Absolutely appalled by Kenneth Eugene Smith's execution

[Haunting10]

Appalled is too soft a word. I feel physically sick and angry.

What a sick world we live in.

I am against the death penalty. One person wrongly convicted and sentenced to death is too many. This particular case sounds like torture, and to use what the Nazis used on millions, its just disturbing on so many levels.

I keep thinking about it. But what can we do? I'm in UK, and expect any activism will be happening in US.

What will happen to the state of Alabama? Surely something must be done. This was not human.

Because that’s the impression you gave when you asked. So really you can’t answer the question at all, just wanted to look like you could.

exactly. it’s a whole other viewpoint when you’ve lost someone/nearly lost someone to a violent crime. eye for an eye all the way.

Every single one of them was paid to do it, planned to do it, talked about doing it, and had no compunctions about murdering an innocent person/people, and/or attempting to murder and seriously injuring innocent people whilst knowing it was wrong.
'The Yorkshire Ripper' is another one who pleaded mental health issues, although psychiatrists said he was for to stand trial.
If people are considered fit to live in society amongst us and we have to take our chances with that, then they are fit to stand trial and face the consequences. If their mental health status makes them a danger they should not be free in society. And if we had a death penalty and they murder people they should face it like anyone else. Your argument appears to be that they have a very serious mental illness which causes them to murder people and we should accept that, have them live amongst us under no restriction and then they face no consequence for taking innocent lives. If they are considered capable of living freely in society then they face the same consequences for serious crime as anyone else in society. The alternative is, we face that risk of murder by them, they face no legal punishment for murder and we pay to maintain them in a psychiatric hospital for life. I think that's ludicrous actually.

I have no sympathy I'm afraid. I do think that 30 years on death row is ludicrous. I'm not in favour of the death penalty. However, if someone murdered a close member of my family, I would absolutely want to be able to choose their punishment, and I would almost certainly wish to inflict it upon them myself.

@LuluBlakey1 What do you think psychiatric hospitals are like? I work in one and most of them are not nice places. Patients are very very restricted inside them, for their own safety-and in forensic hospitals even more so. Most inmates are far freer inside the prison system; within prison, inmates are able to work to earn money and/or access education and entertainment, most of which isn’t possible within a psych hospital and, as a result, very few criminals try to get admitted to a psych hospital deliberately. They’re really not a “cushy ride”.

I do not agree with the death penalty in any circumstances and this was absolutely horrific

How I would feel I can’t answer but the justice system can not be based on victim’s emotions but that doesn’t mean I can’t feel deep sympathy for families

Prison, mental hospital- wherever they end up is a life lived, paid for, no responsibilities-yet their innocent victims lost their lives. Why should ordinary, innocent people, living their lives without harm to anyone be put at risk of murder and serious injury by these people who have really dangerous conditions and are roaming the streets whatever state they are in, mainly unmonitored and free to do as they wish? At the moment they are returned to a hospital for treatment. I think if they are considered fit to be part of society they should face the consequence that anyone else in that society faces if they commit murder/serious sexual assault/ terrorism - and if that consequence is the death penalty then that's what they should face. If your argument is they should not face that because they are mentally ill and unfit to accept culpability- then they shouldn't be on the streets and in society putting us at risk.
Hundreds of women, hundreds, have been murdered by paranoid schizophrenic men in the last 15 years, men who have been deemed by medics to be competent to live freely in society, men who are often the woman's son, partner or brother. They are then returned to their mental hospital too 'unwell' to be culpable. It's entirely wrong.

He wouldn’t ever leave prison. When I say rehabilitation I mean work within the prison system

😂

Sure and that's understandable for victims to feel like that but that doesn't at all change that seeking punishment doesnt benefit society really and the justice system shouldn't be about revenge but should be about rehabilitation and protection of the public. Victims are understandably not best places to remove the high emotion from justice in this way and that's understandable, but the average person not associated with the crime should be able to. I don't think the desire for revenge is a positive nor productive emotion in society, despite it being an understandable personal emotion to experience.

Yep this. I hope he suffered in his last moments, the scummy murdering bastard. But it's still less than she suffered at his hands. He got 35 years more of being able to talk to, hug, see his family than she did.

I don’t personally agree with the death penalty but I don’t understand when people want mass change that doesn’t affect them in other countries. If you don’t like the death penalty don’t go live in a US state that allows them. Leave the Americans to it.

Incidentally I just googled this man. He stabbed a woman to death. For just $1000. There’s many people I feel sorry for but I’m afraid this man doesn’t make the cut

The state to be fair are not choosing people off the street and knocking them off

We all only have one life so why should someone cut yours short but be able to live theirs?

Wonder why they don't use a large dose of Fentanyl as they say it's a peaceful way to pass out and die.

I think the fact that this was the US informs many of the posts on here defending the actions though

I think if this particular method of execution had happened in, for example, a majority Muslim country, some of the responses on the thread would have been different

Somehow the fact that it's a majority white country where this has happened appears to have given death by torture a veneer of legitimacy that would be lacking in some other countries

The same holds true for posters advocating for beheadings, I wonder if they are as quick to defend Saudi Arabia when they behead their prisoners?

To clear a few things up...

I think he's a despicable violent criminal. I very much feel sympathy for the victim and her sons and think he brutally murdered her. I think his death (state torture imo) was also despicable. Like a PP said, his crime and his punishment are both abhorrent and these thoughts aren't mutually exclusive. I am capable of having multiple thoughts that clearly appear conflicting (to others) simultaneously. I think all these things are true at one time.

This isn't about me feeling sorry for him. I'm angry that the state have tortured someone to death. That is a very slippery slope. It seems revenge-seeking, emotional, blood thirsty.

My interest and care doesn't end with the UK. I care about the humanitarian crisis in Gaza and the war in Ukraine, amongst other things. I don't just stop taking an interest if things aren't happening on my doorstep. This means I happen to care that the US state of Alabama have used a human as a guinea pig and tortured them to death, with staff left traumatised, what will be next? Will the next person 'deserve it' as much as most of you think he does? They've got it wrong over 170 times, and that's only the people we know of. Will they start chopping off the hands of thieves? Slippery slope all the way back to the stone ages.

If we are saying that killing people is wrong, how can an individual justify killing in self defence or to protect a loved one?

It's all about context.

By the same token, if someone close to you murdered someone, you'd change your mind too, @Naptrappedmummy

I strongly disagree with this. We're much more indifferent to barbaric things happening in other countries. Imagine the outrage if UK women started being publicly whipped for dressing 'immodestly'!

For those of you who don’t understand the issue, the gas used is so brutal and has so many potentially awful outcomes that it is barely even used on animals because it’s deemed too risky and too inhumane. The potential risks include choking to death on your own vomit and surviving but in a vegetative state. Using it on a person has been compared to torture and human experimentation, which is is both. This man was used as a guinea pig as nobody was certain what would happen when he was executed in this way. It took him over 20 minutes to die, the whole time violently shaking, convicting, retching and gasping for breath. It was absolutely barbaric. Yes, he is a murderer - or at least was an accomplice who was there when a woman was murdered, depending on whether you believe his version of events. But don’t we as a society have a responsibility to be better and more humane than murderers? If we think it’s okay for them to be treated like this then we are absolutely no better than them.

• convulsing, not convicting. Also sorry, my paragraphs seem to have disappeared when I posted.

There is an indifference here when it comes to america and violence as it is such a violent and dangerous place. Here another school shooting there is seen as, "well, that's par for the course". 95% of schools there have active shooter drills (children from the age of 5 practice huddling in silence from an imaginary gunman), unthinkable here. Over 40k die annually there via a firearm. With so much death it seems fitting the state also kills people via the death penalty.

I used to be critical of cops there in being too trigger happy, but now I see they have no chance of reacting sensibly what with everyone being armed to the teeth. There are more guns there than people so naturally a cop is infinitely more fearful of their life being ended... a routine traffic stop here is a totally different proposition there. Videos of such incidents (with an advisory warning) are uploaded to Youtube on a regular basis. Its chilling, but it's the norm there.

How It Feels To Kill 62 People – ThinkProgress

The death penalty is often justified on the grounds that it brings peace to the families of victims; that the act of ending a life may mark an end to their pain. But for those who impose the death penalty, the truth about the emotional trauma of killing another human being belies this logic.
“You can’t tell me I can take the life of people and go home and be normal. If I had known what I’d have to go through as an executioner, I wouldn’t have done it. It took a lot out of me to do it.”
These are the words of Jerry Givens, former state executioner for the Virginia Department of Corrections. Givens executed 62 people over 17 years in a state that ranks third in the nation for number of executions. The emotional toll of his former job is something he can’t escape. “You have to transform yourself into that person that will take a life. Every time an execution was announced, it meant that I had to prepare myself mentally to kill.”

What It's Like to Be a Death Row Executioner in America (vice.com)

I don't disagree with what has happened in Alabama tbh. I don't think the man deserves to live with the crime he committed. Plus the costs involved in lifelong imprisoment runs in to the millions of dollars. To be frank - I agree with the death penalty in this case. Controversial opinion, but its mine FWIW.

Have said that - why can't they use penbarbitol on people? Its how they euthanise animals and seems very peaceful and quick.