Girl with suspected ASD (Aspergers type), how can we help

[Volare123]

Hi all,

It's becoming clearer that DD, almost 7 yo, has ASD (the Aspergers type). She didn't have any speech delay, no communication issues, no social issues until around age 5 - 6. Now at almost 7 she's struggling to make friends, particularly at school. I think some of the girls in her class do like her and tried to be friends but somehow DD is always alone, left out. She's clumsy socially and I think young for her age. She's feeling like she is different and doesn't understand what's wrong with her. Hence, from a super happy, confident, chatty and bubbly girl she's becoming more and more sad and withdrawn.

When she goes to playgrounds she always find children to play with (briefly) and she does crave social interactions.

She's only got one friend left now whom we meet once every 2 weeks as she lives about 15 miles away and only comes to her granny every 2 weeks. She's missing her all the time as she has no one else. She used to have loads of friends when she was 4 but some ended being horrible to her (hence we stopped meeting them).

I have no idea how to help her make new friends as her struggles have taken us all by surprise.

Can anyone relate to this? Is there any support available? I've put her on a waiting list for Brownies and I've searched local support groups online but couldn't find anything that would fit DD.

you can ask for another assessment

I totally agree, some children don't like her because of some specific behaviours not because of 'autism'.

She's not bossy at all, in fact she's a follower, happy to join in other people's games. She has a attracted lots of bossy children in the past because of this.

She doesn't like arguing. When there is a group play going on, lots of different girls start arguing about rules, she hates that and leaves.

She does talk about specific interests quite a bit. We've been telling her that maybe she should not share everything at school so I don't know if she still does it. I know that would bore quite a few kids.

Does she have sensory issues ( more than just not liking loud noises), issues with changing plans/transitions? Repetitive behaviours? Special interests?

You are describing social and communication issues but those alone don’t point to autism
as a diagnosis.

Does she have meltdowns at home?

Perhaps one tip you could give her is to not pay attention to the 'popular' group of children, who are usually loud and confident, and often prettiest (these are the ones who attract her but they won't treat her well), but instead she could look around the class and see who else is quiet and lonely and left out. She could ask them to play?

I'm a bit late to this thread but a couple of practical tips are

If you organise a play date make it structured. So invite a friend from school to do something very specific. It might bridge any awkwardness on each side or encourage someone who wasn't sure about playing but would happily go swimming.

The other is a feature of autism is disordered/delayed development, so your daughter might well have been advanced at 4 buy wanting to play in a slightly younger way at 7. So people might like her but just be out of that type of play. If you join a group like brownies which has mixed ages, she might gravitate to a couple of slighlty younger children and get along just fine.

Finally, a lot if autistic children do get on with other neurodiverse children. In my area there is a girls with autism group called Apeer. You might find something similar near you.

Lots of good info and advice on this thread. My only advice would be keep pushing for diagnoses now in primary school because it’s better to have needs identified earlier in case the secondary school transition becomes very difficult, and then an alternative, more suitable placement needs to be found.

Hello my DD2 Started to display autistic behaviours around 2-3 but with hindsight we didn't realise until around 7-8 it started to become much more apparent. Sadly, we were discouraged from looking for a diagnosis by the awful support person in her primary and she wasn't diagnosed until she was 15. She prefers ASC as it's a condition not a disorder.
We suspected she was high functioning and she isn't someways but not in others eg she's very sociable but has many learning needs and needs lots of support in some areas .

I would advise at your DDs age , as another poster suggested making sure that she has lots of different social arrangements and meet ups, try and get involved with different groups so that she has the opportunity to make more friends.
Local groups run by SEN , art groups, dance , anything that helps her express herself and where she gets the opportunity to have fun and make friends . Follow whatever her interests are and go with that .
But also down time is really
Important where she can do some quiet activities on her own or with your support or with one friend or invite from school.
My DD made friends easily but then would drop or be dropped . This went on till she was in about year 8 !

If you're looking to confirm or deny your thoughts - Look for autistic help in your local area and see if you can get any support from them and also are used National Autistic Society ( I think it's that ?!) whilst we were going through this is she isn't she stage . Be prepared for a struggle and get your hardhat on now as there is so much discrimination people who think it's bad parenting, people who think everybody is a little bit autistic .
Start the ball rolling now and be prepared to push !

She has been a chewer since the age of 2, doesn't do much now but will occasionally chew her top around the neck line, her sleeve or even her plats 😁.

We weren't aware she was struggling with noises as we've always been going to noisy big soft play, trampoline parks. The thing she hates the most is the school's big hall or when the kids in the class misbehave.

She never had any issues with clothes, shoes, seams, zips etc...I know a lot of girls who struggle with that.

No meltdowns. She probably had about 4, 5 meltdowns in her life, all happened just before she turned 2. But around the age of 5 she started having some emotional outbursts after school which I put down to stress and she lashed out at us several times, which was very out of character. She's stopped after a while.

She does occasionally obsess about things like a toy she loves, a TV programme etc..and talks about it all the time. Then she moves on quite quickly and finds something else.

Thank you very much to the lovely MN community for all the helpful advice.

Re the diagnosis, the NHS asked me what are you trying to achieve by getting her diagnosed?! 🤔 As she won't be getting any support anyway.

I'll be fighting for it in primary , absolutely. Another thing that I'm facing at the moment is that DH doesn't have any concerns about her and has 'no anxiety' about her social skills, so I'm on my own trying to get some answers. I do think he's ND, undiagnosed. I find lots of similarities between him and DD.

The thing is DD is one of those prettiest girls in the class. She's one of the tallest, althletic and has a striking appearance. Occasionally a mum would tell me that their DD wanted the same hair style as DD or same dress. Sometimes gets a compliment from some girls (usually older) about being so pretty or cute. But DD doesn't see herself that way at all. To be honest we don't talk about appearance at home at all as I don't want her to place too much importance on it.

There is one girl in her class who doesn't have any friends and I've encouraged DD to play with her. But DD says they don't really know what to play with each other as neither of them has 'good imagination' 😀. So she's not approached her again. I think she does like someone more boisterous and brighter, someone she can learn from (her own words).

I dont know if anyone else has mentioned this, but look up the broader autism phenotype (BAP). People can have autism traits that are not severe enough for a diagnosis and usually don't require support or just minimal support. Some children do go on to get an autism diagnosis, but many more don't.

No, I've not heard of this. I'll look up. Thank you.

What a nice, non aggressive way to explain it! Thank you

"When she was 4 she seemed a lot more mature and articulate than her peers, now I feel she's stuck in that age maturity wise."

I really recognise this OP. Going through the same with my now 7yo. Now finds friendships with younger children easier.

I've been hesitating over pursuing a diagnosis or waiting to see how things pan out as she's very young in school year too

When I was diagnosed I was told if would have been called Asperger's in the past. It no longer is thankfully as I do not wish to have a disorder named after a Nazi eugenicist. The functioning labels are also no longer used as they are unhelpful. For a long time they were used to deny help to the 'high-functioning' and autonomy to the 'low-functioning'. How well autistic people function changes so have a set functioning level is only ever partially correct on the day it is given so we don't use levels in the UK either.

If you need to categorise, high-masking is often used or low support needs but these are also fluid so it is better to preface it with 'currently'.

And it is not a condition it is a disorder. They are medical terms. A condition is an abnormal state of health that interferes with normal or regular feelings of wellbeing, a disorder is a disruption of the regular structure or function of the body. I'm not unwell or unhealthy, my brain has a different structure and functions differently to the norm.

Some of you have suggested meeting other ND kids. DD had 2 other friends (one with ASD , the other with suspected ASD/ADHD) and the experience was very negative. Both of them were incredibly bossy, very inflexible in their play and the playdates were very stressful for us. We stopped seeing one of them but carried on with the other one for a little longer. Last time we met her she was so aggressive in making DD what she wanted that she was shouting at DD: 'do as you are told or I'll stop being your friend'. Needless to say, we won't be meeting them again.

I feel DD is in a grey area where she can't quite fully relate to NT kids, but can't quite relate to other (perhaps more typical) ND children either.

With respect to ADHD symptoms in girls, my daughter reported spacing out / daydreaming at school, easily distracted. Social communication-wise, she was (is) very blunt, very literal, constantly interrupting. Monologuing and excessive talking. Lots of careless mistakes in her schoolwork. Often forgetful, poor at planning / remembering things. Doing well at school often masks it - my daughter won many academic awards. My daughter was diagnosed at age 11, in her last year at primary school. I wanted her to start high school with the diagnosis so her new school could scaffold her learning.

I agree with this.

OP, from your description I wouldn't say your daughter sounds autistic. (Two of my children and I are all autistic). The first assessment session would be a developmental history and in your first post you say you didn't notice anything that pointed to autism in her early years - as a neurodevelopmental condition signs of autism are there very early on, and this needs to be evident for a diagnosis. Both of my autistic children had very clear signs almost from birth.

I also think you could benefit from reading about the autistic spectrum, as you seem to mistakenly think it is linear with "not autistic" and "very low-functioning autistic" at the other. This isn't what the autistic spectrum is.

I don't really 'think' anything, I don't know much about autism, I totally agree. I've been reading on MN for the last couple of years looking for answers.

My DD's school have pointed at a few things and said they think she might have ASD. They haven't diagnosed her but had a few concerns. I can absolutely see she is different and she struggles socially. She tells me she feels like she's from a different planet. We took her to NHS twice, the private Ed psychologist. No one can give us any answers. I don't know where to turn to as I can see her declining socially and feeling very sad, from such a bubbly, happy, confident child. I find it heartbreaking.

If it's any comfort my DD has/is learning those subtle social skills. Some kids find this easy - others take longer. She's in her late teens but I think is emotionally where a lot of her peers were maybe 4 years ago.
Whether your DD is ND or NT I think fostering good self esteem and confidence for girls is really important.
Hence trying different social groups and clubs to find one where she feels like she fits. DD has loved Brownies and Guides, art clubs and boxing of all things.
Feeling good about herself and good at something/being liked and accepted is so valuable.
Talk to her a lot about how her day has been, read together and talk about the way the characters interact - I think it's really easy with children to assume they know stuff that they don't. With potentially autistic children I suspect this is even more so as many ND kids in mainstream education are often very bright and articulate.
I discovered that part of the reason my DD struggled to get to sleep was a fear of not waking up plus being very frightened by the actual sensation of 'falling' asleep. It had never occurred to me to explain to her what falling asleep felt like.
There really is a lot you can do to support her. But at primary school especially a lot of those life lessons are very hard - all of the children are learning how to interact, how to gain friends and influence and unfortunately also the power of exclusion and unkindness. There will be a few tears even for the most popular and happy children.

Thank you for your lovely message x

It does sound a bit like DD: the daydreaming, spacing out, easily distracted, monologues and excessive talking, being literal. Also outside school she's a bit hyper, very lively and likes physical stuff like climbing, jumping, monkey bars. The school were shocked though at the Ed Psych's suggestion of possible ADHD (even ADD) so there you go.

The Ed psychologist told us we should seek a diagnosis again when she's at least 8.5 yo as some of these things are also age related.

Trust me, ed psychs are not the ones to take heed of on this. Diagnosis can be made from age 2, reliably. If you get the right professionsls on the job.

Personally, i feel the earlier the diagnosis is made, the better. My DS, he's level 2 autism with borderline learning disability so he had full support from about 3yrs. Now 25, he is the happiest soul in supported employment because everything was geared to his needs.

By contrast, my DD2, she is cognitively able, had friends, managed perfectly well at primary school.

It all started to go wrong at high school. Lots of masking, did the parties, got the clothes, wore the make up. But she hated high school. We never knew how much until she took an overdose at 16yrs.

Fortunately, she is ok. Now out of school and much happier. When we look back to her early childhood, the signs were there. Easy with hindsight.

I understand at the moment your wanting to hold off assessment - but when you're ready, don't hold off because of an ed psych. Or school. You definitely need the multi disciplinary team headed up by a clinical psychologist. Ed psychs aren't even on the team.