My teenage son is too right-wing

[outdamnedspots]

We talk a lot about crime and politics at home.

Ds 17 has picked up that a lot of crime is committed by immigrants and people who are not-white, and us getting far too right-wing for my taste. He sounds awful, really racist.

What can I say to him to combat his thoughts?

Yes, to be fair a lot of stuff they say is bollocks.
I probably more meant that you don’t shift opinion by humiliating them. If you genuinely want to try and get them to think about things, there’s a way of not making them get on the defensive immediately

Definitely.

It is important to deal with crime open handedly and fairly, and not allow a fear of being called racist prevent the proper investigation crime, as happened with the Rotherham Asian grooming gang.

In a way the facts aren’t as important as people’s perception, and people think they are being taken for idiots and lied to.

We are told that illegal migrants want to come here because they all speak English, then someone is excused community service for attacking a police officer became they don’t speak English!

This is not an isolated incident and is exactly the sort of thing that hardens anti immigrant feeling.

Yes this is a good approach. Because we are Irish I use this analogy a lot for context. These people are doing what our forefathers did, they are escaping poverty and famine etc. I try to discuss why we as a race did what we did, the influence of religion and culture, like why the hell great granny had 11 kids and never considered how to feed them or educate them! Why people in countries we went to thought we were of low intellect and lower class etc. The prisons in New York and Boston were full of Irish, (I read recently that in late 1800s almost 90% of female prisoners were Irish) because poverty breeds crime. I don't know if any of it goes in but I hope it opens his mind a bit more.

Some of his views: immigrants commit a disproportionate amount of crime. Not sure

There's too much immigration. True, we are vastly overpopulated and that as a fact is completely unrelated to ethnicity

Prisoners should not have their jail sentences cut to avoid overcrowding in prisons. People who commit crimes should serve their sentence? Is that ‘right wing’? Or what 99% of the public think?

Prisons should be a deterrent first and foremost, not a chance for rehabilitation. Rehabilitation rarely works, which isn’t opinion, it’s fact. It’s not a right wing view.

Rehabiliation of most prisoners, eg paedophiles, doesn't happen. Factually true.

He isn’t ’right wing’ from the above. Centrist probably, but these aren’t ultra right wing opinions (the first is either verifiable or not I have no idea - maybe look it up and disprove him outright if untrue).

You don’t have a god given right to make other people left wing (despite what you read on here). If you believe in freedom of thought/speech, democracy etc then you shouldn’t have an issue with your son’s opinions although you’re free to vigorously debate them. But acting like it’s a ‘problem’ that he has different views from you is shockingly entitled and controlling

Well I'm not sure about the stats on the first statement.

The rest seem reasonable mainstream views.

He's entitled to other political views to you.
However, I would try to work on the idea that what he sees on Tiktok is "true". This is just as much the case for children that might be receiving a very left wing stream of info on their phone, even if the share the same beliefs as me. SO working on source evaluation, how easy it is to get sucked into a particular form of thinking. Or work on broadening his horizons - reading ( a range of books) as well as watching tik tok. At the very least watching and reading sources that deliberately contradict his viewpoints. There are some good idea's around the old Greek idea's of rhetoric and debate, deliberately arguing your opponents viewpoint that might be more appealing than his mum saying "you're wrong".

At the very least get him to touch grass, maybe get a job if he doesn't have one and exposure to people in the real world.

I should have added He is entitled to different political views even if they are foolish. I suspect that you do have more experience of the world and politics than him. Probably a lot more. But he won't want to hear it from you even if he should.

But some of its technically true:
Prisoners should not have their jail sentences cut to avoid overcrowding in prisons.

But what else is the solution? Sure build more prisons but what would you do right now if there was nowhere for newly convicted prisoners to go because everywhere was full? I find asking questions (genuine questions) helps more than saying "you are wrong because". You might also find out he does have carefully considered views in some areas.

Another good one (but maybe not for your own son because they can be sensitive) is to point out that if a group that makes up 50% of the population, commits 95% of violence crime, how far should you go in treating them differently. At what point does it become collective punishment and no longer reasonable? I bet he has a different line on that when its a group he is part of.

It may also be helpful to point out the vast majority of people who commit violent or sexual crime are men, like him?

And, rightly so, the vast majority of stop and searches are carried out on males. The vast majority of prisoners are men. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make with this comment?

There aren’t actually many helpful responses to you ‘stopping the way he thinks’ on this thread. By that I mean counter arguments to his claims.

I’m thinking that maybe that should tell you something…maybe he’s got a point. And maybe you should listen to him?

Well of course people of colour can be racist too. That's no surprise. People are all the same.

God no. Typical lazy thinking from a teenager trying to work things out - let him do it himself. Meanwhile I'll get on with my woolly liberal life, happier and kinder.

@Combattingthemoaners - thank you. Really helpful post!