the first 3 months I expected them to be in 1-2 days per week, as much quicker to pick up things in person and meet other teams.

I changed job earlier this year and rejected roles that wanted you in 5 days a week as to me that feels like an inflexible old fashioned organisation.

I do get that it must be a bit galling if you have a role that means you can't benefit from it.

Interesting about the social isolation aspect, I hadn't really thought of that. Personally I love working from an empty house, I get so much done. I actually really enjoy my 2 days in the office but commuting an hour each way and then chatting with colleagues and lunch etc means they're my least productive.

I always think that it is a combination of:

• envy: they can't do their job from home so resent anyone being able to do have remote/hybrid job
• being a bad boss/manager who can only function if they get the ego boost of having everyone at their beck and call in an office
• lacking empathy and understanding of the fact that WFH can help people who are disabled/have long term health conditions or carers, single parents stay in employment
• being generally resistant to change.

If you go into the office you spend most of the time on video calls anyway so it's not just WFH it's the platform changes that can't be put back in the box anyway.

Also on my team we have a few younger analysts and they seem to really enjoy the hybrid model too.

I'm self employed so have no personal experience of this, but my view is if you're working for a private company then it's completely up to them. If they are happy with your ability to perform your roll sat in your spare bedroom with the cat on your knee then great. If you're in the public sector being paid from everyone else's taxes then you should be in the office.

I think it's jealousy, and a warped understanding of what people who WFH 'actually do'.

The same way as on MN you can never be a high earner, use childcare for a minute more than you have to, or have anything more than the bare minimum. Always people arguing against it instead of realising these things are often the results of life choices. My last change of job was based on the fact I wanted a flexible, WFH job - and so I applied for flexible, WFH jobs (after 10 years of working my ass off and strategic job hopping).

I think it’s a combination of lack of imagination of how efficient you can be WFH and often companies with poor plans for remote workers. I’ve been home based since before the pandemic but it needs to be managed. Some if the remote teams I have been in have had the best collaboration and communication ever but the difference is the use of team tools, coworking, brainstorming sessions and not falling into the trap of meetings for the sake of it and instead doing meetings where your input is valued. A strong internal comms plan and company updates and messages make a huge difference.

I find it easier to chat casually about any questions I have, where at home it's easier to put my head down and concentrate.

Same here @DanceMoveGrooveAndShoutIt

@thistimenextyearwellbemillionaires There are several threads on MN from posters who boast about taking the puss when they WFH. This is why many employers are asking staff to return to the office.

I think people don't like it for a few reasons.

They don't like their spouse doing it because they get in their way.

They don't like it because they can't do it.

They don't like it because they feel a lack of control (managers)

They don't like it because they think it's a reason for poor customer service (that's down to lack of staff, not where the staff's bottoms are located when they eventually take your call).

I do like it because

I can get more exercise, more time in bed and save money on travel.

I think it's far harder for youngsters starting in work.
I remember DD commenting that it was the little things that of a colleague was next to her, she'd just ask a quick question. At home she had to phone or email which felt far more formal and sometimes overkill for a small thing.
I've been really proud of her that when they've had a new starter she's offered to go in for the first fortnight with them to help. She's not particularly sociable and far prefers at home, so she's doing it entirely as she sees a need.

I also see dh. If he didn't go to church, then he would have week after week where he sees no one except family or on team calls.
I also see that it's really easy to eat into home life. Dh got a text asking him to recheck something a couple of nights ago and he was working on it after I'd gone to bed. Couldn't have done that in the office. Yes he could have said no. Yes he can take time in lieu. But it puts that pressure on.

I don't WFH. But I don't think I want to. I like going out and coming back. I also know I would be faffing about at home. I'd just put the washing on. I've got two minutes to spray the sinks. Now I must just put this away... I'd get far less done without realising.

So whereas I can see it's easier, I can also see downsides both for workers and the firm.

I agree @Delorian, and I've heard staff who have been mandated to be back in the office for one day per week elsewhere say how pointless it feels, when they just sitting on Teams meetings anyway.

I'd love to see more discussion around how remote working can be made to work as well as possible, and to replicate some of the advantages of in person working etc.