Catholic primary school as a non-religious family?

[Pumpkinseason3]

Hoping there may be some families out there who have experience and may be able to give me a “real life” perspective.

The time has almost come to fill in DSs primary school application. We have the choice of 2 in our town - one catholic school and one non-denominational school. Both very similar in terms of inspection reports and performance etc. Non-d school is quite large - a few classes per year group (P1a, P1b etc) while catholic school is quite small (composite classes for most year groups).

I had assumed we would always send our DS to the non-d school as neither DH or I practice any religion. However, DS is quite a timid and shy child and definitely thrives more in a smaller setting and I’m now considering whether the smaller class sizes at the catholic school may be better for him. He has a winter birthday so will also be young for his year (unless we defer, which is a whole other topic 😅)

I have made appointments to see both schools and meet with the staff, and with his early years leaders to get their input but these aren’t for a few weeks so trying to gather what info I can beforehand.

I guess my questions really are - in terms of day to day school routine, how heavily does religion feature? If you are a non-religious family and your child attends a religious school, is there much that they are left out of? I believe for things like Communion and Confirmation DS would still go along to support his peers but wouldn’t actually participate. Is there a lot of the religious aspects expected of you as a family? I’m more than happy to get stuck in to all aspects of school life and for DS to learn all about religion etc - I’d just like him to be able to make his own choice about practicing religion when he’s older.

I’m struggling to see what’s best for him at the moment and it’s making me flap 😩 I know that a smaller class would likely benefit him but then being left out of things may make him more shy and quiet than he already is. Are there any other factors I should be considering? Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

I wouldn’t assume a small class and school is always better for a shy child. It can mean 7 years of being stuck with a class mate you don’t like and less people to make friends with. Harder to find their tribe.

My kids don’t go to a religious school but I used to look after some who did a while back. Religion was a big part of the school. Even their reading records had bible phrases in!

I’m Catholic (fairly lapsed) and I think religion will feature quite heavily in classes. Prayers, sacraments, feast days, visits from priests.

but that said, it’s all quite mild and if you don’t mind that it would have a nurturing ethos.

I think go to both schools with an open mind. I think the bigger school might have more funding, a wider curriculum and you son wouldn’t feel left out. Also more likely to get in.

I've had kids at a small Catholic school. There was a strong sense of community and very committed staff. Behaviour was excellent. And lots of singing which I loved. The hardest thing was the transition to a much tougher secondary.

As well as visiting there may be a Christmas fair or similar event coming up which could give you a feel for the school. You could ask about the percentage of non Catholic kids - it may be quite high.

My kids go to a mixed year group Catholic Primary. We are not Catholic or religious at all. It’s fine, it’s a lovely school and my kids like it there. They do study religion and go to church occasionally but it’s not in your face all the time or anything. Behaviour in the school is generally good, values are taught well and great pastoral care. I’d just visit the schools and apply for the one you like best forgetting whether it has a religion in its name or not.

We're a mixed faith family (one parent practising, one very much atheist) and sent DC to a faith school.

Some faith schools are VERY religious. Some are pretty light touch - RE lessons, prayers in assembly, harvest festival, but actually nothing really different to what was normal state school in the 80s and 90s.

One reason I wanted DC in the faith school was that the secular school is also compelled by law to have "an act of daily worship" every day, but it's led by someone who has absolutely no clue about any of it. At some stage DC will be led not by my beliefs or those of my partner but by their own, and they deserve to have a proper understanding of what religious people believe before either accepting or rejecting it.

Our school is on the VERY religious side of religious and it has been a godsend (hah) for DC who turns out to have a panoply of SEN. They are actively inclusive, beyond what is required, with the focus being on every child is made in the image of God - so if your child cannot sit still and is leaping about whooping, then God is also leaping about whooping, and they approach it from that perspective.

Our school has not been bothered about one of us being involved in a church and one not. There are plenty of children who are from other faiths or not practising (lots who tell the reception teacher they only went to church because their parents wanted to get into the school!) and they are not excluded from anything.

But really the only way to find out is to go and visit the school and get a feel for it.

Don't send your child to a Catholic school if they are not Catholic - they will be expected to believe and pray and religion will influence everything they do.

Small schools can seem lovely and friendly but they can also be insular and claustrophobic- if there are only a few other boys in his year and your child doesn't get along with them it can be very hard socially. It also means the jump to secondary school can be even harder.

Catholic schools can be great for non religious children. There are obviously some elements of religion, but most will be accommodating and offer non religious children to sit out or have small alternative rolls if they still want to have some participation. It will depend on the school itself though so it may be worth speaking to other parents in the area to get their experience of the specific school.

DD's went to a Catholic and we are not religious. They are not baptised. There was a lot of religious activity but on the mild side. They went to all the occasions, fests, masses etc, but obviously didn't take part in communion or confession.

The school had a lovely family ethos, good behaviour, and was very inclusive.

Neither has turned to religion as a result. Fear not, they make up their own minds

Dh and I were both raised Catholic but are lapsed (atheists really) and have strong feelings about the church’s history of abuse, so we didn’t have our daughter christened or anything. There’s very little choice in schools where we live. She didn’t get into the non religious school so we had to send her to one of the catholic ones. We thought it wouldn’t be so bad these days but honestly we are now quite concerned because they pray every day, there’s religious icons all over the school including massive statues at every entrance and crucifixes on every classroom wall. She has come home asking about god, heaven, Jesus and asking can we please go to mass …She’s only been going a couple of months. The religion text book comes home every week for homework, it instructs us to pray together as a family so it’s very hard to just do it in a lip service kind of way which is what I was hoping to do. No chance, there’s a section coming up that asks for a photo or drawing of the child at their christening and for a photo or drawing of someone who has died so they can say prayers for them in heaven. I’m going to have to tell her teacher she hasn’t been christened and won’t be making her communion/ confirmation and unfortunately I can imagine she is going to be very left out. Hopefully there will be a few others who aren’t catholic so it’s not just her. So honestly, yes it is a problem for us and if I had a choice I would not choose a catholic school if you don’t want your child to get religious instruction.

Have you checked whether there is even an outside chance you would get a place at the Catholic school? At my kids Catholic school you have to be baptised and also it can't have been done in the year leading up to reception applications to avoid those trying to gain a place cheekily

There is a working church next door to my kids school so religion features very heavily - kids all attend mass in the church weekly during school hours and there are also Saturday family masses they often have to attend for their year groups. I don't know a single child who didn't do holy communion or confirmation. The school is significantly more religious than my nephews school in another city - also Catholic but on a scale of 1-10 of how religious they'd be at maybe 2 whereas my children's school is 9 or 10. There are religious statues throughout the school, walls are all covered in religious sayings and pictures. It's inspected by a Catholic Bishop who gives it an OFSTED style rating. The school takes it very very seriously.

I really don't agree with this. There is absolutely no pressure to believe! Yes, there are prayers but everything they do is not influenced by religion as you have said. I would love to know how much information you actually have about the curriculum in Catholic schools. The ethos is very much about being inclusive to all, regardless of faith.

My non catholic children go to a catholic primary. It's a great school and they are doing well there. They pray in the morning and evening before home and have a mass every few months. They get taught about bible stories (my kid knows them better than most of the other kids anyway so no issues there). It's mostly fine. There was one time when my dd came home and said another kid told her she wasn't a Christian because she wasn't baptised but she wasn't too bothered by it other than that no issues with it and they do not teach trans ideology there which was my main reason for sending them. If you think your child will do well there don't rule it out just because it's catholic!

I have taught in C of E, Catholic and non religious schools. At the Catholic school I taught at, over 50% of the school pupils were not Catholic as it was in a very multicultural area. However, religion featured very heavily and children attended Mass, prayed numerous times a day, and celebrated all the key Catholic significant dates throughout the year. They had to do more religious lessons compared to non Catholic schools. They also studied other religions too, so not completely in a bubble. I am not Catholic but it was such a lovely school due to its caring ethos, with polite caring children who were also encouraged to think of others, and a strong sense of community and family.

My DS went to a Catholic primary although we are C of E. Non-Catholics were admitted up to 5% of each year and had to be baptised in a Christian church of any denomination. There were religious lessons but not "fear of God " type. They went to church for certain occasions. When it came to first holy communion, it was up to the parents to say if they wanted the child to participate. We were happy for DS to take communion but we had to have a chat to the parish priest, who was happy for him to take part. There were 2 children who didn't take first communion but they still went to the service and the party afterwards. Nobody was left out.
He went to a Catholic senior school too and we were very happy with both schools.
One of the primary teachers was a nun, she did pastoral care as well as being a class teacher and she was a lovely, kind lady. She just wore normal clothes too. It was very different from when friends of mine went to Catholic schools many years ago.

Thank you all, your replies are really helpful 😊 I’m absolutely open to the idea of both schools and will be visiting them both to see about those schools specifically 😊

To answer a few questions -

• Yes, there’s definitely a chance he would get in to the catholic school. I didn’t realise this was an option, and thought you had to be baptised to go, hence me now feeling unprepared to make a decision 😅
• Absolutely no issue with DS learning about religion. My personal preference would be for him to be taught about various faiths and for him to be able to make up his mind when he’s older. I believe this religious school to be on the milder end of things but could be wrong!
• The schools are part of the same school campus (along with secondary) and have some shared facilities so whatever school he goes to, DS will be able to mix with children from the other school too.
• Both schools are very inclusive and have their Rights Respecting Schools gold awards.

Hopefully visits to both will make the decision easier.

I hate composite classes. I also would never, ever expose my child to a Catholic education. You ate not Catholic, run away now.

In England at least winter birthday does not make them young for their year, you can only defer with a birthday between April and September. Some schools are more supportive of this than others.

Please don't inflict Catholic school on your child if you are not Catholic. My mother was, so we were raised in it too. It runs deep and leaves you scarred.

@Timetoread We’re in Scotland 😊 School intake is 1st March to end Feb. Anyone turning 5 after start of term in August until end Feb is allowed to defer to the following year.

My child goes to a small catholic primary. Class sizes are no different to any other school and he currently has 32 in his class. We are not Catholic and I doubt many in the school actually are. There are good sides and bad sides.

Smaller school with lots of SEN and not as much support/finanaces compared to larger schools. At times this can be very disruptive in class and can takes ages to get any support if child does have SEN. His school shares one SEN teacher between two other schools and his.

My son enjoys being in a smaller school he is friends with children of all different ages and well known at school. He knows all the teachers and feels safe.

He doesn’t enjoy the Catholic side to the school and instead told me her prefers ‘science’. However, he is very understanding and respectful of peoples beliefs from attending this school. He has chosen not to attend a faith secondary school as he feels he has had enough of religion.

They attend worship daily but in relation to stuff at the local church, communion etc that’s a choice for parents to make. I would say more choose not to than choose to engage.

Thanks, I didn't know there were different intake dates in Scotland! Good luck with your decision. My child attends a CofE school and they do talk quite a lot about Jesus. I am not too bothered as I think Christian values are good but sometimes find children take the bible story literally and come up with some funny ideas. I can imagine Catholic schools also feature religion quite heavily but it probably varies depending on the school. At the end of the day it is not the only factor. But of course they may come home telling you they want to be baptised!

My wider family sent their kids to catholic schools. The schools are lovely, inclusive, strong sense of community. The kids do first communion in year 5. I don’t know how much else was religious. It seemed like a normal school to me. They learned about other religions as it was a very diverse school.

For me, I didn’t want any catholic influence as I agree that it can run deep annd be hard to shake off. But maybe that’s worse if either of your parents are religious.

Mainly though, I would not like small composite classes. I have a shy child - we have had no problems with a bigger school except that he has struggled initially with changing teachers each year and any class changes. I am glad he has had the opportunity to get used to that sort of thing at primary and definitely feel that having attended a larger school will help him with secondary school transition.

Our school experience was as follows. We returned from living in the US and DC went to a private school with a religious name that wasn’t religious at all apart from Christmas and Easter. Classes were small and I would echo that this seemed appealing with a big change geographically as well as starting school. However, it was only when we switched DC to the local primary that we realised he was happier with more people to interact with.

The primary we switched to was a CofE primary with a wide local catchment. Not a huge school, it was a one and a half year cohort. The religious aspects were a greater part of school life than my own CofE primary had been as a child, but the school was very inclusive and - as with the local church it’s attached to - made string links with the local Muslim community. Very much an in catchment, local community feel. A true breath of fresh air after the private school.

After the primary there was a choice of 4 local secondaries. 2 in the same academy federation - the weaker of the two being the main catchment school. One out of catchment academy that’s huge but popular. One joint Catholic/CofE secondary in catchment. Our DC went to the faith school. It’s a fabulous school, very inclusive with most of the SEN and looked after children placing it as their preference. Extremely nurturing. As non SEN, the admissions process included a form that parish priest had to sign. I’ve certainly known kids that didn’t get a place based on Church attendance.

Anyway, this is how it worked for us. I hope there’s something helpful in relaying it

Scottish Catholic primaries are pretty full on with religion.

Prayer 4 times a day. Lots of religious instruction. Religion is fully immersed through all aspects of the curriculum

For communion, confirmation and confession there are weeks and weeks of instruction. Plus saint says, assembles, visits by the priest.

There are very few non catholics at my kids school and those who are mainly from overseas and part of quite conservative Christian denominations

Goodness a photo of someone who has died! That’s a bit much