I earn £81,000…

[Sueretiredawhileago]

And (although clearly I am not on the breadline and understand how lucky I am compared to others) I have very little spare money. I am a single (co) parent and I live in London so mortgage is a lot. I used to have loads spare and felt ‘well off’ but now I’ve had to cut down on all the little spending I once never gave a thought to. No quick coffees, pastries for breakfast, no brunches, no magazines, new lipsticks etc etc.

If I can’t afford these things I don’t understand how ‘they’ keep saying that consumer spending is still strong and driving inflation. Who the hell has the spare money??!!!

That’s great. Also - as a basic rate tax payer you’ll be one of the 54.2% of adults taking from society as per the ONS. It is op and people like her keeping the country afloat. Higher rate tax payers are the only ones who have a net contribution. Everyone move of London for basic rate jobs is just beyond economic illiteracy.

How can someone on, say, £49k without any kids not be a financial contributor - they would get no form of financial support 'back' from the government and would only be putting in? Surely that's the definition of a net contributor?

Not over all no. Basic rate doesn’t cover NHS, future pension, public services and all the rest of it. As has been said on this and other threads. The unpalatable truth is that basic tax here, is some of the lowest in the world. It doesn’t cover what people take out. To sort out the huge mess in this country everyone needs to pay more in. Which is why we are now in this mess the ONS are waving red flags at. A huge state dependency. Telling higher rate tax payers to downgrade to elsewhere (likely huge drop in salary) demonstrates the whole economic illiteracy which has led to this shit show. People vote for what they can get without a though if where it’s all coming from.

Facts are higher rate tax payers are being squeezed hugely; telling them to downgrade and pay less will increase the burden on the minority and around we go. Absolute insanity.

@Princessandthepea0 I'm not criticising OP but the cost of living and disparity between the different regions in the U.K. Neither me nor OP are the people who dictate what wages or taxes are paid or what the cost of living is.

And tax rates now are lower than they used to be, that was my point. I think the higher rate was higher than it is now as well, although I’m not as confident on that.

As a general principle, though, since we need to levy taxes in order to fund public expenditure, should it come equally from everybody, or in proportion to income? I think the answer is obvious, but perhaps you disagree.

I sympathise op. I know people on more who are finding things tough what with their mortgages on very modest homes going up by £1k+ a month.

I don’t disagree - however we have now hit marginal rates of 70% to 100%. In op’s case if she gets to 100k she’ll be worse off because of all the pit falls. She will take home less than now with no childcare or personal allowance. Our higher tax payers alongside NI and withdrawal of perks have some of the highest tax rates in the world.

Make it so that people stop paying in because of obscene tax - everyone is worse off. That’s happening now. People on good salaries are feeling worse off and are changing economic behaviour. People expect those on higher salaries to suck it up and keep paying for over half the population to take out. That is a problem and will benefit no-one. The people of this country are short sighted because of short termist politics.

I don't understand what you mean. What do you mean please explain?

I don't get the relevance of your post.

And what a fucking hero the op is .

Most of people are full of shit as as soon as there is a increase to the minimum wage the higher earners are complaining about threats of inflation ect whilst ignoring those on lots smaller wage than them.

I understand @Againstmachine now. Our economy has shrunk we are fucked because arseholes voted to leave Europe. Now everything is going up. House prices maybe going down but you have to pay through the nose to keep it. Before 2008 mortgage rates were at 6% and now it has gone back. Unless we return back to Europe it won't get better. On our own the rest of the world don't trust us because of our rotten history. We have cut our nose to spite our face.

@Princessandthepea0

I don’t disagree - however we have now hit marginal rates of 70% to 100%. In op’s case if she gets to 100k she’ll be worse off because of all the pit falls. She will take home less than now with no childcare or personal allowance. Our higher tax payers alongside NI and withdrawal of perks have some of the highest tax rates in the world.

Ah, now I freely admit this is a world with which I’m not familiar. I have never been a higher rate taxpayer - I was close to it, but my pension contributions kept me just below the threshold, and then I changed career, and that was the end of that. And the whole tax credits, childcare allowance and all that is beyond me as well - I’ve never claimed any of the aforementioned. Not having children, I just assumed I needed to pay my way, and as far as I’m aware, I have.

What confuses me though is that the super wealthy with their trust funds and offshore accounts appear to pay very little tax (proportionally). So is OP just in an unfortunate middle band - earning enough to be taxed heavily, but not wealthy enough to avoid tax?

Regarding basic rate tax payers not contributing enough….. surely the issue there is that heir income isn’t enough to enable them to pay more tax while still affording to live. Incomes at the bottom end are too low.

I agree with your sentiment.

We are on good money and a double income but have noticed our money does not go as far as it did.

I think London spending is a bubble. My husband was on business and they ran up a £750 on drinks for schmoozing clients on his company card this week on a Tuesday night.

Our local city centre in a Friday afternoon is pretty quiet/bleak.

Why do we need these comments on these threads? Can’t women support other women without this pettiness?

I earned more than op in London as a single mum. I worked long hours in the city and had a commute and was renting and paying a nanny (had to due to working hours). I realized after discussion with a family member that I would not be much worse off on benefits. That’s incredibly depressing when you’re working such long hours away from young kids.

of course there are long term benefits to a career but it’s tough being a single mum. London also used to have such high rents and childcare costs that you need to earn a huge amount as a single parent to actually be any better off.

So… you don’t have a mortgage or pay rent currently? If so, good for you. But that’s why you are managing on a lower salary.

but OP and many of us are not at that stage in our lives yet. And still have to pay rent / mortgage.

Oh - I think I’m you OP!

More or less fine financially but life is not perfect as I have health issues. For the best there's no mortgage or rent payments to worry about.

You can get it okay one way in life but not the other. I can assure you that there's no smugness from myself according to another poster🤷🏻 Others have money worries but are in great health.

There are marginal rates and bottlenecks to be found lower down the income scale too, usually involving the intersection of wages and benefits although not always. The UC taper rate is 55%, for example. The UK system is a bugger for it. We tax income, especially from work, more than we do capital.

We tax income, especially from work, more than we do capital.

We basically don’t tax capital at all, do we? Capital gains tax if you sell something, and the annual allowance for that is nearly double that for income.

They were full to the rafters inside too hence mybusr of the word overspilling and many outside were not smoking. We went to about 6 before we found one quasi quiet enough to get to the bar!

Yep exactly this. I earn the same as the OP, also single parent, also in London. I did one of those salary calculators and 2 people each earning 40k would be over £600 a month better off including child benefit than a single person earning £80k.

I'm on a low fixed rate which ends in April. Dreading it.

I no dint really get why you're feeling the pinch more than anyone else. Cost of living, food gone up, but wages haven't affects us all. But everyone people are out spending. We are going to London today to see Spurs, managed to finally get 4 tickets, can't wait!

London is also a tourist hotspot, if I go to London or New York or Paris I expect it to be busy. A colleague of mine recently had a weekend break in London, took in a show stayed in a hotel and ate lunch and dinner out both days. Some of those people are on holiday. I do not live in a tourist hotspot, I grew up in one and it was heaving in many places when I went back home in the Summer.

It was hard moving away from my friends but it wasn't sustainable anymore, plus they're still my friends and I also have new ones!

Where you live is the critical factor. There are so many property 'bubbles' in London and SE where prices are insane.

I live in Essex and my mortgage on a 3 bed house is about 40% cheaper than my colleague who lives in a 1 bed flat in London. We're definitely tightening our belts compared to a couple of years ago, but not critically so. If we lived in London we'd be struggling.