If you could decide how much people get in benefits

[OneLemonOrca]

There are benefit bashing threads being posted often, with complaints that certain people on benefits can afford a better lifestyle than them when they work, and that it is being made into a life style choice?
So if you could decide, I am just wondering how much you think benefit claimants should receive in certain circumstances or what their money should or shouldn’t be able to pay for, to get a general idea of what mumsnet thinks is “right”.

The current government introduced uc. The amounts are calculated to meet the basic costs for people and their families.

UC is effectively a form of basic income but is not universal (as that would bankrupt us and end up with people in need getting less). A system like UC means funds can be targeted.

Universal Basic Income. Whether you are ill, unemployed, a carer, a stay at home parent etc you should be able to live.

People would still work.

That’s universal credit. UBI is where everyone is given an income including those in work. Of course these new payments have to be paid for by either increasing taxes massively or cutting spending on other things

No it isn't, Universal Credit is an income based benefit, UBI is the same amount paid to everyone.
There's no expectation or conditionality with UBI that you have to seek work or increase income.

What about people who work full time jobs but still can't afford to live

we should force companies to pay more.

its scandalous that for example tesco, one of the U.K.’s biggest employers, have forecast profits of at least £2.8m for this coming year, will pay their CEO £10m yet can’t pay the significant number of their staff (250k) on min wage a living wage, instead having the tax payer subsidise them.

If you think you're getting too much money (so presumably don't need it) why are you claiming it? You don't have to. My friend had to give up work because of her health. She was entitled to claim contributions based benefits but couldn't face going through the application process. Her DH is a reasonably high paid earner so they manage. Although it works for them, it's not always advisable for someone to be financially dependent on their partner especially as it leaves them vulnerable to abuse.

Vouchers take away dignity and independence. It will achieve the opposite of getting job seekers into work as more will end up with mental health issues. Very likely to affect job interview performance too. And for sick and disabled people, it's a nasty cruel 'punishment' for being sick or disabled. I wouldn't want to swap with my friend even if I was offered millions. She was in a well paid job that she enjoyed. She isn't sitting at home having fun. She's struggling everyday with her health issues.

I really like the idea of universal basic income.
Of course people would still go out to work.. money isn't the only reason why people work.
But it's certainly the only reason they tolerate being badly treated or exploited at work, which is why I think a lot of people are frightened of universal basic income.. because some peoples businesses rely on exploiting people.

If I knew I had all my basics covered by a universal benefit I'd still go out to work.
I love my job. But I wouldn't be taking any crap. Because I could still survive if I got fired.

I agree with UBI. Also more social housing.

A PP wondered about the variation in housing costs across the country. Perhaps there could be a suppplemental housing element that's higher if someone is from a more expensive area and or has a need to stay? Things like being vulnerable and with family or friends in the area, or a carer, or doing a keyworker or shortage occupation job.

Also there should be a disability supplement for people unable to work to cover extra costs of illness or disability.

I don't see why UBI is a disincentive to work.
It's a basic income. Just enough to live on. Working gives more choices and opportunity and also sense of purpose. Being at home doing nothing might be a novelty at first but grinds people down after a while.

UBI would actually help people work, because financial worries and struggles affect health.

Also people can moan about 'forcing people to work' all day long but how are you going to force businesses to hire anyone who applies?

Another issue (that's usually ignored) is there aren't enough jobs!
916,00 job vacancies, but 1 million job seekers (and that doesn't include people on sickness benefits).

Now that we've got AI and all, universal basic income makes perfect sense. If an algorithm can write a Hollywood script it can sure as shit do most office jobs. People who still want to do office work can oversee everything, like gods commanding the heavens, while the computers do all the shit work. Other people can do the skilled jobs that you actually need humans for, like care work, food preparation and so on, but they'd have loads of money because they'd be getting a wage on top of their UBI. We could be living in utopia.

UC is effectively a form of basic income but is not universal (as that would bankrupt us and end up with people in need getting less). A system like UC means funds can be targeted.

Why would UBI bankrupt us? Administrating and means testing benefits costs a fortune. I suspect UBI would be cheaper especially if we also had more social housing. I also think many people don't realise how much poverty costs the NHS.

As for people in need missing out. UC doesn't seem to be a great system. Some seem to manage ok on it but others aren't getting enough to live on.

God I think I need to take a break from these benefits threads. Definitely not the best way to wind down before bed and I'm not even on benefits! Can only imagine how stressful they are for people who are on benefits. I just hope nothing ever happens to DH or me.

There are shit loads of benefits threads rn it's true.

Almost like there's an election looming ...

Lots of people who are not on benefits can’t afford this…

Yes, this!!

... which is insane.

There's a clear break in the tacit social contract imo.

Thank God no one on here will impact the amount that I receive😁

Completely agree with this!

Think the previous housing benefit worked when given directly to landlords . It may encourage more LL renting to people on benefits .
There should harsher penalties fir not paying child maintenance. Parts of US garnish wages , remove driving licence and even jail time.
Should you return to work or start a new job there should be a period of gradually reducing benefits. The sudden withdrawal and monthly payrolls can often leave a gap with no income. I do believe it makes people afraid to cone off benefits.

Exactly more so if private renting that makes up most of the UC award and claimants have to top up the rent out of their living money.some people work part time because that's all their health allows . being on benefit for the most part is not a life of Riley that's a lie that's promoted by the Tories and right wing media.The latest scheme to get disabled people back to work is costing £64 millions...I wonder whose getting that contract and who they are connected to?.

One of the things that has opened my eyes is how easy it is for school leavers to drift into a benefits dependent lifestyle. We have seen a succession of young adults who have no ambition or work ethic start training with us only to give up after a few months, to quote one “because it’s easier to not work”. They drift from one “temp “job to another because to qualify for benefits they need to show willing. Essentially they learn to work the system. We have had three young girls work for 3-6 months, get pregnant and all 3 have ended up in brand new social housing.
I know of couples who have put off having a family until they can afford to rent or buy a home they feel they can bring up a family in. It must be difficult to see others benefit from a system that seems to encourage dependency.

My solution would be to implement a minimum period of contribution, tax and NI, before you can claim any benefits.
Spending money you have worked hard to earn is very different to spending handouts. And making work compulsory for all able school leavers could potentially lead to a better motivated workforce.
This would include those wanting to go into higher education. Two years of earning prior to going to uni will give them savings.
I suppose it could be seen as a type of national service.
My DS is on a gap year currently, the plan was to work but unfortunately he had to have joint surgery which meant he was unable to drive, lift or use his right arm for 4+ months. He is now working but very much casual jobs because he’s off to uni in 4 mnths.
He could have claimed benefits but I didn’t encourage him. I don’t want him seeing it as an alternative to earning a living. It has meant that he’s not been able to enjoy himself much but he needs to understand that it’s a two way transaction. Being paid in exchange for his time and effort is the only way to encourage a work ethic.

UBI trialed in other countries may well have been successful but did those countries have a well established benefits system prior to implementing UBI. Embracing UBI as a community is a positive move for all but in the UK I suspect our underlying feelings about a failing benefit system may prejudice the potential benefits for all. There will always be those who do and those that are happy to sit back and let others do in their place.

I have lots of medical conditions but 3 of those medical conditions, some consultants in A&E and all junior drs i have come across are not aware of what that medical condition is

So if they bring in this idea of ‘Job centre medical Professionals’ deciding if your able to work or not
My first question will be asking them what my medical condition is and if they dont know then how are they deciding if i am able to work???

Thats what im more concerned about

Tesco have also made their conditions of work harder. I have a friend who worked 30 hours but his contract was cut to 15 hours because then they don't have to pay sick pay etc. A lot of retail has similar conditions, my DD had a job in a phone shop when she left school and her 15 hours could be spread over 5 days. Thankfully she has moved on from that but a lot of people are stuck in those low wage jobs when they want to work more.

To disclose, I receive child related benefits including dla.

There are people claiming benefits who could work in some capacity. I am not talking about severely disabled who rightly should be supported. But those who could work or could increase their hours but don't because their benefits top up.

People don't often realise that once your claiming certain benefits then you become eligible for additional help eg rent paid, extra carers allowance if earning under x amount. Assistance with free household items, reduced electric tariffs etc. It may not seem like much but to those working and not claiming I can fully understand why people are questioning the system.

You are probably better off on benefits and renting than working full time in a job that pays £18 an hour and having a mortgage. The amounts those on benefits are given tax free a month is often very significant when you factor in all the top ups and additional extras you become eligible for.

Universal Basic Income all the way. The benefits system is ineffective, inefficient and inhumane.

So for a 40 x £18 an hour is almost £37500 before tax and you reckon benefits would be better.... hardly.
I don't know where you get the cheap energy,free white goods from for the most part life on benefit is a hand to mouth existence for the majority.