This “humanisation” of dogs has got ridiculous

[Houseplantmad]

Had lunch in a chain restaurant yesterday. Two couples came in with smallish dogs. No problem with that as the restaurant is dog friendly however, they insisted on having high chairs for the dogs when their meal came as they had been holding the dogs on their laps until then. The waitress refused but they went and got them anyway so we had these shoved next to our table with a restless dog breathing and being uncomfortable in the high chair very close to us.
Today I get on an intercity train and a woman boards with a medium size dog and puts it on the seat next to her across from me at a table. The person who had booked that seat then turned up and the woman said what was she supposed to do with the dog as it couldn’t go on the floor! It did but was clearly distressed and couldn’t settle, poor thing.
I think putting animals in these situations is so unfair on them and also on others but it seems to be very common these days for people to treat their animal as if it is a human.

But it does impact on people’s lives if dogs are somewhere that they shouldn’t be!

Dog owners say (rightly) that they aren’t doing anything wrong if they take dogs where they are allowed to be. Why should dogs be somewhere they aren’t allowed? It would be horrendous for someone with an allergy to have a dog sitting next to them, or even someone who is “just” phobic. I don’t mind dogs, but wouldn’t want one sitting next to me - too much potential for slobber and encroaching on space. If the rules are that they should be on the floor, that’s where they should be.

I didn’t say they should be places they shouldn't 🤔. See last paragraph of my first post 😊.

See first sentence of my previous post ☺️

I think a bigger problem in pubs is badly behaved humans. I have never seen dogs getting drunk and starting fights and puking up everywhere.

Sorry I should have been more specific. Material impact i.e. an allergy or phobia, so I think we're in agreement 😊.

Thought I would share this & maybe give you all an insight. It was on a rescue page. Not sure if the right thing to do but felt this shows why dogs are so important, remember one day you might be in her place.

Now I am going to write a post directed at older people like myself. I live on my own and have no family in this country. I have two daughters one in the Far East and the other in Canada. They are both married and lead busy lives, too busy to have much contact with me. Fortunately I have a few good friends, a lot of whom I have met because I have dogs. I am lucky enough to have three, older dogs and they are the real family for me - without them I would be really lonely. They shape my life, keeping me fit with their two walks each day in all weathers. I spend time cooking human grade food- I have read the labels on commercially produced dog food and I have carefully researched what’s best for them. I take my dogs regularly to the groomer and take her advice on how to groom them myself between appointments. My house has solid floors that won’t spoil if one of them has an accident. My girls ( that’s how I refer to my dogs) are normally in good condition but if they have a problem I have enough money put aside to pay for attention from the vet. (Stupid things happen when you have dogs, just like children, that you aren’t expecting! For example when Willow helped herself to a glittery fir-cone at Christmas and had a really bad tummy upset and needed antibiotics). Now all of this so far is what I do for my dogs but they more than repay me in what they do for me. I am never lonely and being a member of the dog walking community I have many acquaintances. This morning on my walk, I shared a chat with Sarah and her three year old daughter, Brodie and Coco, the Cockerpoo who shared a treat with my three. Further on I met Andy who had a day off work and was heading out to the beach with his two spaniels. Lastly I came across Beth with her pug and her pug cross. We discussed the progress that her two dogs are making in adjusting to each other, since Beth was obliged to take on her sister’s dog.
Now I am home and over a coffee I am thinking that maybe older people might be reading posts on this site and thinking that they are too old to take on a dog or even a couple of dogs. I just wanted to say that you are not too old because there are older dogs available that are looking for homes and they will bring joy and real love to the people who are brave enough and lucky enough to adopt them.

On the other hand, I know of a young autistic adult who used to love going out to a couple of cafes locally with their carer. They can’t do that any more as they get upset by dogs in the space. So their world has become much smaller now, since the last cafe to hold out has now caved into pressure and allowed dogs in (and before anyone says “just go somewhere else”, there are now literally no dog-free cafes in the town they live in)

It's simply a business decision based on the supply and demand principle. Britain has millions of dog owners and most of these places wouldn't be dog friendly unless it's what the customer wants surely?

It Is, but it’s a shame that there can’t be one dog-free option out of the multiple cafes. I’ve been to the cafe in question a few times and doesn’t seem to be any difference in how busy it is before and after dogs were allowed.

I have not seen drunk or puking dogs but have certainly seen fighting and loud dogs in pubs. The best pub dogs are the ones that just chill out in the corner or curled up under the table. It's the territorial dogs that bark or attempt to launch themselves at other dogs that the problem, or the owners that alow their dogs to become a trip hazard. I don't like drunk or fighting humans in pubs either but that can generally be avoided by not drinking in shitholes.

It Is, but it’s a shame that there can’t be one dog-free option out of the multiple cafes. I’ve been to the cafe in question a few times and doesn’t seem to be any difference in how busy it is before and after dogs were allowed.

Some of the people who want this option should put their money where their mouth is and set their own business up, instead of moaning and doing nothing about it.

They’re a business, they can run it how they like and most will do what is best for profits. Going in there ‘a few times’ won’t tell you much.

So you don’t think it’s sad that some people are excluded because of a lack of choice?

@ZebraPensAreLife perhaps someone could speak to one of the cafes and suggest something akin to the supermarket quiet hours. So long as it's well advertised in advance, a reasonable person won't be bothered by that.

It's another example of being a human and living in a world with other humans; all of whom have different wants and needs. Not everyone is going to be happy all of the time. I just hope there's enough people out there who are willing to be proactively inclusive and tolerant as possible.

I hope there's a suitable alternative that can be found for your friend.

So you don’t think it’s sad that some people are excluded because of a lack of choice?

I accept that it’s life. I have an autistic child, there are lots of places that she’s not comfortable in and so doesn’t go. Dogs in cafes actually make it easier for her. You’ll never suit everyone. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I wouldn't want my child eating in a high chair that a dog had previously been sat in. Sanitised or not.

I came across a post on an asthma group on FB and I’ve ended up looking through the equality act lately. Obviously it prohibits discrimination against those with protected characteristics, disability being one of them.

Under the act, disability is defined as

“A person has a disability for the purposes of the Act if he or she has a physical or mental impairment and the impairment has a substantial and long-term adverse effect on his or her ability to carry out normal day-to-day activities.”

Now there’s a very big list of impairments that result in disability but it includes…

”A disability can arise from a wide range of impairments which can be: ….

• organ specific, including respiratory conditions, such as asthma, and cardiovascular diseases, including thrombosis, stroke and heart disease”

It’s the effect of the impairment that matters. So if you have asthma that affects your day to day activities that very much counts as a disability under the act (as I understand it, even if you manage to control it with medication as the act takes into account the effect the condition has on you without medication).

Many asthmatics have attacks triggered by furry animals, including attacks so severe it’s life threatening. A severe allergy can count under the act also. For example, I came across a discrimination case where a chef had an allergic reaction to nuts and his employer wouldn’t make adjustments and the court found in his favour.

Now, as far as I understand it, businesses are supposed to make reasonable adjustments and not discriminate. Are they allowed to not bother? Can they simply shrug their shoulders and say to a wheelchair user, for example, “sorry this place isn’t for you, I’m sure you understand it’s just a business decision, supply and demand, I can’t fit in lots of customers if I allow space for you. It affects my profits. Go elsewhere.”? And then when all the other businesses are the same and there isn’t an elsewhere?

Just got on our local tram service - very busy - and see one woman has her dog on the seat next to her, even though plenty of people are standing and don't have seats. I mentioned it to staff but they've done nothing. Absolutely infuriating.

Fair point, @Thehigheroffer!

I was thinking about it purely from a business perspective. The dogs aren't spending money but they’re taking up space on a busy Saturday night. I have no objection to dogs on pubs.

It's simply a business decision based on the supply and demand principle. Britain has millions of dog owners and most of these places wouldn't be dog friendly unless it's what the customer wants surely

I am not convinced that is the reason, not always, anyway. I think some dog owners get very aggressive if their "fur babies" aren't allowed, and business owners don't want to rock the boat.

People who don't want dogs around just get squashed into smaller and smaller spaces until they have to stay at home.

I have to routinely plan my walks and runs to avoid out of control dog, especially in the summer when I am wearing shorts or sandals and feel vulnerable, I shouldn't have to. Dog owners should ensure their "fur babies" don't approach or bother other people.

I am not convinced that is the reason, not always, anyway. I think some dog owners get very aggressive if their "fur babies" aren't allowed, and business owners don't want to rock the boat.

Yes, you only need to look at some comments on local Facebook pages to see that (someone was posting on ours about some genuinely antisocial dog / owner behaviour near a school and the abuse from the “fur baby” people was astounding)

I think most normal dog owners would be fine with dogs being allowed some places, not allowed in others - it’s the owners who humanise the dogs making it difficult for people.

That behaviour is a symptom of the increasingly rude and unpleasant behaviour that is prevelant in society. I have seen threads here on MN where retail staff have told of the vile abuse they receive from many customers. It's basically a problem of human bad manners. Not dogs.

Thehigheroffer

A simple typo as I meant to say dogs.”

Even stranger comment, then: OP saw dogs in high chairs. Literally what the thread is about.

For me what is telling and some contributors have commented along the same lines is we have dog owners who seem unable to go to public places like restaurants/shops/pubs etc without taking their dog. Why has this suddenly become an issue in the last few years? People who have owned dogs in years gone by managed to leave the dog at home. I have friends who have owned dogs for decades and they still manage to leave the dog at home when they go shopping/out for food etc.

In a vast majority of these cases the dog in question isn’t a guide dog. It’s a reflection on the owner if they can’t or won’t leave their dog at home when going to restaurants/pubs etc.

Demanding a high chair for a dog is barking mad, pardon the pun. The restaurant should said no. And I speak as a dog owner.

The thing is, people with dogs are better, more regular customers than people with children in many places