How’s this for a whole new level of cheeky fuckery - someone has token our allotment!

[YaMuvva]

Moved into our new house in January. Bought off a lovely lady who was a widow and something of a popular figure in the street (relevant).

We were pleasantly surprised to find that in the deeds it came with a garage across the road (which we’d seen at the viewing but it wasn’t clear it belonged to the house) and an allotment plot. We’ve actually been on an allotment waiting list for years so it was nice news.

We’ve already had aggro with the garage - when we got the keys we went to open it and found that it was rammed full of full boxes! I called previous owner directly as she gave us her number (as assumed they were hers) and she said she allowed our next door neighbour for years to use it. He was most put out when we told him to clear his stuff as we needed to use it. This was 3 months ago, and only last week did he finally clear it out, and only did so when we had to get shitty with him and say if he didn’t clear the garage we would do it for him (don’t want to get off an a bad foot with the neighbours but he was taking the piss).

Anyway we have never checked out the allotment before now (it’s not far about a 10 min walk from here) just because of time constraints and illnesses and crappy weather but decided to finally today go and find it as the sun is shining here.

Anyway, when we got there we looked on the sheet of paper we’d been given and found the plot - and a person sitting next to a full and lush patch sitting on a chair having a cuppa! There is also a shed full of tools coffee cups newspapers etc in it too . We asked the person if we’d got it wrong as we are new owners of number 8 on X Street and thought this was our new allotment.

Apparently she is our neighbour down the road (never yet met her) and yes whilst it is the allotment belonging to number 8, the previous owner (a “very dear friend” of hers apparently) let her use it, she’s been using it for 10 years.

My DH, still stinging from the garage debacle, said well I’m afraid your very dear friend doesn’t live in no 8 any more we do and we are reclaiming the allotment, thank you for looking after it but it is OURS to enjoy.

She bloody said no! And that she’s cultivated this patch for several years, she grows all her veggies here and it’s her sanctuary so if we want it we will ‘have to fight for it’! She also said she paid for the shed.

DH said that’s fine, expect a fight then, and we shuffled away in shock. I then rang the old owner and she said “Oh yes it’s Barbara’s plot really she was good to take it off my hands and it would be awful to take it off her”. To be clear - the plot has NOT been sold to Barbara.

I just can’t believe the piss takery of this. DH thinks we should just go and take down the shed, leave it at her front door and dig up everything and chuck it all in a bin.

I feel like the neighbours just took the piss out of the old owner and think they genuinely have a claim to the stuff she was kind enough to let them borrow.

Of course not, but 3 months have passed and there's been no sign of the OP coming to the plot. Barbara may have assumed the previous owner had agreed something with the new owners, and they were going to let her continue to use it. Or she may not have connected the dots between the house sale and the plot of land. It's been 10 years, and from the OP it's clear the previous owner was happy to get rid of it. We have no idea what the previous owner has said to her over the years about the land, she may have said it was hers to keep for as long as she wanted it.

Her attitude isn't great but it's obviously come as a shock to Barbara and she hasn't been informed that she would need to leave the plot. I can't imagine anyone putting in all the work required for this year if they knew they had to leave.

Unbelievable responses. Barbara was given this allotment, she is not being a CF at all by feeling like it is hers! Do you honestly think the old owner should have drawn up a legal contract with her friend? Honestly.
Yes it is now yours according to the law, so claim it back by all means if you want to, but you could have gone about it in an understanding way. Sounds like you went in all guns blazing. It's not Barbara's fault the previous owner messed up during the sale. It will be devastating to her to lose this allotment after years of time and work, and given what a sanctuary she has said it is for her. A little bit of understanding of that fact in how you communicate with her and deal with the situation would go a long way. I'm shocked at the inability of previous posters to feel any empathy, it's all such self righteous judgemental unfeeling responses.

OP DH was looking forward to actually using it - so not sure they do want to sell it.

All theses share ideas and extra time would probably have happened if Barbara had approached the OP directly - waiting for OP to find out and then announcing she'll be fighting OP for the land do tend to make them less viable options - it's possible Barbara will approach OP again in more conciliatory mood but given OP experiences so far of CF neighbours I'd be wary.

If the allotment and garage are included in your deeds then it's the previous lovely and popular owner that should have had a conversation with those she was allowing to use the spaces. Get legal advice. Just because you've been allowed to use something doesn't mean that ownership passes to you

Ooof, I'm raging on your behalf OP, especially as you really wanted an allotment anyway. People are weird. Barbara must know the game is up? She'd be better off sorting out her stuff to leave and getting herself on the waiting list for her own allotment sharpish.

Tough shit for Barbara. She must have know this was coming when her mate sold up.

Hello Barbara. Yes, there should have been something in writing from the previous owner but she didn't and now there's a problem that could easily have been avoided

You're doing the right thing checking with the solicitor OP, but you said the plot's included on the title deeds and that sounds pretty clear to me, no matter how unusual the arrangement may be

If it comes to it, hopefully a solicitor's letter will get rid of her - otherwise, as PPs have said, I suspect this could get expensive

Unbelievable responses. Barbara was given this allotment, she is not being a CF at all by feeling like it is hers! Do you honestly think the old owner should have drawn up a legal contract with her friend? Honestly.

She wasn't given it - the previous owner allowed her use - she knew house was being sold and then when new owners turn up wanting their land gets upset with them.

Barbara is being very rude and cheeky. If this was such a dear close friend then she would have damn well known this person was moving and the house had been sold. People dont buy and sell their house in a few hours- the process takes months. She would have known she didnt have a right to it and if she didnt then thats her own stupidity to assume it with no legal papers.

I would contact the seller and make it absolutely clear that SHE needs to oust Barbara otherwise I'd be taking legal action.

Unbelievable responses. Barbara was given this allotment, she is not being a CF at all by feeling like it is hers! Do you honestly think the old owner should have drawn up a legal contract with her friend? Honestly.

But what the old owner has actually done is to sign a legal contract with op selling it to her.
Of course she needed to draw up a legal contract if what she wanted to do was give it to her friend, it’s land, not an old piece of furniture.

I really feel for the woman who's been tending to the allotment. She's poured her heart and soul into it for a decade, clearly it means a lot to her, and it's not a surprise that given you and your husband's unfriendly and heavy handed approach she was extremely defensive. You've not conducted yourselves with much tact or compassion.

You don't seem to have any grasp on what it is that you own or on what terms. Probably start there before you start threatening people with "a fight".

You may have a legal fight on your hands if she's been using/cultivating it for 10 years.. i'm sure there is something in law that might give her a claim to it after that long.

Barbara is not naive, Barbara is wiley and trying her luck.

Having read this earlier I checked my deeds as there's something about allotments ... my deeds say I have a right to rent an allotment subject to availability, there's also details about giving up this right, what isn't clear is what happens as a subsequent owner wanting the right back (I don't want an allotment do haven't tried to exercise it) I'm wondering if this is a similar situation?

But it’s Barbara who started talking about fighting, op’s dh just said ok then.

I really want to know the outcome of this! I'd be furious! I can't believe the cheek of some people expecting to use someone else's garage and allotment - for free! And then not give it back afterwards!

Then there would be documents surely showing this. If the owner did not disclose this to the buyer then she sold the house (which included the allotment) under false pretences and lied about it. If the allotment was listed as being part of the sale then she has lied on the property forms hasn't she?- thats illegal

In practice- how does someone get removed from the allotment by legal means in this situation? Will she get a trespassing notice/ arrested? Do the baliffs turn up and start digging up the veg? Genuinely curious as to how it could play out.

To be fair to Barbara, she might well not have known that the allotment was owned rather than rented.
She may not have realised that the sale of the house had any connection to the allotment. After all, it's a very unusual situation. I've never heard of an allotment being part of the title deeds of a house. Only being rented at peppercorn rent from the local council.

Did your solicitor not tell you to check the condition of the property on the day you got the keys, take meter readings, ensure house was empty etc? I can’t believe you didn’t check the condition of garage and allotment as well as the house on day one. As you are about to find out, it’s much harder to get a vendor to do anything once you’ve handed over the cash.

The previous owner, when she mentioned the garage and allotment/plot of land, should also have taken a moment to add that one was full of a neighbour's belongings and the other being tended by another neighbour (or 'dear friend') for the past 10 years! Unless her mind was going, very strange of her not to say a word about it to either you or the neighbours in question.

I'd normally suggest giving Barbara a grace period to try to find another place or at least harvest or move what she can, but her aggressive response would make me less sympathetic. If the land is legally yours, she'll have to accept that she had a good ten years there but now needs to make other arrangements (and not drag her feet in doing so).

I'm not sure Barbara is an innocent in all this and may have hoped you'd be ignorant of the allotment or not care. The previous owner is either daft or slippery. I have some sympathy for Barbara but if it's not legally hers then she has to get off the land or come to a new arrangement with you i.e. to use all or part of it, rent it from you or buy it from you. It's probably best to have a clean break - Babs may have many years left for all we know and this could turn into a long running vendetta!

Not given it. Given use of it. By her own admission according to the original post. She knows it isn't hers. There are tons of ways of dealing with it, and the fault really lies with the original owner of the house for not informing these friends that the arrangements are changing, and with the OP for not checking that everything was vacant before completion, or at least immediately after taking possession.

I wonder if the previous owner was so popular because people were taking advantage of her. Storage space (garage) for free for one neighbour and for another, a free allotment! If it was me I would be extremely annoyed at the situation. The previous owner would have known what she was selling with the property and she should have resolved the issues with the garage and the allotment before completion.