Trigger warning: How are we supposed to parent in such a world where boundaries are constantly blurred by the internet and social media? Parents of pre teens and teens. Help!

[RollingInIce]

DC is 11 (12 in May and is in the first year of secondary). He’s made some friends and everything is going well. DC thinks we are out of touch as parents and I’m beginning to feel we are losing reality with what is acceptable in this era.

DC games online with his friends. He talks on mics but they come through his tv loudly so we can hear it all. Some examples of what we hear:

Regular swearing “you’re such a fucking dickhead / prick / insert other name here”. When someone misses a point. Whatever, it’s just swearing and they’re testing boundaries, not a big deal. My DS doesn’t swear (at least not in front of us!).

Then, it goes further to “casual” homophobic comments: “you’re such a puff” .

“Casual” derogatory comments: “cock sucker”.

”Casual” references to sexual violence such as joking about rape, said in such a “funny”, casual joking way, that I’m made to feel like I’m over reacting when I tell DC enough and end the game.

This is such a common theme and it’s not just the new set of friends he has made; it was common in his primary class too. I’m fighting a losing battle because our approach to boundaries and what we allow DC to have access to, is the exception and not the “norm”. I hear these DC’s parents in the background and nothing is said, so naturally the children assume it’s ok.

DC is upset with us because we monitor his phone and screen any social media links sent to him. I think this is basic parenting. He was sent a link a few days ago to a video of a game with sexual swearing in it. Again, we are the exception in doing this and not the norm which makes me wonder if we are too uptight with this?

We sat DC down and explained that whilst the swearing is annoying but not a big deal, the fact that his friends regularly take it too far, is. I’ve explained that boundaries of sexual violence are being blurred because it’s made so casual with joking threats. I’ve explained that as a boy, it’s my responsibility to ensure he respects women and recognises that there can be serious consequences to him for even things he may perceive as a misunderstanding or a “joke”.

DC just doesn’t get it. He says we complain about every friend he has. There’s an element of truth to this , because every male friend he has acts in this way! We don’t try to control his friendships but we make it very clear what we are willing to tolerate and what we are not. We will tell other kids off for inappropriate behaviour around us. Naturally DC thinks this is embarrassing but if we say nothing, we condone it.

I am finding this very difficult to navigate. Can others share their thoughts?

You are not the exception. All reasonable parents have parental controls, have the internet used only in a public room, check phones regularly and impose restrictions like turning off the internet if a rape joke is made.

Keep going. Keep telling your child you are doing what all reasonable parents do, and it is because you love him

@tomorrowisanotherdate thank you. I may well show DC this thread.

I’m a secondary school teacher, and a parent of a year 7 DS. He also games online with his friends and we can hear what they’re all saying to each other. He doesn’t swear or shout stuff like that and neither do his friends, but (and this is where I’m going to don a hard hat) he doesn’t like football games like FIFA or fighting games like Fortnite. He plays really quite niche driving games on Roblox where they race each other, and then another game which I can’t remember the name of where they customise cars and then compete in some way.

Am going to don my hard hat again and say it’s obvious at work from student behaviour who is allowed completely unrestricted access to the internet and who isn’t. Keep firm boundaries, and monitor what he’s doing/saying. You’re doing the right thing.

I would not allow my son to speak to anyone online if this is what was happening. I am seriously shocked.

I’m a teacher and comments like this would be referred to safeguarding!! A bit of swearing maybe but not directed at each other!

That sounds exhausting and you will continue til when? 18 when he is an adult?

You need to trust him at some point....maybe spot checks?

It's going to be one hell of a battle otherwise

@Whattodo121 Do you hear this kind of stuff within school?

The games my DC plays are timid but it still happens and I don’t understand how some parents are so comfortable with it. I’m finding this very difficult to deal with because DC is pushing back (naturally) and his friends are more important than his parents.

@lilsupersparks They are friends from school, even if I were to stop him playing online, he can see them in school so that seems fruitless.

Parental controls are important and so are boundaries and no gos. Having said that I think you need to pick your battles, especially if your son feels like his choice of friends is continuously criticised for “menial” things.
Insults and derogatory talk are part of gaming culture, so he will be exposed to this even if you don’t like it. Try to keep in mind that these insults are not necessarily being used to bully and intimidate and see if you can meet him half way so he won’t feel excluded.

Also, yes i check my sons’ phones regularly. They are not allow WhatsApp groups. If I see anything that concerns me I talk to them about it.

we also had a talk about porn when they got their phones. Non negotiable. If your kid isnt
old enough to talk to about porn then they aren’t old enough to have unsupervised internet access.

I have an 11 year old and recognise what you’re seeing. It been in the last year or so the language and use of humour have deteriorated. I take the approach that he’s learning what is and isn’t acceptable so he needs clear boundaries.

The gaming devices are in a public part of the house, he knows if I hear anything sexual or phobic, he comes off immediately, and he knows why it’s not ok. We’ve had a lot of conversations about racism, homophobia etc from quite a young age so he’s always known it’s not acceptable.

Odd bits of swearing I’m not too bothered about but the level you’re describing would have him move to another game or come off completely. He’ll now say to his friends that his mum can hear them, and they’ll generally tone things down. Luckily I know most of his friends parents and know they have similar standards but even then some of the language would make you wince, and I’m far from prudish.

I think solid boundaries and very open communication (and ignoring the “no one else’s mum cares” comments) is the way to go.

But they can’t be talking to each other like that at school?

If I overheard this the phone/online gaming would be gone.

We are very very hot on calling out homophobic ‘banter’ and derogatory language between the kids. It is a constant battle to get them to speak nicely to each other. Any sexualised language is a safeguarding red flag, sometimes they repeat stuff they’ve heard without knowing what it is. swearing is completely normal as they are testing boundaries.

Swearing I’m OK with - i swear myself.

Directed insults and homophonic or rape jokes would be a deal breaker.

This

You will find that many of us take measures to keep our kids safe and make sure they are behaving appropriately, especially on line. We tend to keep quiet amongst other parents incase we're accused of helicopter parenting/invading privacy as often happens here

Your doing the right thing OP. And yes it's fucking exhausting because they are absolutely exposed to more potentially harmful influences

You need to think about what you can police and what you can't.

He will choose his friends at school. They may well talk like this. You can't stop that.

You can monitor his phone, and cut off his gaming if the conversation gets too sexually abusive. That is sensible parenting.

Telling off other kids starts to get very difficult at this stage. They aren't 4 year olds where you can assume a basic standard of manners and tell off. I'd recommend not doing that.

Quite apart from anything else they are starting to hit the age where if you try to tell them off for something they are allowed to do in their house you are going to wind up having some tricky conversations because they will argue with you and you'll either need to defend your rules or just resort to because I say so.

Our male teens will actively remove themselves from teens like this.

Yes they swear with each other, they are a little older, but they ask permission to swear in front of us and know when it is acceptable and when it is not.

As for Tate, oh they hate him and everything he stands for.

One thing that might help, because I understand the above isn't actually helpful but just wanted to point out that not all male teens accept this sort of social attitude, is letting their dad take the lead on this.

Male teens tend to respond to male adult influence more than female. If there is another grown male, sports coach, uncle, one of your friends, whom they like it would be beneficial to get them on board as well.

You can't change this overnight.

But you can put a curfew on online access, you can keep talking to them, eating together and nudging them towards making more informed choices and having that confidence.

Try by asking, so what's fun about Bob? Slipping questions in to gather information without judgement that type of thing

It's a minefield it really is.

we also had a talk about porn when they got their phones. Non negotiable. If your kid isnt
old enough to talk to about porn then they aren’t old enough to have unsupervised internet access.

Totally agree, we’ve talked about porn, how easy it is to come across stuff even if you’re not actively looking for it, attitudes towards women and girls, lad culture etc.

While in some ways it would be easier to remove access altogether, he’s going to need to be able to navigate the world he lives in and develop boundaries of his own. I’d rather put that work in now, while he still listens to me, than wait til he’s older and trying to figure it out with even stronger influences from friends etc.

You are right. Set boundaries and maintain them, so your son doesn’t turn into an aggressive boy or make nasty rape jokes constantly to girls at school.

too many young boys are raised permissively and young girls are paying the price.

well done OP.

Teenage girls internet and phone use is just as worrying.

@Coshei we let go the swearing and the insults as that’s what they do. It’s the casual references to serious sexual violence and the very inappropriate language we just can’t tolerate. Admittedly we don’t know if we should just ignore it.

It is terrifying

also the amount of attempts to get in contact with them by internet randos is ridiculous

intervene loudly:
“ We do not tolerate your language in this house”: and pull the plug.

I’m reading all of these posts and very grateful for all of your responses. I agree the telling them off is getting trickier, I’ve only resorted to this twice when rape jokes were made in the middle of a busy restaurant. (We were sat at a different table to the DC and heard it). Otherwise, I let DC get on with it. I’m still mindful of the fact that he is still only 11 so very much a child and I just do not want him to be exposed to this kind of stuff.

We’ve had the porn talk and I’ve explained how it’s acting, it’s not real life and can how it can be extreme. He’s been shown clips at school and he told me about it.

Admittedly we don’t know if we should just ignore it.

I don’t, I think ignoring it gives permission in a way. I talk to mine about it and tbh I think he’d do anything rather than explain to his mum what a cock sucker etc is (on the basis that if he/his friends are using those terms within my earshot, he must be ok to talk about it), so knowing I won’t just ignore it does curb it somewhat.

@Jellycatspyjamas yes my thoughts too. Ignoring it, tells my DC we’re ok with it.

It is such a minefield in this era of technology. I feel like parenting has gotten so much harder in this new world of anything being at your fingertips.