Should we move back to the UK or is this just new baby reality?

[Wingingitmum11]

We have lived in another country since our mid 20s. Have a lovely home, good jobs and a really nice lifestyle. I always missed people but never really felt homesick. We are lucky family come to visit us.

Since having a baby and my mum visited for 3 weeks, I haven't been able to pick myself back up. I have been diagnosed pnd. I cry most days. I miss my parents so badly and my in-laws also. We recently visited the uk and know the lifestyle would be a huge adjustment for us but we were constantly surrounded by family and old friends (holiday mode - probably not an accurate representation of what real life would be like!).

But.... I am so lonely on mat leave. I do activities and walks everyday . Have met some lovely mum friends but I would love to spend the days with my own mum. I dread going back to work with no support system from family and how we are going to manage sickness, no real break etc (stupidly didn't quite realise before baby!). I am already exhausted.

I feel like pnd is clouding my thinking and I just don't know if we should look at uprooting our whole life back to the UK or is this just reality with a baby and I should be lucky how good we have it. My partner is great. He would consider moving if I really wanted but he is happy here and thinks it's best long term for us and our baby (deep down I know he's right but it doesn't make everyday any easier).

My parents do plan to move here but due to visa wait it is estimated another 4/5 away (minimum) and very expensive(they have paid a small first instalment so far) I feel like I can't wait this long. They would be gutted as do want to be here.

Not sure my real reason to post, maybe just for shared opinions....

First, congratulations on your baby. 💐
I made a country move decision in the weeks following a big life event. It was the wrong decision and I later learnt the advice is to wait a year before making such a huge ( and very expensive) decision. I also met a couple of people who'd made the same choice and also regretted it.
Wait a few months, Britain will still be here. Tell yourself you’ll shelve the decision for 4, 8 12 months, whatever feels right for you. Then you can concentrate on enjoying your baby and getting help for your pnd.

Hi op, I haven’t rtft but I have been through a similar experience and it is really hard.

In your shoes though, I would stay put, the main reason being, that raising a child abroad, although very hard, is a massive key to potential integration or at least immersion in another culture!

You can literally accompany them in their education and learn about the language and culture through their eyes.

And at the same time, you will meet other mothers at nursery but mainly in the first early years of school. And then you will have a supportive circle of friends around you. Go out of your way to establish a small emergency babying sitting circle with three or four other reliable women who you trust and “click” with and who reciprocate play dates etc.

In the meantime though, you have to get through the baby and infant years and they are the most isolating and difficult. Obviously you have to seek medical help for your PND first and foremost and take steps each day to combat it.

Are there any expat on-line hubs where you are? You could perhaps post asking about mother and baby groups? Or even ask for other mothers to meet you and go out walking? It just takes one or two nice friends to make a huge difference.

Good luck op 💐

I live abroad and have had 4DC. Of course there are moments when I wish my parents were around, and it's true our friends can only do so much BUT honestly, the pros far outweigh the cons for us.

My dad once caught a hint of my feelings (particularly around guilt for them missing out on their grandchildren) and told us never to move back as we give them a lot more opportunities than they would get in the UK. We make effort to talk on the phone, video calls and so forth. The baby period is short. Then they go to school, and then before you know it, your DC are teenagers.

I get what you are feeling, but I genuinely wouldn't take my family back to the UK. It's a pretty broken place at the moment and quality of life is a big thing!

See, this is what irritates me. The UK is not "a pretty broken place." It's been battered politically and it's been in better spaces financially, of course. But in global terms it is a good place to live. We aren't battered by weather extremes, natural disasters, poisonous or dangerous animals. We have water and food aplenty. We aren't being blown up or besieged. Our government has been a mess but we have the power to change it.

If we stopped talking this country down all the time and regained a sense of pride and perspective that actually we are really bloody lucky to live here, maybe we would stop being so bloody depressed and gloomy.

I did this OP. It wasn't an international move, but a few hours away to a different town I had never lived in to be nearer PIL. They were going to help a lot and do childcare.
Unfortunately, one of them died suddenly. The other one was so heartbroken they became frail and refused to see people.
The town itself was run down, we had our house broken into, car vandalised and it was really hard to sell our house and move back.
The whole thing was bloody traumatic!
I was in such a fog of PND at the time though. I wouldn't listen to anyone and was desperate for help. I wish I had stuck it out.
I went on medication and got therapy and things became better.
I hope they do for you too

I think people are referring to public services aren’t they?

Health care is a pretty important consideration when you have dc.

As is public transport, state education, policing, environment, etc.

We still have better access to health care than most of the world. Better access to transport. Decent state education. Reasonable policing. Of course things could be better but to say it's "broken" is so breathtakingly privileged a statement that it just makes me think everyone should go volunteering in a place with serious actual problems. I mean if you think we are "a broken place" what do you think of most of South America, Africa, parts of the middle East, rural China, rural South Asia? I mean jeez. I may have to wait 8 hours to see a doctor in the NHS but my baby isn't going to die of lack of clean water or access to any healthcare, or be crushed under rubble when my house is blown up by some enemy of my corrupt government.

You should wait a year after having a baby before making any big decisions. Having said that, motherhood doesn't get any less lonely IMO and being surrounded by family and friends means the world to me.

@Toasticles of course there are countries that are worse off, but we aren't discussing those. Compared to the country I live in, the UK is a shambles. And yes, I am
Mostly referring to schools and NHS. It won't be fixed in time for OP's child.

This is about a lifestyle choice, not a race to the bottom. But you carry on taking offense.

@wiggleweggle How do you know, if you don't live here?

Because I am from the UK. As is DH. My family live in the UK. We visit, and talk to friends and family regularly. We have seen the decline in public services.

I am hopeful that the UK will be able to turn things around, but as it stands.... it's not what it was, and it isn't great.

Have you lived in another country @Toasticles ?

Yes I have @wiggleweggle
Lived in East Africa through my childhood.
Spent a year in Australia
Two years in Canada.

Ok, so you have enough experience to understand my point, especially as the OP is comparing Australia and the UK.

I live in Australia now, I'm from the UK, I absolutely love it here. But I never realised how I would feel when major life changes happened, I've been through a divorce, my mum passing away a wedding and a new baby in the years I've been here and every time has left me feeling unsettled and emotional for living here, but I stuck it out because I know this is where I'm meant to be and I do love it here. As time passes things should start to feel better, you have so much going on and your hormones are all over the place, give yourself some time and grace 🤍 xx

I'm going to go against the grain. I was in the same position OP and I'm so glad we made the move back. Of course things can be tough here but it's home. I love my kids growing up around my parents and my friends kids and their cousins. Priceless.

Totally but not everyone has that family support, I know people who have moved back and barely see them, don't look after their kids etc. Families aren't all the same and you make the move for a reason. So giving it time before making a decision makes sense ☺️

Oh you sound like me! We did the sane, moved to Oz settled down, had 1 dc, then dc2. Parents visited..... 1 year later we flew back to UK after selling up best move we made, family first for us especially once we had our own dc. 6 years on no regrets at all.

I had my children a long haul flight away from all family. I had a great support network of friends who became like family. But when shitty life events coincided with Covid, I came home. It's just very very different to ask for help from family. My children know their cousins so well now, and it's just different asking my brother or sister or parents for help rather than a friend.

For me, it's been a fucking revelation having the NHS!! I lived somewhere with health insurance and it was such an expense and just shitty 'diagnose as much as we can' service. Plus UK maternity leave! Bloody hell I wish I'd had months and months of maternity leave and the child benefit and the government support for childcare and benefits if you need them! Such luxuries 😂 I stayed there sweating my arse off and working hard to maintain visa eligibility and I could've been starting a SAHM side hustle and living with govt support.

People in the UK don't know how lucky they are (I'm aware I sound like a twat but all my adult life abroad just made me forget)

Massive downside: the weather is world shatteringly SHIT. All the time. I've bought lots of coats.

Thanks everyone for your input.
agree I need to get my pnd under control before any big decisions are made.

we are thinking a trip next year if we can afford it. I do think that would be good for me to test the waters again.

I’d honestly stay put for a while, especially if you parents are looking to join you long term. We have recently moved and honestly it has been life changing in so many ways. I don’t mean to talk the UK down but one of the things that made us make the choice was the broken nature of Britain, and I couldn’t see any hope (that may irritate the PP but it is true, and yes compared to slums the UK may be great but it also isn’t a race to the bottom). My DC have thrived and are having so much access to new sports and other outdoor activities, my eldest child who never got any support with her SEN is having all kinds of support put in place at her new school. All of the facilities for families are cleaner and I can easily access health and dental care (yes at a small cost) and reliable and clean public transport. Australia isn’t a uptopia by any stretch but there are lots of positives in the face of the unrelenting misery of broken (and broke!) Britain.

I hope you start to feel better soon.
Just to say that I love in the UK and am originally from the antibodies.
I have a baby and a toddler and it's tough without any support from either side. With my second I got a mother's help in twice a week which helped so much.
Both sets of our parents are quite elderly and definitely wouldn't have been running round doing laundry and cooking meals anyway, but it feels lonely and sad not to share your new baby with them and enjoy the time together.

I would not move back.
It’s very different living somewhere than being on holiday there.
People have their own lives. Your old friends will have their own families to care for. They won’t necessarily have the time or energy to spend a lot of time with you.
Your parents will eventually be living in the same country.

My friend moved back home from NZ after children for similar reasons, but the reality of it wasn't as rose tinted and they soon moved back to NZ again.

I would really recommend getting a nanny if it is at all possible financially. I did when I had 2 preschoolers at home, they both struggled with nursery settings.

I was very lucky to find an older woman part time and did a mixture of nursery/home with the nanny, but the nanny was usually able (and happy) to come if they weren't well enough for nursery. She made life so much easier.

My family were all within an hour from me, but everyone was working and busy, so I felt very lonely on mat leave too, despite not being far away.

The nanny was when I went back to work, sorry I didn't make that clear!