What were your arrangements with ex (who has children EOW) when his new wife had her baby?

[Crunchymum]

Just looking for opinions as it's caused quite a divide of opinions within friendship group.

Friend has 3 DC (age 14 down to 8)
New baby was born 4 weeks ago and so far the kids have only met baby twice (for a few hours each time)
This weekend the older children will be missing 2nd contact weekend so now won't see dad properly for 6 weeks as he's not offering to make up next weekend although he's said he'll take kids for an afternoon this weekend.

Is this normal? I can see it from both sides to be honest.

FWIW friend who is mother of the 3 DC is very much "it is what it is" whereas another friend was adamant contact should have resumed 2 weeks ago.

Is it their dad who is choosing to do this? Nice way for him to show his (new) priorities then!

The other friend is probably just trying to stir the pot. If the Mum with the 3 kids is ok with it, then that’s fair enough. No point in being the predictable, screeching ex wife saying ‘my kids have been pushed aside for his new kid! Don’t be that woman.

Very bad parenting from the dad. I guess your friend is just resigned to the fact that there is nothing she can do. Really shit for the children though, can't make them feel good

I mean, it’s early days. Let them enjoy the newborn bubble and get themselves settled. As a mum your friend should be able to empathise with that, especially if new wife is a first time mum. She could be trying to establish breastfeeding, recovering from a difficult birth, all kinds of things. It’s not ex husband ditching his kids, it’s that he’s needed more elsewhere for the time being. If it goes on for a long time, fine, throw toys out of the pram, but until then it just is what it is.

The fact your friend has a 'it is what it is' attitude would suggest to me that she is used to this type of behaviour from her ex.

Personally I couldn't imagine not wanting to see my children for that long.

Men like this are so unattractive. I bet your friend is pleased he's an ex. If she had another baby, she wouldn't get a newborn bubble and chance to settle without he existing kids around would she?

What excuse does he give for failing to parent for 6 weeks? Every other weekend is already absolutely pathetic.
Only a failure of a parent would see their kids 25 days out of 365.

I think it's very poor on the part of the Dad and his wife. I've been the child in this situation and I realised very quickly that my DF had new priorities and I felt like an unwelcome guest forever after. These are the early days however, so maybe this DF will do better in the long run.

Your friends attitude would lead me to think that she has reached zen level of acceptance that she knows ex is a bit shit and cannot change him!

How are kids coping?

DP stuck to his usual schedule. He left early day DS was born to spend time with them, show pics etc. They went out and chose little outfits. They were able to visit at hospital the next day. The week after was half term so he had them for half the week.

I think it’s really important to prioritise older siblings so they don’t feel pushed out / replaced etc.

Why on earth would a woman have a baby with a man who only sees his existing 3 DC four days a month?

That's a pitiful amount of parenting time, he's clearly not that arsed about the relationship he has with his eldest kids, I feel really sorry for them ☹️

I just never understand how these men get laid, let alone get a woman to agree to have ANOTHER child with him 🤷‍♀️

He's a shit father and should definitely have spent more time with his eldest children by now.

I think the children are old enough to understand that the step mother wouldn't be up to hosting them for the weekend and that she needs the help and support of her baby's father, so he can't do weekend dad very easily.

The kids are having the same sort of experience kids have when a new baby arrives in a non-divorced family - parents tired and frazzled, nobody doing much hands-on parenting. My own memories of having baby plus older kids is heavy on freezer meals or meals dropped off by neighbours, lots of farming out of kids to neighbours or relatives. It's perfectly normal to prioritise care of the new mother.

The kids will get over it. I wouldn't make a fuss about them missing weekends at this time. The new mother might have had horrible birth or CS, baby might not be sleeping, and breastfeeding is never easy to begin with. It's also possible the new mother's mum and dad, sister, or good friend is sleeping in the spare bed/s where the older kids would normally sleep.

@buttonsB4

EOW is a very common contact level, and it involves a higher level of child support than someone doing 50/50, where there is none.

I would personally look askance at a man insisting on 50/50 to save on child support, and then palming off the children to his relatives.

Absolutely this but the Dad should be stepping up to make sure they do understand this and making as much effort as possible to see them. An afternoon doesn't really cut it though I could understand not doing overnights for a few weeks

Without knowing the whole picture it’s hard to say.

Did the mum have a straight forward pregnancy/ birth? She could be really needing the calm and quiet to recover or could possibly not be coping very well.

Also what are the reasons for them missing the recent weekends. Because dad told them not to come or because they didn’t fancy it?

I am a stepmum and really appreciated the ex keeping the kids with her giving us a "weekend off" when it should have been our weekend. It was also best for them as there was a lot of crying so not much sleep.

Agree.

I think women can be kind to other women. Though I hate that phrase. Maybe show a bit of wisdom and compassion is a better way to put it. After all, this woman is dealing with her own ex. She knows what's in store for the new wife.

The mother of the older children presumably had time to settle with her own first baby and get used to the lack of sleep, house being a tip, husband useful as a chocolate teapot. I would look a bit askance if they hadn't got their act together by baby number three though.

And yes, I would expect this man to get back to the normal routine by mid October.

It's not court ordered but EOW has been the informal arrangement for 5 years. There has been very little deviation to be fair.

Financial support is also done outside of CSA (he is self employed, has periods of no work so there is no money for kids nor is there any extra time having them)

Wife is good with the children but very boundaried with EOW (think refusing to change a weekend arrangement to cater for friend when her mum died and there was a memorial - friend ended up changing the memorial date)

Wife was also the OW.

And yes friend is totally and utterly resigned to the fact the dad is a useless piece of shit but has always tried to help maintain good relations.

Youngest child is pretty upset but the older 2 are seemingly unbothered.

Sorry realise the info is a bit if a drip feed.

I think the children are old enough to understand that the step mother wouldn't be up to hosting them for the weekend and that she needs the help and support of her baby's father, so he can't do weekend dad very easily

It’s not hosting. It’s supposed to be their other home. And I’m assuming he managed to support the OP’s friend when she had child 1, 2 and 3, when they would have been a lot younger and higher maintenance than they are now, so I’m not seeing why it would be so difficult for him to do it again, especially when the 14yr old isn’t even going to require much parenting.

I think he’s a shit dad. And his wife should have understood that if you start a family with someone who already has children, there isn’t an option to just put them in a cupboard for a month or two so you can have that blissful first baby feeling and pretend that your husband hasn’t already done this three times.

I think the children are old enough to understand that the step mother wouldn't be up to hosting them for the weekend and that she needs the help and support of her baby's father, so he can't do weekend dad very easily

Yes but how long is this going to go on for?

They missed the first contact 4 weeks ago as baby came. Fair enough it was an induction so had been agreed before hand (natural birth, relatively "easy" induction as they go and mum and baby were home within 24 hours).

They then missed 2nd contact two weeks ago, dad arranged this is advance with friend.

They are now missing 3rd contact this weekend, dad told friend two days ago that they won't be able to do this weekend (but "should be good for two weeks time"). Friend asked if they could have them next weekend, explained kids want to see dad and step-mum they do like her and baby and was told they can come for the afternoon this weekend and then "hopefully back to normal arrangements in two weeks"

Where does it end? Will they be less tired in two weeks time? Friend says language used makes her think there'll be another excuse in a few weeks.

Kids met baby the day after they came home and a few days after that. Nothing since.

I get it as I really struggled with my first DC but I didn't marry a man who already had children 😕

I think your last point is completely unfair. No one can prepare you for the shock of having a baby of your own. Not just the change to your lifestyle but the mental, emotional, physical (and purely hormonal!) shock. You might even think you’ll be better served with someone who has been through it before but it’s a huge thing for any woman to go through regardless and you have no idea about the state of her mental health either.
He’s still trying to see them as much as he feels they are able to right now. The kids like her. Give it a couple of weeks and go from there. It’s an otherwise amicable arrangement so no need to cock that up for the sake a couple of weeks.

It's a quaint nicety to say this is their other home. They sleep there four nights a month. Maybe it makes the dad feel better to call it their home? I'd say the children would call the place where they sleep the rest of the month their home, where they have the vast majority of their stuff, where their friends hang out, and in particular if their mother's house was the marital home, this is the place they call home and mean it.

The older children are not set aside, and anyone who believes that contact weekends constitutes parenting in any meaningful way is deluding herself or himself. It's a sop to a non residential parent and often incredibly disruptive to the children involved. That was certainly the experience of my own DCs. The mother of the older kids here is being very wise to let this man off the hook here.

LOL @ "that blissful first baby feeling".
Lucky you if that was your experience. I wouldn't call cracked and bleeding nipples, a backside that felt it had been hit by a train, surviving on virtually no sleep, healing stitches from an episiotomy or a CS, and possibly PND a blissful feeling.

Teenagers and older kids require a great deal of parenting, and if they don't, then what's the point of a parenting weekend? To put in meaningless time? To put the teenager to work amusing the younger siblings while dad is busy or trying to catch up on sleep?

Meanwhile, they could all be comfortably at home, hanging out with friends, not annoying anyone by making snacks in the kitchen or trying to be quiet because a fussy baby had finally fallen asleep.

Absolutely this !!

The mother of the older kids here is incredibly wise to show patience and understanding in this situation.

And she could suggest WhatsApp calls or FaceTime if the kids are really missing their dad. But I suspect the kids are all fine, and what they really want is the chance to hold the baby, which is not always something a new mother is comfortable with, even when it's her own mother holding the baby.

We had step DC as normal after our DC was born although it was actually their mum who stopped them coming as much; didn’t want us playing happy families apparently

Contact should continue as it always has as much as possible and definitely shouldn't be still be on hold a month later. Although I agree with PP that it sounds like your friend is used to dealing with her half-arsed ex and is resigned to the fact she will have to pick up the slack again, which is usually in the best interests of the DC so we do it.

I think that opinions on this usually come down to which side of the fence you have been on. In your friends case I wonder what will happen if the new wife has baby number 2, I assume that would be different (even though it's not) 🙄

There was no change at all to contact arrangements when my kids step sister arrived. I guess if she'd been born the day before his weekend they may have skipped one but she wasn't and nothing changed.