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Original poster

How many syllables in the word "world"?

167 replies

LaPerduta · 30/07/2023 10:21

Inspired by another thread, I'm interested in words which are pronounced differently in different accents by native English speakers in the UK and Ireland.

I only realised recently that some people pronounce "none" the same as "non", rather than "nun".

In Scotland some people pronounce "pattern" as "pattron". Iron is "eye-ron" rather than "eye-un".

There must be many more...

OP posts:
becarefulofyourheart · 31/07/2023 01:10

Three!

we do roll our arse to some tune though.

echt · 31/07/2023 01:13

One pronunciation that's crept in over the years, and it's not dialect-based, is two syllables for child/mild/wild, so chi-uld/mi-uld/wi-uld. The u sound is a schwa, not a full u sound. The second syllable is softened but still detectable.

I hear it in audiobooks all the time and find it irritating. As an ex-English teacher I know language isn't monolithic, but this one grates. I don't hear it in RL.

echt · 31/07/2023 01:15

While I'm here, is there a part of the UK where "grown" is pronounced "growen"?

I hear it occasionally, usually older Australians, and never heard it in the UK either in RL or on radio/TV.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

General education
Gadolinite · 31/07/2023 01:15

It’s a diphthong

Original poster
LaPerduta · 31/07/2023 02:45

becarefulofyourheart · 31/07/2023 01:10

Three!

we do roll our arse to some tune though.

You do what? 🤔

OP posts:
WhenIWasAFieldMyself · 31/07/2023 07:15

Quoria · 30/07/2023 21:30

Are you a linguist or was this for another field, say linked to phonics or similar? It seems very focused on one accent or set of accents. World is always rhotic in Scotland, but in areas like the Borders generally has one syllable, whereas in others like the west it has two distinct syllables, each with a vowel sound. Syllables aren't to do with the spelling of a word. Coin definitely does have two syllables in some Scottish accents - coy-un. If you are a linguist, I'd be interested in your take on this.

Agreeing with the pp that there is no more a single Scottish accent than a single English one!

Show quote history

Training teachers to teach phonetics and phonology. (though have woken up with a banging sore throat so that will be fun this afternoon)

I think the confusion on the thread is that lots of posters are talking about Scottish English pronunciation, yes. I also agree that people get confused with what syllabification is.

I came across various notes on the whole acoustic influence of rhotic R in hiberno (and other- it was Spanish and Italian speakers I was reading about) accents yesterday while I was preparing for today (and dipping into this thread) I'd still say the R being pronounced leads to what seems, acoustically to be an extra syllable, but is just the lengthening of the one you've got, due to the physical micromovement necessary within the mouth (to get to the L) once the R has been articulated if that makes sense. There is an extra NOISE there, but it's not really a vowel sound (not even a schwa) so it's not a whole extra syllable.

Quoria · 31/07/2023 07:31

WhenIWasAFieldMyself · 31/07/2023 07:15

Training teachers to teach phonetics and phonology. (though have woken up with a banging sore throat so that will be fun this afternoon)

I think the confusion on the thread is that lots of posters are talking about Scottish English pronunciation, yes. I also agree that people get confused with what syllabification is.

I came across various notes on the whole acoustic influence of rhotic R in hiberno (and other- it was Spanish and Italian speakers I was reading about) accents yesterday while I was preparing for today (and dipping into this thread) I'd still say the R being pronounced leads to what seems, acoustically to be an extra syllable, but is just the lengthening of the one you've got, due to the physical micromovement necessary within the mouth (to get to the L) once the R has been articulated if that makes sense. There is an extra NOISE there, but it's not really a vowel sound (not even a schwa) so it's not a whole extra syllable.

Show quote history

Very interesting. I thought the second syllable has a schwa but I'm willing to believe otherwise! Good luck with your lecture today.

HunterHearstHelmsley · 31/07/2023 07:54

echt · 31/07/2023 01:15

While I'm here, is there a part of the UK where "grown" is pronounced "growen"?

I hear it occasionally, usually older Australians, and never heard it in the UK either in RL or on radio/TV.

I'm Black Country and hear that quite often.

Oldnproud · 31/07/2023 07:56

Runnersandtoms · 30/07/2023 22:40

That's nothing like the word I know. My pronunciation would be more like poe-im. Where does the y come in????

Show quote history

Where I grew up, I only remember ever hearing poem pronounced as poym, with the oe sounding like the oy in boy. In other words, as just one syllable.

Poetry was poytry.
In fact, on reflection, it was probably poy-treh, as a final y tended to be pronounced as eh in that region.

I left that area at 18, and don't say it like that any more.

HunterHearstHelmsley · 31/07/2023 07:58

saraclara · 30/07/2023 21:32

Non and none are identical when I say them.
I'm aware that some people say nun, but I just assume that they're posh!

It's like when I hear someone say room and it sounds more like rum. Definitely posh!

tabulahrasa · 31/07/2023 07:58

WhenIWasAFieldMyself · 31/07/2023 07:15

Training teachers to teach phonetics and phonology. (though have woken up with a banging sore throat so that will be fun this afternoon)

I think the confusion on the thread is that lots of posters are talking about Scottish English pronunciation, yes. I also agree that people get confused with what syllabification is.

I came across various notes on the whole acoustic influence of rhotic R in hiberno (and other- it was Spanish and Italian speakers I was reading about) accents yesterday while I was preparing for today (and dipping into this thread) I'd still say the R being pronounced leads to what seems, acoustically to be an extra syllable, but is just the lengthening of the one you've got, due to the physical micromovement necessary within the mouth (to get to the L) once the R has been articulated if that makes sense. There is an extra NOISE there, but it's not really a vowel sound (not even a schwa) so it's not a whole extra syllable.

Show quote history

Except... it’s not just an r that has a svarabhakti vowel added, nobody is rolling an r in film.

It mirrors the vowel insertion that happens in Gaelic.

It is a whole extra vowel being added, and is separate from rolling an r.

HunterHearstHelmsley · 31/07/2023 08:02

Iwasjustasking · 30/07/2023 22:26

black country here, none definitely is the same as non but we also say mom not mum! I pronounce shoes with two syllables (shoe-es) say day instead of didn’t (I day go there) and say doe instead of don’t! Common as muck me!!!

Man, I've just said shoes out loud and it's two syllables! I can't believe I've never noticed that before! One of my school friends used to pronounce "school" as two syllables and it did my head in. Seems I do it too!

Eddyraisins · 31/07/2023 08:49

I did not realise it was a thing to pronounce none as in a nun.

Learn something new and all that.

New?

N uw or noo?

SavvyMaria · 31/07/2023 09:09

Eddyraisins · 31/07/2023 08:49

I did not realise it was a thing to pronounce none as in a nun.

Learn something new and all that.

New?

N uw or noo?

I'm the opposite - it's completely odd to not pronounce none as nun. Non sounds totally different.

But it's the rum and room thing! They definitely don't sound the same?

When I say paw, poor or pour they all sound entirely different. It's very strange to me that in some English accents they all sound the same.

SwedishEdith · 31/07/2023 09:43

echt · 31/07/2023 01:13

One pronunciation that's crept in over the years, and it's not dialect-based, is two syllables for child/mild/wild, so chi-uld/mi-uld/wi-uld. The u sound is a schwa, not a full u sound. The second syllable is softened but still detectable.

I hear it in audiobooks all the time and find it irritating. As an ex-English teacher I know language isn't monolithic, but this one grates. I don't hear it in RL.

I think I might do that. But if I try to child/mild/wild as one syllable I sound like the queen in the 1950s. I just can't make my mouth do it.

WhenIWasAFieldMyself · 31/07/2023 10:38

tabulahrasa · 31/07/2023 07:58

Except... it’s not just an r that has a svarabhakti vowel added, nobody is rolling an r in film.

It mirrors the vowel insertion that happens in Gaelic.

It is a whole extra vowel being added, and is separate from rolling an r.

Show quote history

Yes, I was talking about the belief that "world" has 2 syllables because of the R.

Dark L has a related, but different effect on syllables.

Watercoloursky · 31/07/2023 11:10

JockTamsonsBairns · 31/07/2023 00:20

This is interesting. My DH and two younger (teen) DCs are from the SE of England, and their pronunciation of 'towel' only has one syllable - so, "tahl".
For me, it's definitely two - tow-wel.

Glad to know my pronunciation is correct! 😂

Show quote history

For me, towel rhymes with owl... not quite two separate syllables, but not one sound either, as you have to move your mouth to do the 'w'.

Your comment about how your DH and DC say it, though, has made me smile as it brings back fond memories of a very posh friend at uni who pronounced 'power shower' as 'pahh shahhh'. He was the loveliest person, so please take that memory as an affectionate one, not mocking people who speak like your family!

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