Forced return to office - anyone else?

[Flexipecs]

My work has announced we’re all being forced back into the office two days a week. I’m a sole parent of primary school aged children (no help from ex). If I’m forced to go into the office I’ll have to reduce my working hours and I’ll be financially worse off.

I’m going to contact my union but has anyone else had this problem and did you successfully challenge it?

There’s zero benefit to me being in the office. My stats and performance are high. I actually think I’m more productive at home because I’m not being distracted so often. I’ve worked for the company for a very long time and I’m really disappointed at this decision (to put it mildly).

I also eye roll whenever anyone asked what I did before covid.
I paid a child minder for pre school care as Dh and I left the house at 7am. 90 min commute each way. 4 days a week (I work compressed). Home just after 7pm. Come Friday I was knackered.

In lockdown I used the time to lose 4st and get myself together. Dd happier. Me happier. Environment happier as not driving!

We now have to do 2 days so not as bad but on those days I feel the different.

I couldn't go back to 4 days.

I also take all my food etc so I contribute nothing to the economy. Just go to work to sit at desk and come home!

End of the day your contract hasn't changed. Luckily one benefit from the pandemic is more flexible working otherwise we would all still be doing 5days a week.

We are back 3 days a week, cue all the moaning well there are options ppl have right

1. go find a job that lets you work from home 5 days a week

2. put in a formal flexible working request...risk u might not get it

3. be thankful its just 2 days and make it work

In our company yrs ago it was come back 2 days a week but hardly anyone did barely even one day...and also yes its harder to get hold of ppl cos they are off doing their post office drops etc. Also its been noticed there is less collaboration, innovation and creative ideas and so on.

So the few ppl split it for everyone and now its 3 days

But hey ill still take 3 days over 5 anytime, although come winter ill be going in 5 days to save hearing my home, saved a ton of money last winter.

Thing is if permanent FT WFH was better for business, don't you think the capitalist bastards would be all over it? Because way cheaper for them, right? You pay your own electricity, heating and broadband, buy your own office furniture and drink your own coffee.

Joking apart, I think some individuals are personally more productive wfh, but that's because they're not doing some of the work they used to do that increases overall productivity. WFH benefits established mid-career workers (esp those not overly bothered about near term progression) but isn't great for bringing on juniors who learn a lot by osmosis (overhearing conversations etc). Everyone gets very silo'ed. DH and I were saying the other day that we still feel quite bad about the graduates that started during covid or just after as it was shit for them vs people who started in the office. It was really easy for them just to get forgotten about whereas when you're all in the office they'd naturally get pulled into meetings etc. Yes sure there are formal training programmes in place etc but they still lose the ad hoc learnings that come from a manager swivelling their chair round and saying " I could do with a couple of hours help on this spreadsheet" and sitting there doing it together. It's also much easier to gauge how someone is really getting on when you physically see them. You can tell if they're feeling overwhelmed or just don't understand what you asked.

I used to work less hours before lockdown. I increased them because I wasn’t having to travel for work and the school is very close to where we live.

Haven't RTFT so sorry if someone has already suggested this. Could you speak to your manager and explain that WFH is the only way that you can continue working your increased hours -so is at all possible to continue with the current set-up?

You're not reverting to your pre-pandemic work situation, you’re in a different one.

we have a policy of three days a week in the office but I am flexible with my team and only really insist that everyone comes in once every six weeks so we see each other face to face.

I think it’s important to attend the office otherwise you lose that connection and it really isn’t the same.
I know a lot of people who resist coming back because it’s so expensive and I absolutely get that. It’s a sad state of affairs that we cannot afford to commute or cover childcare in todays economy.

I agree that generally those working at home are more productive than when they were in the office.

However, in my experience, this I is because they are not disturbed as often as those that are in the office. People inevitably ask questions of those who are in the building rather than picking up the phone or calling in teams.

Work places should be flexible or will lose staff. Hate presenteeism …wfh works well if the job gets done that’s all that matters. The world has changed now since covid no point harping back that was then this is now. Lot of tosh being posted on here by some 😀trying to justify hauling people back in! It’s the way forward allowing people to wfh

When capitalism kicked off, that’s when they introduced factories and managers, so they could keep an eye on the workers. It was resisted back in the day so they had to force it by stealing land so that workers couldn’t be self sufficient (yes, really)!

So in many ways capitalism is a fucking con. It traps us in work, keeps enough of us relatively well paid so that we outweigh those in poverty and don’t make a fuss. That’s why having a middle class is important - it’s a buffer between the very rich and very poor to stop us kicking off about capitalism.

Also costs are more and more expensive now to travel so who in their right mind is going the shell out ££ and waste several hours commuting when there is no need. …

OP, you have to fit in with what the business requires - the company doesn't exist to make life easier for you. Everyone has outlined all the reasons why it's better for staff to be in the office, so you just need to get yourself organised and pay for proper childcare. If you don't want the job, then leave - but don't expect other companies to bend over backwards to accommodate your specific needs.

but why does business come first? Look at the state of the economy? Maybe it’s time to change that.

And yes there is a manpower crisis but if the job can be done from home then arguably it can be done from home anywhere in the world and there are a lot of places in the world with lower salaries than UK. So I wouldn't necessarily see employers being committed to WFH as a huge act of benevolence/ modernity. Quite possibly they are just making sure the productivity losses aren't too bad before they outsource it somewhere cheaper. There's a risk that by insisting there's no benefit to being in the office you write your own P45.

Well they tried this as our place and almost everyone handed in their notice so they changed their mind. Bit unfair in our case that they were pushing lower hands back in and leaving the higher ones at home too. But it requires banding together and some like the office.

Maybe see if there are any fully remote roles or apply for flexible working?

Yeah- I feel it has to come from the top. BIL works for a large bank and they basically led with "all managing directors and executive directors need to be in 4 days a week" and that led to the staff then realising that if your manager is there, it likely benefits you to be there to otherwise it will be like "who are they?" at bonus time. But not reasonable to expect more junior staff to be in and senior staff not.

It does suit a lot of people to work from home. But it cannot be regarded as an employment right unless it is written into a persons contract. I don't see why people can't understand that.

Op, is it a large bank you work for? Just wondering, as I do, and they’ve announced today two days a week back to the office and no compressed working hours, ie, no 4 day weeks etc. i can’t see the bank backing down on this, and feel pretty sure they’ll take the hard line, as they can’t allow some to wfh full time, but then demand others come in, especially with child care issues as there are already unhappy employees who feel the bank are giving too much to flexibility to people with kids, when those without children feel their wish for flexibility should also be considered.

my team works flexibly so I’ve had to start an hour commute to a different base 2 days a week with 2 days at my local office 5 minutes away and one day at home. I never wanted a long commute and moved away from London to avoid it so it’s frustrating but I’m managing a team and if I want to see them I need to be there. There’s something about seeing people face to face that’s different so I can understand companies wanting this. I think it’s rather narrow to say there’s no benefit. That said WFH can be effective. I plan to do less long commutes in the winter once I’ve built those relationships up but I’ll still do some. Me being in the office is for visibility and is right for the team. I get less physical work done but the team feeling like a team is important. Could you change hours to do longer days at home so office days aren’t full days?

Same with us. 3 days a week if you're full time. Unless you're the manager apparently who's barely ever there

i don't mind. I actually finish way earlier on my office days than my WFH days. It is harder to juggle school pick ups though. And no it's not what I was doing pre-pandemic because it's a different job for a different organisation. But I always suspected it would happen.

How many hours do you do a week in total? Could you do shorter days in the office and longer from home or a split day so 9-2 in office, 3-7 with kids then an evening working at home once a week? One week longer, one week shorter etc?

I think you’re more likely to get what you want if you come up with some suggestions.

If you’ve been doing it since Covid you would probably be able to argue it’s ‘custom and practice’. However this isn’t guaranteed to be successful and it would need real challenge.

Agree with pp make a flexible working request outlining the lack of requirement for you to be in the office.

If rejected you could maybe request some other flexibility. such as on the two days you need to be in, you work shorter days but make the hours up on other days. Or just come in one day a week.

It changed for a bit and now it’s reverting back again. Two days out of five in the office is my idea of heaven.

Well, even if I would be WFH all the time, I still would be required to have childcare if a child would be below secondary school age/Y6 if I can prove it works.

So, no nipping off to drop off/collect each day. During Covid you could definitely see a difference in people being available for calls from 2.30 pm onwards. Acceptable when there were issues with after school provisions, but not in 2023.

This absolutely!

Have you looked into before or after school clubs or child minders in the area that you live? Or are you friends with any other parents that could help you out?
What would you do if later on they look to increase the office based days further?