Anyone still suffering lockdown fallout?

[EmmaEmerald]

I don’t want to tag any of the original people who helped me out a lot as I know this thread will attract a lot of nasty folk

but every so often I feel absolutely in shock still at how the fallout goes on.

suppose I’m seeking reassurance it won’t be like this forever but it might be, I guess.

You don't have to make it clearer.
I know!
That's the point
We had no health services,no NHS in the days of the plague, nothing
Without a functioning NHS far more would have died of covid.

A random one I have that I wouldn't obviously have had before lockdown, we are currently looking at houses and I find myself wandering what lockdown would have been like there instead of my house.

Exactly. If @HelenDamnation1 really is NHS, then God help all of us.

I don't think we will lock down again. The economic and social harms were so big.

If there is another pandemic, the government will minimise its severity to encourage people to act as normal.

The opposite to last time, when they maximised the severity.

This☝️☝️☝️ How do people not get this?!

I’ve heard this discussed on the radio and the medical professor (infectious disease specialist) said it depends entirely on what is causing the next pandemic. If it is an illness that is as nasty as Ebola for example then we might have to lock down very tightly indeed. And he seemed to think the next pandemic might not be a long way off.

Well we have been telling them the NHS is fucked for years so...

It depends on the variables not just severity of illness

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-67559629.amp

Very much so, and the biggest variable is going to be public attitudes. People who talk about needing to or having to if a future epidemic is bad enough never really address this point.

Admittedly, as an infectious disease specialist that bit isn't his remit. But the only evidence we have is that lockdown worked when most of the public supported or at least accepted it, and with a virus that wasn't dangerous enough for us to ever face any real likelihood that the shelves wouldn't stay stocked, petrol stations rub dry etc.

We had lockdown because enough people were ok with it. If we're to ever have lockdowns in the future, that will still have to be the case.

Placing a link to a poor bloke who lost three members of his family doesn't mean that statistically Covid was/is as deadly as the Black death. He was an anomaly. While we're not talking about anedata, there are loads of people (me included) who don't know anyone at all who died of or were even seriously ill with Covid. The same would definitely not be said of plague or even Spanish flu. Saying this doesn't make me a Covid denier or minimiser.

There is an official enquiry ongoing. While obviously there is every sympathy for those who suffered from the illness, if we can't remove the "Tell that to the people who lost loved ones...." retorts, how can it possibly be scientific and objective? And we also need to hear and recognise that the suffering specifically caused by the way the UK government handled of lockdown was a real thing. It cannot just be dismissed because people died.

And yes I agree with you to an extent. More would have died of Covid during the waves.

However now it seems the NHS is fucked anyway, along with lots of other things. The economy, huge numbers of people's health, their attitude to work, their social lives (and dismiss this last one at your peril), people's sense of community, their work ethic.

Placing a link to a poor bloke who lost three members of his family doesn't mean that statistically Covid was/is as deadly as the Black death. He was an anomaly. While we're not talking about anedata, there are loads of people (me included) who don't know anyone at all who died of or were even seriously ill with Covid. The same would definitely not be said of plague or even Spanish flu. Saying this doesn't make me a Covid denier or minimiser.

I'm the same as you, I don't know or really know of anyone who died of covid. The closest is a facebook acquaintence's very elderly mother with dementia who died of it in a care home. And that's literally it.

The other impacts were so much more apparent and more keenly felt, for us. DH works self-employed in an industy that was totally shut down for a long time so he knows many people who suffered extreme financial hardship, and several divorces during this time period (and we obviousy did too, fortunately minus the divorce).
He's just lost a dear friend to an alcohol-related death, and the drinking really got serious and spiralled during lockdown.

I also hated the way speaking about being affected by all of this brought about accusations of selfishness. Of course people are going to worry about themselves, their families and close friends, and what immediately effects them. Worrying about not being able to pay your mortgage and possibly losing your house was treated by some as akin to Harold Shipman.
I won't ever forget that.

I'm not suffering lockdown fallout myself. I went along with the restrictions (and they were very strict in Ireland) but thought some of them were excessive (especially the 2 km rule). Luckily, I went back to work quite quickly and I think that helped to keep things somewhat normal, even though there were rules and restrictions at work also.

I hated wearing a mask and ditched it as soon as possible.

I hated the social confinement and will happily go to the opening of an envelope now. I appreciate the open air and mountains and beaches 100% more, after having my access to them taken away. Same with foreign holidays.

I think there is lockdown fallout though. Conspiracy theories (and their supporters) skyrocketed. I think people spent too much time indoors and too much time surfing the internet. I think it made people much more polarized - vaccers vs. anti-vaccers, climate change believers vs. climate change deniers etc. It created (or maybe exacerbated) disharmony.

I think the pandemic (and the restrictions that followed) was such a seismic event that it has really unsettled people. As we can see from this thread, it has unsettled some people more than others.

Ukraine. It was also ironic that we were suddenly "nudged" to take strangers into our homes, moments after being criminalised for having our own families as house guests, with some people stillbeing pursued by the courts

YES!!! i pointed this out at the time and i also pointed out that there suddenly didnt seem to be any concern whether the people coming from Ukraine to the UK had been vaccinated. After our own care workers were threatened with loss of their jobs if they didnt!

So who would be doing the care? There aren't enough carers as it is.

I'm amazed that someone who says they have run hospital departments thinks that only the elderly died because of covid. Maybe speak to Kate Garraway who's husband was mid 50s when he got it and certainly wasn't rotting away in a care home.

I've managed a care home, none of our residents were rotting away, some were in their 20s with a whole life ahead of them.

If people running hospital departments have your attitude I don't think we need to look far to find why there is a lack of compassion.

If you are interested in what happened in counties that didn't lockdown, read about Brazil during the Pandemic.

Population density per square mile

Uk 720

Sweden 62

Brazil 63

Maybe it depends where you live. My memory of the mad shopping situation at the beginning was a young mum getting the last loaf, her little boy was holding it and showing me. I said he was a lucky boy and his mum looked at me, I'm 70s, and offered me the loaf. I told her it was fine and thanked her. Maybe it was easier in small towns. I think my local supermarket was putting limits on how much you could buy of certain things but I very quickly got a delivery slot so didn't do much shopping.

I saw neighbours having visitors, no one reported them, no problems. Two of my GC were unhappy at home, being cooped up with stepparent was difficult. They used to come and sit in my garden, I'd chat to them through the French windows and have snacks out for them. No one bothered, even the policeman nextdoor.

Maybe that is why we all seem unscathed by it.

Just remembered my other experience was being out for a walk with DH who is disabled. He was feeling unwell and we were in a local playing field without benches and he sat on a wall. Several young families playing ball with kids or walking their dogs etc. All the dads rushed towards us offering help, no-one seemed to put the risk ahead of a bit of compassion. I was touched but told them he'd be OK after a rest.

All of that and more is what I’d like put on the damage side

And weighing it up whether it was the right decision for Covid

You can only judge by pandemic as each will be different anyway. Not for ages one hopes

I don't see any conflict between those situations. It's all a balance of risks and what is possible for individuals. Clearly when people are fleeing bombing, rape and immediate danger then giving them a haven is more important than theor vaccination status. But for a HCP for whom the vaccine is readily available and chose not to take it doesnt have those far higher importance reasons going on so their vaccination status is more important.

i think my 10 year old is. Came across and video of him performing with school Christmas 2019 -‘he would not do that now. He has ASD, but his anxiety and cutting himself from others has got worse. He has struggled to catch up with school work. However, this may have happened anyway.

People were told they couldnt have their own families round and the Covid vaccine mandate caused a 40"000 exodus from social care. When people are fleeing war yes its immediate danger but we were told Covid was dangerous too and fear tactics were used. In fact £££££££££££££ was spent on those fear campaigns when it could have been spent giving more money to those in low income jobs so they could afford to self isolate. So Covid was dangerous enough to stop us seeing our families but not dangerous enough for Tories to let go of their ideology of not liking to give poor people money. And they call us anti lockdowners right wing,

You know hindsight is a wonderful thing. I hears someone I know talking about why the lockdown was well OTT and half if it wasn't necessary- thing is I well remember this same person joining in enthusiastically at the time and talking about people going 'outside the rules' - As I say we can look at decisions made with the benefit of hindsight- I won't go on about Brexit as it's different thing but given the benefit of hindsight again I'm sure there are plenty who realise now it wasn't quite what they thought. I personally don't think lockdowns per se were the issue- I think it was how they were handled- we lived in Copenhagen at the time of the 2nd lockdown- first lockdown in UK- handled differently. Felt far less chaotic- I never once for instance queued outside a supermarket - could have free tests every day if I wanted- no blooming daily updates of gloom on TV - kids being taught outside with coats on and patio heaters a fair bit - very short periods of school closures. Once bars and restaurants reopened- digital 'covid clear' app used to go in and testing every 3 days -

Speaking of free tests has reminded me On one of the mask threads i said masks should be free to everyone everywhere.

Yet some posters and one in particular sticks in my mind thought they shouldnt be. And these were posters who were FOR the restrictions. Very strange...................later on i came to realise they may be working for companies who stood to make money from the sale of them Only conclusion i could draw from that attitude really

This guy certainly is (in reply to OPs question)
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/feb/08/tenant-suing-landlord-social-housing-officer-sublet-london-home?fbclid=IwAR1i2lSzIZLiupk7tl2Q83K_N2ErtWZ8Wffw5UqmqB3D2M49Ar_mEqDrKAY