They don't want us to have a choice over death do they?

[Hunnymonster1]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2lyl8jrvlo.amp

This is so bloody annoying why are we so backward compared to other countries? Other countries have this sorted like america.In some states, belgium, holland, Switzerland.
They are not gonna allow this to happen are they? Which means the rich will go and pay dignitas and the poor will suffer. I am starting to get so annoyed by the mps of this country
Am I being unreasonable into thinking that they are backwards and should have given maybe the British public a referendum on a subject matter so important to individual people. If not a ref why is our country so backwards

Are you for or against?! Can't tell from what you've written.

I'm for this but with strong safeguards in place.

All the countries that introduced that started with safeguarding in place.
And then they all relaxed them more and more.

Thinking that having safeguard in place is enough is naive.
Esp when you read what organisations pushing fir AD want to acheive.

And it’s not just for end of life patients already.

The abuse of this in Canada makes me frightened.

I would like the choice over my body and life. I’m completely uninterested in religion, MPs or what others think.

Just give me my own choices.🥴

I would fully support it if:

It was only an available option for terminally ill people, with a prognosis of less than 12 months to live.

It was signed off by at least two different doctors.

Having had a terminally ill family member beg to be taken outside and shot I think it is disgusting the way we force suffering upon people that we wouldn't force if they were a dog.

I do think there should be a referendum.

The current system is forcing terminally ill people to travel to Switzerland if they are able to afford it, months earlier than they would otherwise choose to go because they're worried they'll leave it too late to make the journey and terrified that their loved ones may be prosecuted on their return to the UK. If you cannot afford or are too ill to travel to Dignitas then you're left to suffer. So I don't think it's working currently either.

This is a very personal subject for me, as my Dad died of liver cancer last year. Because his liver failed, his body wasn't able to metabolise the drugs given by an incredibly good palliative team and his last month of life was lived in utter agony. I still have nightmares hearing him shout and trying to get out of bed in his last days. Even with a great palliative care team, hospice care of gold standard - my Dad died with no dignity and in huge pain. Yet if my dog was diagnosed with liver cancer, I'd take him to the vet and the decision would be mine as to when the time was right.

I get very angry when people who haven't seen a loved one die voice their opinions - until you've sat there and watched someone die a bad death, I don't believe your opinion is remotely relevant in this. It's not about disabled people or reducing population and that argument really really pisses me off. Sorry if that offends anyone.

@Borka

We will have families who encourage their parents to die young so they can get the inheritance

Sone are motivated by love but many are not

If it's a daft idea , so is allowing people to end their lives to benefit others - how so we prevent that? How do we ensure that people have the choice of a pain free death? How do we ensure that we are not making this an option for cost reasons - all the abuses over the world show how people are manipulated into the cheaper options

In theory I believe people should have a choice but I very much fear the reality. I'm concerned mainly about coercion and it becoming the only socially acceptable choice. I'm also scared of the perimeters widening. I really do find it a frightening prospect

I agree with this. I appreciate that in an ideal world, where nobody bad existed, this would of course be an option everyone should have. However that isn’t the world we live in, and the thought of it being an option that people could be pressured into is terrifying.

Hospice care is significantly underfunded in this country.
Hospice make more money from their shops than is payed to them by the NHS.

Death and dying with dignity is not properly thought about, discussed, planned for by the vast majority of people in the country.

If you think that passing this bill is going to solve any of these issues or give people the best death in the vast majority of cases you might want to look at what Hospice UK has to say.

www.hospiceuk.org/latest-from-hospice-uk/statement-health-social-care-committee-report-assisted-dying-assisted-suicide

I think he is absolutely entitled to his view and I think it is right there is a free vote.

I am on the fence, tbh. I want the power to choose when to die personally, but at the same time I am concerned about possible misuse/coercion. We live in a very disablist society.

I think maybe we need to look at improving end of life care.

That's exactly how I feel.

I really want to support this choice wholeheartedly. I also really want this choice for myself.

But then I see how badly things are handled in the SEN system, social care, universal credit etc..I just can't see that I'd want the people responsible for all that to be responsible for whether assisted dying is appropriate. Yet they would be the safeguard.

I also think coercion and social pressure could become an issue as you say. And the sentiment that why should x service be provided, it was your choice to live..

I wonder what will happen to those of us without children? Would somone just decide for us?

It's not just Wes, Shabana Mahmood has also said she won't vote for it because it goes against her religious Muslim principles.

It's interesting isn't it that MPs can pull this stuff when it suits, the rest of the time they are required to vote as whipped. I don't feel it's right that individuals with such strong religious beliefs are allowed to influence like this. Imagine if parliament was full of such people? What laws would be blocked or past? It should what's right for our country someone's religious beliefs.

I really don't understand the argument that everyone needs to suffer a slow lingering painful and undignified death 'just in case' some of the reasons for voting against might happen. Why can't we put safeguards in place to prevent the worst fears occurring?
We don't say allowing 17 year olds to drive is bad because what next? They'll be driving at 12?!! Or alcohol being legal means everyone will die of alcoholism! We don't ban windows from opening in case people fall or jump out.

In the same way we could permit controlled and gentle goodbyes rather than suffering we wouldn't inflict on an animal.

Exactly, I’m already finding it hard that my right side is not as co ordinated as my left and my right foot playing up, with Parkinson’s, 62, 7 years in.
A nursing home will not be my choice, 3 bouts of progressive stuff in 2024 😡, no idea what next, no real treatments, no remission either

“Sort out end of life care. Stop leaving that work to charities and start taking it seriously Invest in healthcare, and social care And THEN, we might want to talk about it.”

This. It’s ridiculous that hospice care is delivered by charities. Why are such vital services for the well-being of some of the sickest people not paid for by taxation?

I don't want it, I think its a slippery slope in eugenics and its the most vulnerable that will end up being killed off for the ease of others who don't wish to care or who think the cost to society of care is too high.

My mam was young and a fighter but Drs talked about her like she was a suffering burden who would be better off dead.

Lots of talk of 'frailty' (hilarious she beat their odds for over 30 years and was the strongest person I ever met) and talking about how I should prepare to make hard but necessary decision and to think of her 'quality of life' all said by people who had spent exact 3 minutes in a bloody room with her.

At one point Drs put an unauthorized DNR on her and she had to open a PALS case and have it removed (she was fully mentally capable and had told them no). If it wasn't for her finding it in her notes (she was extremely sharp and read though/kept track of everything) it would have been left there. She phoned me in tears that they did that behind her back. Its already a shit show as is without legalizing their right to choose who dies.

Also people who 'suffer' the most are usually people with mental health issues, suicide is already illegal not because you can stop people doing it but because as a society we can not be allowed to accept people just killing themselves as a standard and become blase to stopping it or helping.

@ComingBackHome do you have links to these please? I am very on the fence about this, so would like to read up on these cases. TIA.

I don't want end of life care. I want to choose to die before I'm being filled with opioids and staring at the ceiling 24/7

We cannot permit this to go through unless there is also an effort to sort out proper palliative care services and social care. This cannot be seen as an option instead of good end of life treatment and social support. Otherwise we risk a slippery slope as these services have been underfunded for years, leaving people feeling as if there is no choice but to opt for AD

This is my fear ... and it would happen further down the line once people got used to the idea.

There are many reasons to call this country backward, but this isn’t one of them.

Do you realise that this is a massively controversial issue that has two sides to it? Yours is not the only valid opinion.

I would like to see protections such as "you cannot pass inheritance onto anyone of you choose this option"

So, who gets the money? The government? Allowing them to take yet another choice from people?

It's such a divisive thing and it should be up to individuals. Government are only interested in what they gain, in all aspects. They can't be trusted to do what is right for the people they're supposed to represent.

I don't know what the answer is but the care isn't there, not any long and not across the board. The government has no right to comment then.

What? Why no inheritance? I know you mean so people aren't pressured into dying to save money but your blanket ban idea seems extreme