Dd deliberately failing at school

[frustrationahoy]

My youngest dd is in year 10 and just finished her end of year exams. She's a bright cookie and has consistently been on track for 7/8/9s olin her GCSEs. Parents evenings had always been the teachers singing her praises, her work ethic and her ability to work to the best of her ability. A joy to have in the classroom etc etc

However she seems to have given up. Her marks from these set of exams are sitting around the 4/5 point and she's managed to fail at least 2. Her response is that's she bored and what's the point? Her subjects are too easy and she can't be bothered. Apparently she told her chemistry teacher that she couldn't be bothered in the exam - she got a 3. She told another teacher that she was burnt out and done with school.

I've tried talking to her and all I get from her is "so what, it's my life and if I fuck it up then that's my problem" her choice apparently and nobody else's business.

She told me quite matter of factly that she was planning on not doing well in these exams so she can stick 2 fingers up at her teachers when she does well in the real things - that's all well and good but her school moves students around depending on how they have done and there's a real danger she will be dropped sets in maths and English and may even be dropped from triple science to double in September.

I can't seem to get through to her - any time I try to talk to her it's met with a shrug and a don't know.

This attitude has been going on for most of year 10 and getting progressively worse. I've tried talking to her, love bombing her, laying down the law, taking my lead from her but nothing is working and I'm at the stage I just want to give her a bloody good shake just to get a reaction!

I don't know where this is coming from, there's not been any changes in friendship groups, no boys on the scene - she goes to school and comes home again, does her sports after school and her part time job at the weekends.

Shes had several detentions already this year for not completing homework and again when asked she tells me she couldn't be bothered.

I'm at a loss of what to do,

This is really common in year 10. I'd back off, let her have a nice summer, and it will kick in from September. Most year 11s get a kick up the bum after the December mocks and really knuckle down.

@PoohBearsBelly Really? God I hope so 🙏

Honestly? She’s probably bored and probably will be able to pull it back for the real exams. I say this as a secondary science teacher of many years! If school try to put her down, you can object very strongly and they can’t actually do it if you insist they don’t.

Also, triple science teachers tend to be the specialists and the physics and chemistry teachers in particular can often be the worst and most boring science teachers. They have usually got phds in their subject or high degrees but completely fail to understand why teenagers don’t immediately get it. Ime anyway. 😬

This sounds very like one of my dds who also disengaged completely in Y10.

I could have written this word for word 18 months ago:

I've tried talking to her and all I get from her is "so what, it's my life and if I fuck it up then that's my problem" her choice apparently and nobody else's business.

She has just finished Y11 and now has a diagnosis of ASD.

With hindsight, there had been many signs when she was younger. The mask truly fell off at school in the second half of Y10.
With a lot of support, she completed her exams, but it has been really tough at times.

I would tell her in all honesty, that is absolutely fine. She needs to go and get a job, and workout how she is going to start paying for her life. Stop giving her any money, let her realise how expensive life is and maybe she will come up with an inventive way of survival without GCSEs. At her age I decided I was going to drop out of school. A summer a full-time cleaning And paying my way (food, towards utilities) at a hospital make me realise I wanted to do more of my life. I went back to school worked my bollocks off and went to a good uni.

College open days have opened some of DD2 peers eyes - though for some it's made it worse and gone from working to giving up as they won't get the grades needed - they've already sat some of the GCSE exams in Y10 ( not England).

Maybe she tired at end of term - she also has a p/t job and does sports - and she'll pick back up - but could be worth a few what next after Y11 conversations nearer September.

If she drops set in maths and English can she still sit the higher papers - my own DD would love to drop a set and get a much better teacher and in both set two of Maths and English most still sit higher papers but they don't move now in her school.

Let her suffer the consequences. Its school or work. Moonshiners above has the right answer.

You could tell her all half-decent jobs and employers and even many shit ones require GCSEs, so if she doesn’t bother now she’ll end up spending her adult life having to get them anyway if she doesn’t get them now. Unless she doesn’t want a half decent job. And that just living life costs money - lots of it. Then leave her to it? 🤷🏻‍♀️

OP DD already in Y10 has a weekend job - so presumably has access to own money and some idea of at least one work place.

There are two subject that are causing us headaches - and having met the teacher at p/t meeting can fully see why. We've also had some unpleasantness from her friendship group during actual GCSE exams as she was revising hard.

We've had to point out a lot it matter not one jot long term to the teachers or school how she does - she need to do well for her own future - TBH DS middle child been very helpful with that message as well as has seeing the college open day and getting excited about A-level options there - also laying down revision expectations - what subjects each week needed to be covered.

She told me quite matter of factly that she was planning on not doing well in these exams so she can stick 2 fingers up at her teachers when she does well in the real things

Unless she’s at a school with a sixth form she won’t see these teachers after she leaves school, and that is several weeks before the results come out.

If she goes into school to collect her results it’s quite likely most teachers won’t be there to notice her 2 fingered gesture.

She told me quite matter of factly that she was planning on not doing well in these exams so she can stick 2 fingers up at her teachers when she does well in the real things -

Positive there is she clearly still expects and wants to do well in actual GCSE in her Y11.

If school does try and drop her down the sets - argue her case with the school and try and make sure even if she down a group if she bucks up she can still sit the higher papers.

Not sure about the science - here they do triple but they still have foundation and higher papers - so if one science is less good they can still higher in other subject. Here taking triple is one option slot - so if she did drop to double would it leave a timetable gap - or is it different with your DD school ? You can still do science A-level from double science - so with decent grades that's not a problem.

I was that year 10 back in 1981! 28% in my maths mock ( took it in y10) and a grade B in my O level! I was so bored and I can't say my attitude got much better in year 11 though managed 12 O levels altogether.
It was all downhill after that I'm afraid but I think nowadays parents and teachers would be more proactive and also your dd does realise how important her exams are - a message not really pushed at my northern comp! Try to find something she's interested in that she could pursue out of school. Dd2 was very bored throughout school but she did kumon maths outside of school which pushed her and got her back on track.

I'm pretty sure most teachers will be in school on results day even if a lot of pupils just get their results via email and don't bother going in. (Dd3 is y11)

I was a bit like this, I never did any extra work if I could avoid it, didn't revise for any mocks and wasn't even given the option of triple science because I wasn't deemed to be doing well enough in yr9.
I was bright so was still on track for bs and Cs (old money). In the end, for the real things, I worked hard at home, got a suite of as and a stars then got 4 As in myAlevels. She might genuinely be bored and dislike her teachers, I'd try and just treat her normally, chat about what's boring and why, which teachers she doesn't like etc. If she does fail them, once she's older she can re take them at college so it won't be the end of the world and if she's bright it'll be easy to pick up again.
Try not to stress, keep her talking to you, keep her engaged in her future. If she's really seeing no point at all in anything, and can't see a future, it might be worth seeing the gp or getting some counselling as that sounds like depression... equally if she's on top of hobbies, has friends etc, it might just be teenage ennui which I think will go once it really matters!

DD was like that in Year 10 and just kept saying she'd be fine in the real exams.

Her attitude completely changed in Year 11 and she really worked hard.

She said the pushback in Year 10 was because they were constantly being told how important GCSEs were and she got fed up with it.

I did have to insist she stayed in the higher level for one subject that she was excelling in out of school though, there was talk of her being moved down. Come Year 11 she was back up to 8 and 9 grades in that so I was glad I had insisted.

I got financial incentives per exam on a rising scale for the good marks from my parents and grandparents.

I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing but it totally worked for me and I worked my arse off. Still sighed school on pretty much a daily basis but made up for it by cramming and did better than I could have dreamed of. Got lots of money too. Win win.

Not in my experience but ymmv.

What do you think most teachers will be there to do?

Shes about to enter the adult world and it all depends on what she can achieve. Youve already tried to talk to her but shes getting anxious, not sure if I want to do this adult stuff. Theres a distance growing between you, it could be connected to male attention from somewhere. She needs reassurance shes filled with trepidation and could do with comfort or else this is where €@ting problems start. So I would think no more 'pep talks 'and more praise , kindness, Love. (Btw E.D. are the only illnesses that improve if you ignore them.)

I did that right through my last 2 years at school, just scraped 3 O levels, bummed around in college & got kicked out. I was a young person with undiagnosed autism. I got a job with the Civil Service at the lowest admin grade at 18 & managed to eventually get promoted, I stayed in that job until I had to retire.

As a teacher I would suggest emailing her form tutor/Head of Year/pastoral support. They are best placed to advise as they have worked with 1000s of teenagers at this stage and know what’s normal & what is not & where to go if they are concerned.
Her wanting to piss off her teachers is childish, the best revenge is success after all.

There are tiers for maths, sciences and MFL.

I would suggest going to 6th form and college open days to see grade requirements for courses. So she understands she needs 6s/7s for A levels.

The only person she hurts is herself if she doesn't get good grades on purpose.

The teachers will go 'such a shame, oh well' and move on, she'll be stuck with the grades.

I was going to say will they notice? Seems a bit pointless. Step back but let her know she needs a plan for how she’s going to pay her way and that even entry level jobs require qualifications.

Dd3 is my 4th dc and certainly the majority of the teachers were there on results day for my other 3. Ds, my 3rd dc, did his gcses in 2019 and I think he got his results at school not via email so obviously it will be different if everyone already knows their results.
My dc all went/ go to private school and there was also a small buffet and drinks. A lot of children leave after year 11 so the teachers and pupils can see each other for the last time. Also if results were unexpected they can offer support.

Ahh that's really hard to watch OP when your DD has so much potential! My DS messed around a bit in Yr 9 and yr 10 - red cards, detentions, talking in class, answering back etc. Yr 11 he was like a different person. lots of his friends are academic/clever etc and all they seemed to talk about was grade boundaries and who was going to do best and what A Levels they wanted to do! My DS applied for best school in area to study A Levels (but didn't get offered place/interview as November Yr 11 mocks weren't high enough). So he's hopefully staying on at his current school 6th form. He's worked really hard after Christmas for his GCSEs - we were all amazed at how much revision he's done tbh. Applied for a summer job etc whilst revising in May and went to an interview for it/did online training whilst finishing his last couple of exams. Seems really focused in Yr 11. So you might find after a nice relaxing summer OP that your DD really knuckles down when Yr 11 starts. I think it helps my DS has an older sister already in 2nd year at Surrey Uni - she's having a great time & doing really well and he wants the same for himself. Have you talked to your DD about post 16 and post 18 and what she wants to do? Does she think Uni might be the way forward or maybe a degree apprenticeship course? GCSEs are just a stepping stone to the next qualification after all and once achieved can be forgotten. Maybe have a look at open days near you at local colleges or Unis this summer or autumn of yr 11 and take her to look round. It might spark her interest and help her understand what she's working towards. My DS did consistently poorly at Spanish btw plus hated it and disliked the teacher so he's sat the foundation paper in that subject - so the highest he can achieve is a 5. He's not bothered at all but your DD might care if it brings down the rest of her good grades. Have a chat but try not to nag her - it's her future after all. I had good advice years ago - work backwards from a job/career your DD might want to do (ie accountant or vet or dentist or lawyer) then see what degree they would need then look and see what A Levels or Btecs she'd need etc. Does she have a dream or going to Edinburgh Uni or Cambridge etc? (some will glance at GCSEs and expect 9s across board and all A* at A Levels etc). Good luck OP & all the best to your DD 👏