New Research suggest Prep machines NOT safe

[TheLastParty]

www.swansea.ac.uk/press-office/news-events/news/2023/10/study-raises-concerns-over-powdered-infant-formula-preparation-machines.php

This isn't new in a way - First Steps Nutrition had shown in their experiments that the machines weren't making the formula powder hot enough.

This research has brilliantly shown that the same thing is happening in the real world, on most occasions, which is really important information.

Families all assess risk as they see fit, but they need accurate information to do that, and I suspect most families using the machines weren't taking a calculated risk, they believed it was safe. (I've seen lots a people say it was safe because they replaced the filter etc, because they just couldn't get their head round the idea that the basic product is so flawed yet still sold)

Yes, this information has been shared many times, but the response is usually to ignore, never did me any harm mentality.

The "it never did me any harm" mentality is basically saying "my child didn't die".

It ignores the fact that a) those people followed what they thought was safe at the time - which is just what new mums are trying to do and b) there are plenty of consequences/benefits between "no harm" and "death" - which applies to things like weight problems, infections, poor emotional development etc.

Basically it's the first resort of the stubborn in defending themselves against an attack that isn't even happening.

@thecatsthecats but what does a prep machine have to do with poor emotional development? Just curious about how you find that connection?

It's one of those things that was so obvious that the research wasn't necessary.

We used one with DC1, clear as day that shot of hot water is not enough to sterilise the powder added. It also made him very gassy - so lovely idea in theory, terrible in practice. Im glad to see it's not so widely recommended as 7 years ago.

I always thought this was common sense when formula instructions clearly say to use boiled water. There's no way there prep machines get the water hot enough.

I think so long as you test the temp of the water at regular intervals - as the research suggests and which is sensible - it's fine.

Is the suggestion that the water is at perfect bacteria breeding temp, when mixed with the formula?

I lived in Asia 25 years ago, and people there used room temperature water and gave room temp bottles. There were lots of Australians and kiwis doing the same.

I always find it horrifying that formula powder is so prone to growing bacteria that it needs sterilising in the first place.

I've just had a quick glance through the full report. It's a shame they haven't done any analysis on the differences between the 85% that didn't meet the 70c and those that did. Was it just chance for example? Is there any correlation (brand, model, age etc) in the ones that did get hot enough etc? Does the temp of the water in the tank to start with make a difference? I will go back and read in more detail tonight to see if i missed anything.

They also excluded ones that mix the formula inside the machine and dispense formula made up (rather than the hotshot perfect prep type) so i wonder if these have similar issues internally as well? Although obviously more difficult to measure in an experiment of this type.

I'm a bit confused by the recommendation of collection of data to link usage to serious gastro hospitalisations. If this isn't already being done, how do they know the prep machine is the cause?

Formula is such a faff. DD is mix fed, I am rubbish at breastfeeding so have to express for her but I can never quite keep up with her so usually the last feed and overnight feed are formula. We do have a prep machine, and DD has had a bad tummy lately so hope that’s not why. That being said ds was always fine with it (he was fully formula fed by 3 months. We are not very good at breastfeeding )

Don't know why everyone's talking about this, when I had my first over 2 years ago it was common knowledge then, nothing has changed!

I don’t think it is common knowledge - everyone uses them. It’s possible that they might be using them in full knowledge that there are safety concerns but I don’t think they are.

I suspect a lot of people don't feel able to cope with the recommendations for safe formula prep when also expected to feed bottles on demand. With that sort of situation it's a choice between taking on a lot of anxiety or sticking your fingers in your ears at least partly when given advice.

Very difficult to formula feed with all you have to prepare, time and how long you can keep it etc when you have no idea when a baby will want feeding and then the cost element of wasted milk

I just made up bottles with half boiling water and half boiled chilled water. My friend showed me her prep machine 10 yes ago and I thought that can't be right. I had developed a germ phobia (milk based) so I just thought I was being paranoid.

I ended up buying a hot water dispenser for £60 on Amazon. Always set at 70°c. So knew I'd always have perfect temp water. You can't always guarantee it's going to be dead on 30 mins since you boiled the kettle 😁

I think it's a balance of risk. Did I trust that I would always make every bottle perfectly and safely with a kettle including when the baby was screaming for a bottle immediately/it was the middle of the night/I was hugely sleep deprived? No. A well-maintained and checked perfect prep machine seemed like a better alternative to me.

I was meaning more generically about anything that older generations trot out as "didn't do any harm", e.g. spanking.

It really isn't. You can make up 6 bottles at a time and store in the fridge. Bottle fed babies tend to feed to a schedule, every three or four hours, so easy to know how many, and when you need them.

That's not the info I was given with mine. It was to make every feed fresh with boiling water (didn't get a consistent message about the 30 min wait), cool down and also to feed the baby on demand. Obviously it can never really be on demand if it takes a while to make a bottle.

knit pre-making bottles has not been recommended as safe for over 17yrs now. The NHS said bottles should be made fresh as you go when DS was born. Obviously this is hugely impractical with shattered parents and a crying baby. I ended up using pre-made formula.
It's all a balance of risk anyway. I'd probably be a better parent if I was more chilled and less risk averse.

@megletthesecond

iris.who.int/bitstream/handle/10665/43659/9789241595414_eng.pdf?sequence=1

WHO guidance re:making formula does advise that pre making formula, flash cooling and storing in the fridge for no more than 24hrs is safe.

The NHS probably don't tell ppl this as lots can't be trusted to do it correctly.