Birth rate hits record low - 1.49 children per woman

[MidnightPatrol]

The ONS has released its latest data on the UK birthrate.

The number of children per women has dropped from 1.55 in 2022 to 1.49 in 2022 - the lowest on record.

This is the lowest number of births in the UK since 2002 - when the population was 10 million people smaller.

Do we think this problem will inevitably worsen? Are there particular reasons people are having less children (unique to the UK vs the rest of the world?).

Should we be taking steps to increase it / stop it reducing further?

I definitely think that women are being more selective in their decision making. And in some cases, as @VenusClapTrap says, that means they land up with no children. But it's also the case that we're less likely to accept shitty men and shitty relationships simply to have children, and I think that's a good thing.

If the government wants to fix the birthrate, they're going to have to do a lot of work to fix childcare issues and the cost of living, but they're also going to have to work a whole lot harder at wholesale societal change so that we can stop penalising women and also so that we can raise a generation of men that women actually want to have children with.

surely you mean 'if we aren't having children, where are all the care workers going to come from'
It's not just the elder care sector that will be short of workers!

I'm in 2 different hobby based groups. I'm 58 and the people in both groups ( totally different activities) are all of a similar age to me. The majority of people either have no children or just I. I have 2. We're all doing, or are retired from, professional careers. I had hyperemesis in both pregnancies and had my second child very close to my first. Had I waited I'm not sure I could have faced doing it again. Of the people in the groups who have no children ( both men and women) their reasons for not having any are the same as the modern reasons quoted by PP. Wrong person, wrong time, too expensive, enjoyed the lifestyle that not paying for children enables. The ones with one child had fully intended to have more but the relationships ended and subsequent relationships didn't produce children.When I had my children ( 92 and 94) I stopped work until the youngest started at the school nursery. Everyone else I was in toddler groups with was a SAHM for the same period. All middle class professionals. DIL has just had her second baby. She took 1 years maternity with first child and is going back after a year with this one. Everything she is paid will go to pay for nursery. She reduced her hours to part time .

Most of my childfree friends who are my age (late forties/early fifties) are not childfree by choice. Some suffered infertility, but the majority did not find a partner before it was too late. They tried, but they simply could not find decent men who wanted to commit or have children.

I'm 60, so older than your friends. I'm sure you're right about most of them, but I know from my own experience that people are sympathetic if you pull a sad face and say 'I would have loved to have married and had kids, but I never found the right man.' When I've been honest and said 'I never had a maternal urge' or 'I knew from when I was a teenager that I didn't want children' many have found that challenging. A lot of mothers take the fact that I've never wanted to be a mother as some kind of personal judgment on them. I've had women say to me 'Oh, too good for motherhood, are you?'

I hope that's changed in the last 10-15 years, but I'm pretty sure it hasn't completely disappeared.

I think

And therefore you is!

Let me retire at 65, have a good 10 years (which is still less than the generation above me) and I'll pop off

DGM said that. 'Put a pillow over my face when I'm 70.' Funnily enough when she hit 70 she wasn't nearly as keen on the idea.

I'm 60, so older than your friends. I'm sure you're right about most of them, but I know from my own experience that people are sympathetic if you pull a sad face and say 'I would have loved to have married and had kids, but I never found the right man.' When I've been honest and said 'I never had a maternal urge' or 'I knew from when I was a teenager that I didn't want children' many have found that challenging. A lot of mothers take the fact that I've never wanted to be a mother as some kind of personal judgment on them. I've had women say to me 'Oh, too good for motherhood, are you?'

100% 6tthis

I'm 69, knew from a teenager that I didn't want children, and I can tell you that if you think saying you wish you'd never had your children is taboo, try saying you never wanted them in the first place, AND that you've never regretted that decision.

I think it’s changed? I have a few friends (millennials & younger) who are open about not wanting them.

Across the globe, ‘richer nations’ have lower birth rates than ‘poor nations’. And within each nation the poorest sections of society have the highest birth rates.

So, where economies grow - and in particular where education and employment opportunities improve for women - then it’s inevitable that birth rates will fall.

I think it's getting a bit more - if I can use the word - politically acceptable because of people's concerns about climate and overpopulation (ironically). But then you get the pressure from the other side about who's going to be paying your pension and looking after you in old age if you don't have children.

they're also going to have to work a whole lot harder at wholesale societal change so that we can stop penalising women and also so that we can raise a generation of men that women actually want to have children with

Hear hear

Children, (aka new workers) are of benefit to society as a whole, but it's women who bear the main cost of 'producing' and raising them.
Things will need to improve for women by orders of magnitude before being a mother is a more attractive option than investing in yourself so that you can earn a reasonable living and have an enjoyable life.
What would the salary for being a mother need to be?
Surely that's where this will have to end up if we are to prevent population collapse?
(I know this is a bit of a devils advocate stance to take)

Exactly!

The problem I can see with salaries for mothers is men turning round and saying 'it's your job, you're getting paid for it' and doing even less childcare than a lot of them (if this site is any guide) do already. And what if a mother wants to work as well?

yes, and no doubt there are other unforeseen issues, perverse incentives etc. etc.
we're doooomed (roll the 'R' if you can!)

I'd say a fair bit of the cause is also better long term contraception preventing unplanned pregnancy for young people - under 25 or so.

That's such a fucking ridiculous thing to say and isn't quite as philosophical as you may think. Nothing NEEDS to be here, including the planet. So if the angle you're going for is "humans are killing the earth so the human race is a parasite to earth", well what good is a planet without a sentient intelligent being to inhabit it? Do animals need to be here? No. Do humans need to be here? No. Does the planet need to be here? No. I hate the state of things which I'm guessing you do too by the way and the fact that evil seems to shine on our planet is abhorrent. But NOTHING needs to exist.

Let's take a second to be thankful we are conscious sentient beings with the ability to think, feel, create, and yes destroy, hurt, etc but we DO exist. And id quite like there to continue being a sentient and able being here to be able to experience the world. If we die and just fishes are left over, why is that preferable to the fishes dying and us being here? Just an example but please, good god, let's not consider ourselves worthy of extinction because we don't "need" to exist. Id argue we need to exist more than anything else because we are the apex predator 1000x more capable and able to build, experience, and appreciate this planet we have been blessed by some extremely rare and strange turn of events to exist on.

I’ve got a few friends with no kids all but one by choice
simply say there too selfish to have kids like there life ,freedom and cash

It's a great thing for the planet

Re the ageing population

My dad and my parents in law are mid to late 70s now and are all completely fit and well, independent and no drain at all on society. In fact although they are long retired they continue to contribute by volunteering in their local communities and supporting their children and grandchildren's work and education. They are very far from being candidates for the pillow and long may that continue.

I think the stats are that most healthcare costs over one's lifetime are actually accrued in the last 1-3 years whenever that may be. That is largely due to inpatient hospital stays. I reckon if I am over 75 or have a serious illness then after one hospital admission I shall decline any further ones. What I see as a Dr is people repeatedly being admitted where each episode is in itself treatable but getting frailer and frailer overall with diminished QOL. That's the bit that everyone would want to avoid. We need to get a whole lot more realistic about death and planning for death in this country.

My mum died of breast cancer in a hospice without darkening the door of the acute hospital for an inpatient stay past the time she was first diagnosed 5 years prior. I fought to keep her out especially during Covid because I knew it would just be an undignified death that she didn't want. In her final illness she would have been admitted if we'd called an ambulance and she might have been saved for a few more weeks or months of being bedbound and in pain. Had it not been during Covid I would probably have let it happen and in a way I am glad that Covid forced us to make an active decision for palliative care at home. I think that's the kind of thing that needs to happen more often.

Absolutely. We're allowed to be childfree but heaven help us if we actually say the words that must never be said aloud — that we have never regretted or doubted our decision. We're allowed to be childfree if we couldn't find the right man or were infertile or whatever. But not out of choice. That's unnatural and unwomanly : burn the witch.

And that's why any research on this subject will never reflect reality. Women will always do the 'sadly I never met the right man' number, which may well be true, but leave out the 'but I never wanted children anyway' bit.

40 years ago having one more child was no issues, mum would be at home anyway,

No. Your timing is wrong. I was working at 40 years ago. Certainly not at home.... Had another 20+ years to go till retirement.

That used to be true but, I used to not want kids and when I said that everyone bar 1 woman who's own daughter was going through fertility issues were all positive. Quite a few other women I worked with etc were openly negative about having children too - it's definitely becoming more accepted

@Abeona I see what you’re saying. I wonder whether today’s greater understanding of how parental age can affect a child’s health will eventually lead to people choosing to have their families earlier ? We’re so lucky to have effective birth control now, we can stop at one or two children if we wish.

It would certainly be interesting if the average age of parents started dropping, instead of increasing as it has been!