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Original poster

Forced return to office - anyone else?

497 replies

Flexipecs · 19/07/2023 21:27

My work has announced we’re all being forced back into the office two days a week. I’m a sole parent of primary school aged children (no help from ex). If I’m forced to go into the office I’ll have to reduce my working hours and I’ll be financially worse off.

I’m going to contact my union but has anyone else had this problem and did you successfully challenge it?

There’s zero benefit to me being in the office. My stats and performance are high. I actually think I’m more productive at home because I’m not being distracted so often. I’ve worked for the company for a very long time and I’m really disappointed at this decision (to put it mildly).

OP posts:
GillianMcQueef · 21/07/2023 17:56

DH's company said at the end of 2020 that nobody would ever be expected to go back to the office unless they wanted to. It was unveiled as a 'new way of working' and much fanfare was made of the fact they were a forward thinking employer determined to put their staff's work/life balance at the forefront of everything they did, etc. They took on hundreds of new staff, all of whom were told that WFH was the norm and office based working was a thing of the past - it was in the job adverts. There was even a piece on the local news about it.

People bought pets, had babies, even bought houses because they were saving so much time and money by not commuting. DH saves in the region of £100pm and over three hours a day.

Productivity has been sky high and on the days people voluntarily plan to go into the office for a catch up or a bit of training (maybe once or twice a month), they look forward to going in and it's lovely. Most people actually work longer hours from home - DH finishes at 7 but sometimes works until 8 or later, whereas in the past they all left at 7 on the dot because they had a long commute ahead and trains to catch.

Suddenly, just his week and out of nowhere, they've been told that from December they have to be in the office four days a week. Even those who worked from home prior to the pandemic, and those who have started since WFH was the norm (and have been contracted to WFH). I can't stress how definite they were that WFH was here to stay.

The CoL crisis means that £100 a month for travel will absolutely cripple us . We didn't have the heating on at all last winter apart from an hour on two or three days when it was unbearable so I don't know how many more corners we can cut. And of course, this will begin in December just as it starts to get really cold.

There are people who have started work there who live 40 or 50 miles away and applied for the job because it was remote working. They're now faced with making themselves voluntarily unemployed and unable to claim benefits or somehow commuting a round trip of up to 100 miles a day.

It's all very well to say well what did you do before the pandemic? But when your employer is absolutely adamant that WFH is here to stay, and people change their commitments or start jobs on that understanding, well, that's not on.

GillianMcQueef · 21/07/2023 18:00

julieh1968 · 21/07/2023 16:18

Just a thought but would those who enjoy the benefits of WFH be willing to accept a pay cut? They are saving not only time but also money in not paying for a commute or potentially childcare that they had to pay for pre covid.
Those who cannot WFH due to their job are not receiving bigger pay rises or additional annual leave to put them on a par.

Why should anyone be paid less for doing the same work?

Would you ask the same question of someone who lives next door to their office and has practically no commute time or costs?

Motnight · 21/07/2023 18:04

GillianMcQueef · 21/07/2023 17:56

DH's company said at the end of 2020 that nobody would ever be expected to go back to the office unless they wanted to. It was unveiled as a 'new way of working' and much fanfare was made of the fact they were a forward thinking employer determined to put their staff's work/life balance at the forefront of everything they did, etc. They took on hundreds of new staff, all of whom were told that WFH was the norm and office based working was a thing of the past - it was in the job adverts. There was even a piece on the local news about it.

People bought pets, had babies, even bought houses because they were saving so much time and money by not commuting. DH saves in the region of £100pm and over three hours a day.

Productivity has been sky high and on the days people voluntarily plan to go into the office for a catch up or a bit of training (maybe once or twice a month), they look forward to going in and it's lovely. Most people actually work longer hours from home - DH finishes at 7 but sometimes works until 8 or later, whereas in the past they all left at 7 on the dot because they had a long commute ahead and trains to catch.

Suddenly, just his week and out of nowhere, they've been told that from December they have to be in the office four days a week. Even those who worked from home prior to the pandemic, and those who have started since WFH was the norm (and have been contracted to WFH). I can't stress how definite they were that WFH was here to stay.

The CoL crisis means that £100 a month for travel will absolutely cripple us . We didn't have the heating on at all last winter apart from an hour on two or three days when it was unbearable so I don't know how many more corners we can cut. And of course, this will begin in December just as it starts to get really cold.

There are people who have started work there who live 40 or 50 miles away and applied for the job because it was remote working. They're now faced with making themselves voluntarily unemployed and unable to claim benefits or somehow commuting a round trip of up to 100 miles a day.

It's all very well to say well what did you do before the pandemic? But when your employer is absolutely adamant that WFH is here to stay, and people change their commitments or start jobs on that understanding, well, that's not on.

What do peoples' contracts say?

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CM1897 · 21/07/2023 18:10

My office moved to home working for the pandemic. Now we have to attend the office 4 days a month. If anyone has any extenuating circumstances that mean they can’t go into the office these are taking into consideration.

I personally think everyone should have to go in at least once every two weeks though, just for team moral and personal mental well-being, and to feel part of the team.

Maybe you can suggest you’ll return to the office after the school holidays?

toobusymummy · 21/07/2023 18:11

Are you just benefitting from not having to commute or has working from home meant that you've not needed to sort out wraparound care? I totally sympathise with you, so many people have got used to working from home that its really difficult when asked to go back to the working pattern they were employed to do - that's not a dig - its just that when you took on the job, there was an agreement in the way you expected to do that job on both sides and whilst a lot of employers (yours included by the sounds of it) have embraced the work-life benefits of having their staff WFH part of the time, they also do actually need you to be office based the rest of the time. Let me give you an example of why this is - you say you've worked for the same company for years and have high productivity rates, so you're basically an experienced and valued staff member - do you remember how you learned to do that job in the first place? it would have been one on one training from a similarly experienced member of staff and having those around you to ask for help and 'how do you do this/where do I find that' questions are basically how most people learn to actually do the nuts and bolts of the job. Now fast forward to a world where everyone works from home - how are new staff trained? who's sat next to them to ask a quick question from or learn all those lovely 'its not in the manual but if you do it this way' tips? THIS is why employers are having to ask staff to do at least part of their work week in the office - yes there are staff who have increased 'productivity' from WFH but the honest truth (as with most things) is that the majority have thoroughly taken the mickey! Let my put this to you - I hear so many people say 'I work from home so its no problem to look after my kids' (or in one case I work from home so have been able to avoid getting a carer in for Dad). Whilst as a human being I get where you're coming from, would you take these people into the shop or office with you during 'paid' hours? Maybe as an occasional emergency measure but not on the regular - so your WFH arrangements shouldn't include having kids at home during paid hours either - if you're relying on this to make ends meet then you need to have an honest conversation with your employer so they can plan accordingly. I am so sorry you're struggling, I wish WFH was the solution but I'll be honest and say I've been in on meetings where the possibility that people who are making a big fuss about returning to the office are replaced for breach of contract, so you need to be really careful that your employer feels your value to them is as much as you think it is.

CM1897 · 21/07/2023 18:13

Youcancallmeirrelevant · 19/07/2023 21:33

This!

OP what did you do before WFH/covid etc for childcare? I don't understand why people get so angry about being asked to work from an office when that was always the original job 🤦🏼‍♀️

Show quote history

Maybe op worked part time before the pandemic because of childcare, and will have to return to part time if they have to go back into the office?

SpainToday · 21/07/2023 18:17

QueueEtwo · 21/07/2023 17:13

I go in 2 days usually, 3 at the moment because I have a new member of staff!

I am definitely more productive at home, no doubt about it.
I get easily distracted now at work, spend more time chatting & going for coffees & fetching lunch etc etc but 🤷‍♀️ so be it!

I cherish my WFH days even more now though! I rolled out of bed this morning & walked the 10 steps to the bedroom next door! Love the WFH commute! 🤣

I could have written this! On my 2 office days, it’s a bit too tempting to chat all day …..

GnomeDePlume · 21/07/2023 18:23

I wish I could say it made me a more productive employee but it didn’t. I would be working and out the corner of my eye spot the laundry basket that’s been waiting to go in the machine, and think I’ll just stick it in. Then notice the machine had finished, think I’ll just stick it in the dryer, and while doing that notice the last lot needs to be taken out and folded. I’ll do that quickly it’ll take 2 minutes. And so on. Plus there’s nobody to notice phone use.

This reminds me of a line manager who decided that because she couldnt concentrate with music playing that nobody could and banned her team from wearing headphones even though every other team was allowed to wear headphones in the same open plan office.

Not all of us who normally WFH are running the hoover round/doing laundry/minding children. Some of us just crack on with our work.

Misspinkdiditinthelibrary · 21/07/2023 18:24

I haven't RTFT but you need to check your contract OP and take advice from your Trade Union rep

QueueEtwo · 21/07/2023 18:28

I wish people would read the bloody thread before coming on with their sanctimonious 'what's changed' comments! 🙄

She's explained what's changed, and about the school runs!

It's so annoying!

Sweetashunni · 21/07/2023 18:37

lieselotte · 21/07/2023 17:06

I can also acknowledge it’s worse for industry as a whole. Nobody is paying for travel fares, for work clothes, for work lunches and coffees, after work drinks at local pubs are bars. People will say ‘but that’s saving us money’ but it isn’t really, the only way to get our economy again is to put money into it and that doesn’t just stand for the government it means us spending

I take a packed lunch and we have free coffee so I am not spending any money other than on the train fare. I was in London on Tuesday evening and there were millions of people outside bars and pubs even with the fairly limited office hours people are doing these days. I guess Tuesday is also the busiest office day.

And if people are working locally they can spend money locally and money goes into the economy in other ways.

Things change, people have to adapt. Including commercial property and coffee bar owners.

But they don’t. People are just hiding away at home getting Asda deliveries.

thelionthewitchtheaudacityofTHISbitch · 21/07/2023 18:37

MrsMarieMopps · 19/07/2023 21:52

The trouble with people meeting individual workloads at home is that they're not seeing the bigger picture, I generally work in the office and the amount of urgent/ fire fighting type work that comes to me as I'm physically in rather than the WFH brigade.

I work in a school where wfh is not normal practice, even for support staff. My colleague has been able on several occasions to work from overseas. Like you I picked up all the urgent, fire fighting stuff as I knew it was important for her to see her family after COVID. She's never recognised that. But I recently asked for parental leave - my boss's first reaction was to want to discuss my request with my colleague to see the impact to her. I explained very clearly about the impact her now 8 weeks of working from overseas had on my work load. He hadnt even considered that. This time round - internet issues all week. The workload of Fire fighting in a work place is often very hidden. I've now had my parental leave - just lovely!

azlazee1 · 21/07/2023 18:45

Forced is a strange way of looking at it. You work for a company, the company sets the location and rules. If this doesn't work for you, perhaps you should seek another job? Hope you can work it out.

Dibbydoos · 21/07/2023 18:47

Talk to your employer about core hours in the office ie you're in between 10am and 2pm 2 days a week. That might work.

But reality is employers are increasing time back in the office cos layabouts are flaunting getting tgeir house/home sick and span on paid time and many people run more than one job at once!

Sunsetmom · 21/07/2023 18:48

What did u do before covid? Did u WFH? I get the frustrations but it’s about the needs of the business not your personal needs!

JLou08 · 21/07/2023 18:53

Check the flexible working policy and make a request. Every parent has the right to request flexible working and by law the company need to consider it. Make it clear in your request that you have been productive at home and do not believe a return to the office would benefit the company.

GnomeDePlume · 21/07/2023 19:02

I've been in on meetings where the possibility that people who are making a big fuss about returning to the office are replaced for breach of contract,

Given that many people have continued to WFH for a long time since the requirement to stay home ended it will be interesting to see if this gets tested in an industrial tribunal. At some point does WFH become the normal place of work? A requirement to go into the office then becomes a change to the contract.

As time goes on more people have changed jobs since lock-down started so may have never regularly gone into their official place of work.

Ohgollymolly · 21/07/2023 19:18

I can only speak based on our business, but we’ve had our HR company look in to it and we’re perfectly within our rights to get our WFH employees back in to the office now.

Don’t whinge to your union, if the business is asking you back in to the office then you can’t really argue can you? They’re the ones paying your wages. They can find another 100 other people like you to do that job who will happily go in.

LiveLoveLifeForever · 21/07/2023 19:18

I think we might work for the same company. I’m lucky though as we’re only going in once a week but have done for a year now whereas a lot of people are only starting in Sept so do have some catching up to do!! I have to say my productivity is about 50% when I’m in but I look forward to catching up with people I’ve worked with for over 25 years. If you’ve not been in yet then it might surprise you that you do like it but I wouldn’t want to do more than once a week. Hope you can work something out.

Mikimoto · 21/07/2023 19:22

So..."person has to do what they signed up for on their contract" shocker?

Iolani · 21/07/2023 19:25

Our staff worked from home during the pandemic and tbh it was a nightmare with zoom meetings etc But as no one had a choice with kids not at school we rearranged meetings to allow for their kids.
Our kids were older teenagers so not an issue, they had lots of school stuff to be getting on with.
However, when schools went back and everything was getting back to normal we no longer had very early or late meetings with SAH parents as our clients didn’t like it, contractors etc weren’t around late and so those that continued to WFH struggled.
Plus we struggled to get hold of them when they should have been at their desk.

It cam to a head when I noticed staff were unable to access drawings / information etc when they were on the phone….why….because they weren’t at their desk. They were at swimming classes, pickups, shopping and so on.
As architects with projects on site it wasn’t good enough not being around to deal with problems happening on site because staff are simply not there.

If they were at their desk during contracted hours actually working we would have continued allowing WFH, but they weren’t. So we stopped.
If you’re looking after kids, you’re not working.

Henhenb · 21/07/2023 19:30

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Nogg · 21/07/2023 19:39

Ohgollymolly · 21/07/2023 19:18

I can only speak based on our business, but we’ve had our HR company look in to it and we’re perfectly within our rights to get our WFH employees back in to the office now.

Don’t whinge to your union, if the business is asking you back in to the office then you can’t really argue can you? They’re the ones paying your wages. They can find another 100 other people like you to do that job who will happily go in.

This is not really true in all jobs is it though.
if you are senior and highly skilled you may be in very short supply

hope all the smug suck it up management types on here get replaced by AI bots in the near future

Mummarunner4 · 21/07/2023 19:40

100%! How can people refer to a ‘norm’ that was 3 years ago?! Where we’re at now is the new norm and for a lot of people Wfh has changed their lives completely and for the better. Hate that people are being forced back to offices just to show bums on seats.