If you could decide how much people get in benefits

[OneLemonOrca]

There are benefit bashing threads being posted often, with complaints that certain people on benefits can afford a better lifestyle than them when they work, and that it is being made into a life style choice?
So if you could decide, I am just wondering how much you think benefit claimants should receive in certain circumstances or what their money should or shouldn’t be able to pay for, to get a general idea of what mumsnet thinks is “right”.

i hate that my premise causes people to think benefits should be less.

why doesn’t it cause people to think work should pay more??

fwiw I think whilst work doesn’t pay more benefits should top up everyone to at least that level.

I'm so sorry that you have been through all of this.

The thing I would particularly like to fix is to vastly increase the stock of social housing with proper, affordable rents so that we are not paying vast amounts of benefits straight into the pockets of private landlords. That would hopefully free up some resource to ensure that people who have no choice but to rely on benefits can actually have a decent standard of living.

I have for a very long time thought a UBI is the way forward - everyone from 18 plus. This would mean you could lose all the other benefits and supports so many pinch points in life - studying, period of ill health , redundancy, maternity and caring

Child benefit is only £25 a week, no one is living it up on that. It's not a "benefit" in the same way that UC is, the earnings cut off is usually higher for child benefit.

UBI won't work any better than the current system does unless we provide a lot more affordable/ council housing and/or a in serious rent controls. Universal credit it's a private landlord subsidy and with every over inflated UC payment the huge chunk of "rent" costs is basically going towards paying off an asset for the owner. Often the conditions are horrific. This all needs to change.

We need to normalise apartment living like in Europe and make beautiful complexes that have gyms, play grounds, shops and restaurants etc that petite actually want to live in for a decent affordable price but can't purchase. It would also help to change the laws so Pele can purchase their own land and build an environmentally friendly small house/tiny home and even be sowed to add a few extra for their adult offspring etc. just write into the laws they they need to be a certain standard and have adequate water/sewage/power etc. petites needs and wants are changing regarding housing and the country needs to change with it.

I do agree with UBI. I also agree with free education. And looking after the sick/disabled.

Some might say you're more than capable of working a few hours each week at home proof reading. Don't worry about what others are capable of doing, just focus on yourself.

Ah ok. I think my relative said they were claiming other things too but that has now been cut. Tiny in the grand scheme of things.

Why bother working then?

Sometimes I feel that the the benefit -bashing threads, although appear to be bashing benefits (although I suppose they ), are actually bashing wages, and that they are not enough, especially if you’re the squeezed middle.

Personal ambition?
mental health?
desire to use skills?
desire to help people?
foreign holidays?
And I don’t know about you but I like more than adequate and occasional treats aren’t nearly enough.

some combination of the above is why a lot of people work the jobs they do. I could do an objectively easier job on minimum wage and work less hours than I do now. I don’t though….

UBI sounds like a great idea but how many people would simply decide not to work if they received enough money to live on? The low paid workers who do the important jobs. The shop workers, carers, TAs who are regularly threatened and abused in their workplace and who earn minimum wage. Why wouldn't they decided to give up work if a UBI meant they received enough money to pay their living expenses.

I think UBI would come with so many unintended consequences it wouldn't work.

Firstly, in work benefits should be paid to the businesses whose low wages we are subsidising. Once people join up the dots and work out we are subsidising massively profitable companies like Tesco and Amazon they'll start blaming the right people for the benefits bill.

Childcare needs to be affordable and subsidised too, for everyone. Staying at home with the children should be an option too. At the moment we will pay more in benefits so a stranger can look after your children than they'll give you to do it yourself. I think that's crazy.

We also need massive amounts of council housing. Good quality, genuinely affordable housing is a basic human right and not only are we not providing it, we are paying massive amounts in housing benefits to slum landlords whose housing is literally killing people.

Remove the two children cap. Put the Local Housing Allowance back up to 50%. Scrap the 'affordable rents' in social housing. Pay benefits that cover the genuine cost of living and increase it by the rate of inflation every year.

Why oh why is it assumed minimum wage jobs are easy, they are not, they may not be highly skilled but you are expected to work your arse off ,put up with all manner of crap from managers and customers...ask any supermarket worker.

id rather see council properties built, every new development has to be 50% council owned properties, not housing association.

reduce rents, which then stops housing being a commodity. With ample social housing rents would reduce

with a basic package paid to everyone, if 100% of that money is used for renting, again it’s penalising those who rent. So reduce rents by giving the supply of council housing

in my area a 2 bed council property is £559 a month, housing association £800 and private £1000+

id stop right to buy

Plug this into a benefits calculator:
* family of four
* one worker
* minimum wage x 40 hours
* private rented accommodation in London

When I last checked, the take-home 'pay' was higher than a teacher at the top of the pay scale - roughly equivalent to £58k.

Why bother with the stress of teaching when you can get more serving coffee?

You’re massively underestimating the number of lazy people out there who would quite happily live off UBI while topping up by selling a bit of weed. The whole concept relies on people being inherently decent and hard working by nature, many aren’t. The whole thing would collapse because there would be so few people ‘voluntarily’ working to pay the taxes to pay UBI to start with.

I get the arguments for universal basic income but surely this would lead to huge inflation.

Have you got the stats for that or is just opinion and prejudice?

I didn’t say all minimum wage jobs were easy 🤷‍♀️. Like anything some are some aren’t.

I think it’s a good idea on paper, but it doesn’t take into account human nature (posters on here don’t on the whole, but then very few of them live in working class areas or see ‘problem’ members of the public on a daily basis).

If you make working optional and make it so you can have a relatively okay quality of life without lifting a finger, many won’t. They’ll take the hit of not having the next level up in cars/holidays/houses because they’ll see the free time they have and the lack of stress/graft as worth it. Many will commit petty crime to top up and make a few extra quid.

In short the system would collapse because you will need a very high number of people in work to afford to pay everyone UBI to start with, but that won’t happen because you’re incentivising not working.

Disability living allowance would be higher.

For other benefits- Food and heating vouchers and then a small amount of money. I wouldn’t let people have benefits indefinitely. They would be reviewed every 6 months.
I would encourage people to work but would make it worth their while. Those working but earning a low wage would be given top up bonuses every 6 months they stay in employment (full time) This would encourage more people with perhaps lower skill set to work, because they will always be in a better position working than not. It should always be that you are rewarded for working and that anyone working can afford a comfortable and decent life regardless of their job and income.

So anybody working over say 30 hours a week will be able to live comfortably and enjoy treats and incentives to continue that lifestyle.

Do you have stats where UBI has been rolled out in a country with a similar profile to the U.K. and it has worked? Through work I see the type of person I describe every single day. Many of them. If you live a middle class life you’ll barely register their existence.

This is exactly that's led to a housing crisis,lack of affordable housing,jacked up private rents .buy to let allowed the spivs to get a foothold and rtb saw the best of housing stock go.